buying a piano in adelaide

[kevin69]

So, after playing my kids keyboard for 18 months, i've decided that i'm commited enough to buy a piano. I'm also moving house next month so i'm not looking at an immediate purchase, but in a month or twos time.

I like to play jazz more than classical music, and i'd give Brad Mehldau: Live in Tokyo as an example of the kind of sound and music that i aspire to. I have no strong ideas abou the kind of touch i am looking for, since so far i've only played on an unweighted keyboard (whose sound quality can best be described by the fact the keys light up).

In Adelaide, the music retail scene is nowhere near as competitive as in the uk. New,  there are kawai, yamaha, boston, essex, steinway, toyo and lipp and sohn brands. Used, there are many yamahas and alex steinbachs, and many anonymous uprights. There are very few grands available used.

So far, i've played many used yamaha u1s and u3s, mostly from the 1980s but while they were pleasant enough, none really inspired me (prices $4k to $7k). The touch generally felt fine to me. Some keys felt like they had a lot of wobble from side to side. Is this looseness normal? It felt very unnerving and insecure to play on.

The lipp and sohn and toyo pianos were a step down in price from the yamahas, and sounded it.

The yamaha yus5 was the first piano that really caught my ear. The keys felt very well balanced, the bass sounded full and solid, while the treble sounded clear and sparkling. At $13k
this was more than i'd intended to spend, but not unaffordable.

Next up, i listened to the kawai uprights. The touch generally felt much heavier than yamahas. Sonically, i couldn't hear that much difference between the different models (k3, k5, k500) which surprised me a little. I prefered the yamaha sound to the kawai. The kawais seemed softer, and the treble seemed to lack the clarity that i liked in the yamahas.

Since i was in the shops anyway, i also listened to the grand. Starting with the 1.5m baby grands, the action felt different to the uprights but neither better nor worse. The lipp and sohn and kawai baby grands didn't sound much different to the larger kawai uprights to my ears apart from sounding louder.

Next up, a used yamaha c2 from 1996 ($15k). This was a revelation: the yamaha sound that i liked in the upright yus5 but with a fuller, richer, more complex bass to go with it. This was the first grand to really convince me that a grand would sound better than an equivalently priced upright. The c2 may be a bit big for the room i have in mind though, or perhaps a bit small for a grand (1.73m)

Listening to the larger kawai rx2h ($24k) up to a kawai shigeru sk6 ($105k) the larger pianos certainly sound impressive, but i just wasn't inspired by the kawai sound.

A mistake i made was not to take any music with me to play. I don't know enough pieces from memory to really try out an instrument properly. The stress of a relatively public performance meant i was only playing very hesitantly and not very well. Taking the music with me would help my confidence which may make me feel differently about some of the pianos.

But at the end of round one, the yamaha (used) c2 and (new) yus5 are leading the field, but both are double my original budget.

I haven't listened the the steinway school (steinway/boston/essex) but the shop that sells them only opens by arrangement, and i get the impression that i'll be paying a lot for the name on the fallboard. Is this unfair?

[hfmadopter]

The larger frame, larger harp and longer strings of the larger pianos has caught your attention then, as well it should ! In deed the whole range actually when you get into them will have nicer complexity, not just the bass. The fact that you are liking the Yamaha sound for jazz is not surprising, jazz lends itself to a bit brighter sound. However most any piano can be voiced. Actually, the C2 makes perfect sense to me, the RX2 or more so an RX3 may also be able to be voiced to your liking.. Any of these should be able to be properly voiced to your liking ,though in their natural state the RX series probably has a bit warmer tone than Yamaha has in their natural state.. Look for a piano with the action and overall feel that makes you want to play it. That is the piano you want to own. If that means stretching the budget a little to get what really plays to your heart, so be it. At least it won't be the wrong instrument.

[indianajo]

Well definitely take your sheet music next time you go.  I auditioned my Sohmer in 1981 with malaguena, it goes from one end of the keyboard to the other and I played it about my third or fourth study year, it is not that hard. It also has soft and loud parts.    
I find the sound of the Yamaha and Steinway (post 1981) consoles and studios to be boring.  I like a mid seventies Kawai studio they had at church, but that was probably produced in N Carolina and you wouldn't have the same piano in Australia.  The 1981 Steinway studio I played was really heavy besides sounding boring, which is good for training the fingers to play a heavy grand, but not for me with light duty hands that performs in churches with uprights.  Boston, I've read the name adds a $1000 which is probably not reflected in its superiority.  
I like the sound of  Yamaha and Kawai grands I've heard in churches, but there is no way one would fit in my house.  
My favorite sounding used console pianos are fifties Baldwin Acrosonics. Other fifties brands I like are Sohmer, Hamilton,  Wurlitzer, chickering, mason & hamlin,  I don't like Kimball Winter and Betsy Ross.  
I've never felt keys to wobble except on beater uprights from before WWII in Sunday School assembly rooms.  Stay away from anything like that. Are you sure your fingers aren't slipping on the keys?  
Actually, I don't know the Australian situation, but I'd say your mind is open enough, you should cruise the charity resale shops for six months.  There is a very nice pre-depression Howard upright at Goodwill last week for $75, and there was a nice brand I forgot  last year at Salvation Army that went for $100 that was also a pre-depression upright.  Neither brand survived the depression.  Lots of pre-depression pianos were built as kits from wholesalers, so the brand does not correlate to the high quality sometimes (and vice versa).  IMHO, stay away from former player pianos, these are uniformly undistinguished in sound.  
Beater pianos, they won't be in tune.  You evaluate the tone by finding a bass, 2 string, and 3 string note that are in tune with themselves.  Else damp two out  of tune string with your finger.  
Inspect visually for broken soundboard, bent hammer shafts, felts scooped in the middle by too much use, missing parts, spliced strings.  (I bought a 41 Steinway with one spliced string, it was worth the cost of repair). Inspect for failing glue joints on the clevises, this could be very expensive.   Ensure every  note comes up to rest and doesn't stick down. Personally I wouldn't worry about missing ivory key tops, plastic and glue are cheap. Some people with sweaty hands find ivory to be better than smooth plastic.   Neither do ragged ivory key front edges bother me, I've never been cut by a Sunday School beater.  Another non-problem is broken leather straps on the return mechanism.  A bit of polyester shirt material with two awl holes works better than original leather.  I personally am not worried by pedal mechanism broken by amateur movers, a bit of all-thread rod and a bit of steel bar can totally replace these.  but make sure the dampers lift and set down evenly controlled by the upper mechanism. 
Play a note as fast as possible with two hands.  Will the action keep up with you?  Fast pianos are keepers, I don't care if the name is forgotten.  
Play as softly as possible.  Do all the notes sound consistenly and evenly? Many pianos fail this test.  Play very loudly. Do any hammers double strike (and need pivot repair?).  
I'm trying to justify moving the Howard out to my trailer in the country, but the sound is too good. I already have two great sounding pianos.  I was looking for a honky tonk sound for my third piano, to play Scott Joplin and Fats Waller on.  You, OTOH, would probably be quite pleased with this 192? Howard. Pity it is 10000 miles away.  
Happy hunting.