Cramer Etudes

[brogers70]

This is just a plug for Cramer's Etudes. My teacher gave me an old von Bulow edition of 50 Cramer Studies and they are great, much more interesting and musical than anything I found in Czerny. Each one works on some particular motion and generally progresses from simple instances of the motion to more complex ones. They're physically fun to play, and Cramer includes various musical games, quotations from Bach, imitations of Beethoven and Brahms. They're just studies and they won't replace working on real pieces, but if you want to do some studies to focus on particular motions or techniques, Cramer is great.

[awesom_o]

They're just studies and they won't replace working on real pieces, but

Studies are real pieces, and real pieces are studies!

But, yes, Cramer Etudes are incredible, and highly underrated!

[brogers70]

Well, I put that sentence in there because I figured, this being pianostreet, that if I didn't I'd provoke a rant on how you need real pieces to learn musicianship and shouldn't waste your time on studies. There's just no preempting it all.

[j_menz]

much more interesting and musical than anything I found in Czerny.

Perhaps you should look in Czerny's actual music - you'll find plenty of interest and musicality there.

[awesom_o]

Personally, I find many of Czerny's studies to be very musical indeed.... but I'm a huge fan of Czerny! Nothing against Cramer, however. Many of his studies are also quite beautiful.

[rmbarbosa]

But... why to play studies if you can play the same dificulties with real pieces of music? For example: the 3º mouvement of the moonlight of Beethoven is dificult? But you may play it, training it. Why loose your time with studies of harps to play it? You may play the harps of the sonata and doing so you learn harps and you have a very beautiful sonata studied...
THE ONLY STUDIES we must learn are Chopin Studies. Because they are real and beautiful Music.
And you have Bach. If you can play Bach you are able to play everything...

[awesom_o]

Are you suggesting that Rachmaninoff and Scriabin Etudes aren't real pieces of music? 

Cramer studies are wonderful! Chopin Etudes are of course fantastic, but they are too difficult for many students.

Bach was the greatest... but that doesn't take anything away from Cramer, or anyone else who wrote good studies!

[hmrichter]

But... why to play studies if you can play the same dificulties with real pieces of music? For example: the 3º mouvement of the moonlight of Beethoven is dificult? But you may play it, training it. Why loose your time with studies of harps to play it? You may play the harps of the sonata and doing so you learn harps and you have a very beautiful sonata studied...
THE ONLY STUDIES we must learn are Chopin Studies. Because they are real and beautiful Music.
And you have Bach. If you can play Bach you are able to play everything...

-Because studies improve those specific areas of technique you're lacking in. We do harps of exercises of the etudes (whatever the hell that means) because it improves that area of the sonata that would take much LONGER to improve with other repertoire.
Imagine, how Glenn Gould did his recordings. He did the best recordings of each individual section. Say he was having trouble with one technical challenge? He recorded JUST that section, as a direct way of dealing with it, instead of trying to record the piece every time for one little section. (He actually did that, by the way) And so, with studies and pieces. They're direct ways of dealing with specific problems, but instead of learning repertoire, that particular technical skill is improved greatly. Sure, you get one less piece or whatever, but you actually learn the piece you were trying to learn without injuring your hands.
Chopin studies are STUDIES. They improve a skill. They are also PIECES. They're a two in one, essentially, as most studies are.
Finding the balance between exercises (scales, arpeggios, chords, why doesn't anyone complain about them if we're going to complain about etudes? Oh, because they come up a lot in music. Oh wait, so do the etude techniques) and repertoire is key.
If you master Bach, you can play Bach. And things that take from Bach.