Playing eight triplets against sixteenth notes,

[mojtas]

I'm trying to learn Etude op. 25 no. 11 by Chopin (Winter Wind) and in bar 10 I think you're supposed to play eigth triplets against sixtenth notes. Does anybody here know a good way to practise this?
I may be wrong because my note reading really sucks, and I won't see my teacher in a long while :S

[j_menz]

The sixteenth notes are also half-triplets, so they line up. Six sixteenth notes against 3 Eighth notes.

If you're confused reading this bit, you probably shouldn't be tackling this piece.

There are polyrhythms in bars 5 and 7 which you've apparently missed, and a heap of them later on in the coda. This is not the place to be learning them - it's got enough difficulties already.

[mojtas]

Thank you!I was wrong I suppose... I don't think it's too difficult, I'm just terrible at reading music  Could you tell me where the polyrhythm is in bar 5 and 7?

[mjames]

Please listen to J it has nothing to do with reading music. If you're having trouble with 4 against 3 rhythms you shouldn't be playing this, and judging by your question this is the first time youre encoutering it lol. Youll just end up frustraing yourself, trust me, ive been there. There are so many wonderful etudes out there that are much more accessible than this monster. How about giving moszkowski's petite etudes a try?

[mojtas]

No thats not it! I can play some polyrhythms. I actually got a stipendium for Fantasie Impromptu so it isn't a problem... 
M problem is that I don't see where the polyrhythms are. Until now I have used the sheets like a guide to see where my hand should go and then listened for the rhythm, which isn't so practical at higher levels

[gyzzzmo]

There's only one place where the polyrhythm can be in 5 and 7, and you still dont see it?

I dont know why you're doing this piece, you're obviously not ready for it.

[mojtas]

If it's only in one place, then it's okey. Also, how do you learn new things if you don't learn a piece because if some few bars? 

[mjames]

This isn't the fantasie impromptu, and it's not just a few bars; there's actually a sh*t load of them in the coda(like J said). Also, "how do I play eight note triplets against sixteenth notes" and "I played the fantasie impromptu" don't go well together. Most of the entire piece is composed of 4 against 3 rhythms  

If you're going to be stubborn then go ahead, you'll soon (or later) find out that you're not ready for it. Have fun.

[mojtas]

Haha no I guess it sounds bad but last time I tried a difficult piece I eventually understood it, just have to be stubborn like you said! Maybe it's my way of learning
My note reading clearly needs some basic practice though :S

[j_menz]

Haha no I guess it sounds bad but last time I tried a difficult piece I eventually understood it, just have to be stubborn like you said! Maybe it's my way of learning
My note reading clearly needs some basic practice though :S

This is a piece designed to teach a number of things. It also assumes you already know a number of things. If you don't, it's desirable to learn them first, in other places and come back ready. You'll find it quicker in the end.

Also, your reading has to encompass reading rhythms as much as it does reading notes. Might I suggest a good start for this is to get a book of easy (yes, I know, but yes) jazz standards, or mixed pop song standards. It's rather fun, and a good way to learn to read rhythms.

[mojtas]

Yes you're right, I thought that was good too. So I'm sight reading simplified pop songs besides winter wind. I play it just because it's fun so I won't give up yet

[j_menz]

I play it just because it's fun so I won't give up yet

I'm not suggesting you give it up, merely that you lay the proper foundations for it. That way you'll actually get to play it sooner.

As a general principle, if you have difficulties with a particular aspect, it is best to isolate that aspect and work on it in a piece or two which otherwise is straightforward. That way you can focus on just that thing.  The problem with trying to learn a piece that has several such aspects going on at once is that the learning process is lowed exponentially.

There is also the risk that you will learn just to do the piece - not the generalised form of the technique - so next time you encounter it, rather than it being straightforward, you'll have to almost learn it from scratch again.

[mojtas]

Okay, thank you for the tip. The problem I had with this piece was only how to play the polyrhythm. The rest of the piece won't be a problem, so I think I am ready for this. Also I think the difficulty of Winter wind is overrated. It's mostly just lots of notes.
I just learned to play 3 against 4 so the main problem is solved