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Topic: Technical Exercises: How to get the most out of them  (Read 1919 times)

Offline chopinrabbitthing

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So before anyone begins the debate on whether these things are useful or not - I'm doing them. I'm currently working on Cramer/Bulow and Chopin studies.

How should I practise them to get the best results possible (as soon as possible)? I was told by my teacher to really articulate (like bang my fingers into the keys) while playing them, playing each bar a number of times. It's working with Chopin's Etude Op 10 no 1, I must say.

How did you guys do it?
Beethoven - Piano Concerto No.2, Piano Sonata Op 57
Chopin - Ballade Op 23
Liszt- Hungarian Rhapsody No.14
Ravel - Pavane Pour une Infante Défunte
Cramer/Bulow,Chopin Etudes
Chamber music

Offline m1469

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Re: Technical Exercises: How to get the most out of them
Reply #1 on: April 14, 2014, 09:26:07 PM
Make a list of any aspect of music that you would like to learn about or practice, whether it's about the actual physical movements, whether it's musical, or whether it's anything else under the sun that is personal to you.  Systematically explore these exercises to see if they help with a particular aspect on your list.  You can either take a particular item(s) from your list and try to find it in each exercise, or take each exercise and find which items on your list it helps you with (or brings to your attention anew).  Make a note or keep a journal of which ones help you with what.

If you do not already know how to make a list, sit at a desk away from the piano with enough time allotted to hear your own mind speak and reason all the way through a particular line of thinking.  Begin writing ideas down without judgement - your actual exploration of exercises can be a time of trial and error, and you can add to the list or cross items off as needed.  But one way or another, give yourself time to think and plan.  If you really cannot find something to write down, you may find that you'd like to read at least a portion of a book (or watch a YouTube, or read the forum here) to get some ideas, before you go to the piano.
"The greatest thing in this world is not so much where we are, but in what direction we are moving"  ~Oliver Wendell Holmes

Offline faulty_damper

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Re: Technical Exercises: How to get the most out of them
Reply #2 on: April 15, 2014, 07:24:31 AM
You find the best combination of movements that:
1) uses the minimum of muscular strain
2) effective for achieving the desired musical sound
3) is easiest of all possible combination of movements

That's how you can get the most out of exercises.  BTW, the finger articulation practice is NOT the best movement for the Chopin Op.10-1.  If your wrist isn't high as you play the arpeggios, you're doing it wrong.

Offline chopinrabbitthing

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Re: Technical Exercises: How to get the most out of them
Reply #3 on: April 15, 2014, 08:26:25 AM
Make a list of any aspect of music that you would like to learn about or practice, whether it's about the actual physical movements, whether it's musical, or whether it's anything else under the sun that is personal to you.  Systematically explore these exercises to see if they help with a particular aspect on your list.  You can either take a particular item(s) from your list and try to find it in each exercise, or take each exercise and find which items on your list it helps you with (or brings to your attention anew).  Make a note or keep a journal of which ones help you with what.

If you do not already know how to make a list, sit at a desk away from the piano with enough time allotted to hear your own mind speak and reason all the way through a particular line of thinking.  Begin writing ideas down without judgement - your actual exploration of exercises can be a time of trial and error, and you can add to the list or cross items off as needed.  But one way or another, give yourself time to think and plan.  If you really cannot find something to write down, you may find that you'd like to read at least a portion of a book (or watch a YouTube, or read the forum here) to get some ideas, before you go to the piano.


Thanks, I'll give that a try.
Beethoven - Piano Concerto No.2, Piano Sonata Op 57
Chopin - Ballade Op 23
Liszt- Hungarian Rhapsody No.14
Ravel - Pavane Pour une Infante Défunte
Cramer/Bulow,Chopin Etudes
Chamber music

Offline chopinrabbitthing

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Re: Technical Exercises: How to get the most out of them
Reply #4 on: April 15, 2014, 08:27:40 AM
BTW, the finger articulation practice is NOT the best movement for the Chopin Op.10-1.  If your wrist isn't high as you play the arpeggios, you're doing it wrong.

Thanks! I do a lot of wrist movement and keep it high for this Etude since my hand isn't big enough anyway.
Beethoven - Piano Concerto No.2, Piano Sonata Op 57
Chopin - Ballade Op 23
Liszt- Hungarian Rhapsody No.14
Ravel - Pavane Pour une Infante Défunte
Cramer/Bulow,Chopin Etudes
Chamber music

theholygideons

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Re: Technical Exercises: How to get the most out of them
Reply #5 on: April 15, 2014, 09:17:19 AM
Thanks! I do a lot of wrist movement and keep it high for this Etude since my hand isn't big enough anyway.
You don't want to force your wrist to be high, that is just asking for trouble. Experiment with different heights to find the one that's most comfortable for you. You don't want extra tension from your wrist being high when it doesn't need to be. The height only comes from the illusion that a fluid wrist gives.

Offline chopinrabbitthing

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Re: Technical Exercises: How to get the most out of them
Reply #6 on: April 15, 2014, 10:51:18 AM
You don't want to force your wrist to be high, that is just asking for trouble. Experiment with different heights to find the one that's most comfortable for you. You don't want extra tension from your wrist being high when it doesn't need to be. The height only comes from the illusion that a fluid wrist gives.

I wouldn't really call it high in a way, it's more that my wrist have a lot of movement to facilitate my fingers really playing the keys, in a comfortable way. Would that be okay?
Beethoven - Piano Concerto No.2, Piano Sonata Op 57
Chopin - Ballade Op 23
Liszt- Hungarian Rhapsody No.14
Ravel - Pavane Pour une Infante Défunte
Cramer/Bulow,Chopin Etudes
Chamber music

Offline gyzzzmo

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Re: Technical Exercises: How to get the most out of them
Reply #7 on: April 15, 2014, 12:14:14 PM
Try to be mindfull of every note and dont rush it. If you have issues wth certain passages, you can use technical etudes focussed on that type of movement.
1+1=11

Offline faulty_damper

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Re: Technical Exercises: How to get the most out of them
Reply #8 on: April 15, 2014, 12:21:40 PM
I wouldn't really call it high in a way, it's more that my wrist have a lot of movement to facilitate my fingers really playing the keys, in a comfortable way. Would that be okay?

The high wrist is used because it facilitates *makes easy* the arpeggios and minimizes finger movement.  At the indicated speed, you can't articulate the fingers fast enough so you must articulate the wrist + forearm rotation.  If you choose only to articulate the fingers, you'll hit the speed wall as well as make some large jumps very clunky.  There's a video on YT of Louis Lortie performing this study using this most efficient technique.  His wrists are high, no indication of strain, and sounds very good.  That's how you practice to make the most of any playing, exercise or music.

Offline chopinrabbitthing

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Re: Technical Exercises: How to get the most out of them
Reply #9 on: April 21, 2014, 06:54:10 PM
Thanks, I'll give your suggestions a try
Beethoven - Piano Concerto No.2, Piano Sonata Op 57
Chopin - Ballade Op 23
Liszt- Hungarian Rhapsody No.14
Ravel - Pavane Pour une Infante Défunte
Cramer/Bulow,Chopin Etudes
Chamber music
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