What is your hand size?

[cwjalex]

I always thought I had small hands and just looked up what the average hand size is.  The hand length is measured from the tip of your middle finger to the bottom of your palm and the hand width is...well the width of your hand.

Average Hand Length

Men - 7.44 inches (189 mm)
Women - 6.77 inches (172 mm)

Average Hand Width

Men - 3.30 inches (84 mm)
Women - 2.91 inches (74 mm)

I'm a guy and just measured my hands.  My hand length is 6 and 15/16 inches and my hand width is 3 and 1/4 inches which is slightly under average.  How about you guys?  POST YOUR HAND SIZE!

[outin]

How about you guys?  POST YOUR HAND SIZE!

Can I do it too?


Hand Length ~180 mm
Hand Width ~75 mm (you do mean palm width, right?)

When it comes to span, it's not only about the hand width, but how your thumb is situated, it's shape and how flexible it is...My hand size is ok, but the thumb reduces my proper span in the RH to a 7th.

[fleetfingers]

Where do I measure for the width??

Female - Length

6.25 inches

[amytsuda]

Hum. I guess my hands are not that small afterall, I have the size of average men, though I am female. But I agree that where thumb and pinky are situated, and I have very short thumb and pinky. So I can kind of grab 9th, and can get to 10th on the edge if I use my 4th finger (I have long middle three fingers). I thought everyone can easily grab 10th since most romantic repertoire always have 10th chord. I guess that's not that case?

[dima_76557]

POST YOUR HAND SIZE!

I don't know exactly what that is good for but here you are:

Length: 210 mm or about 8.3 inches (the palm itself to where the middle finger starts is 120 mm or about 4.7 inches)
Width: 105 mm or about 4.1 inches
(both hands equal)

Flexibility seems a lot more important to me. How much is your workable stretch between the fingers without tension elsewhere, for example, finger proportions (how long are the individual fingers), and as outin said: how is your thumb situated. Some people may be able to stretch c-f, for example, but are unable to take in Db-f, especially with other notes in between.

Where do I measure for the width??

Where the knuckle bridge is (so not where the fingers seem to start in the palm of the hand, but where the two creases are in the middle of the palm).

[kobethuy]

I don't currently have a ruler by my side... So:

Hand span: 11th, comfortable. 12th, !@#@%!#@.

P/S: my pinky and thumb can make a perfect 180 degree, probably help a lot when playing large intervals.

[dima_76557]

Hand span: 11th, comfortable. 12th, !@#@%!#@.

P/S: my pinky and thumb can make a perfect 180 degree, probably help a lot when playing large intervals.

A good span between pinky and thumb is nice (armdrop into a comfortable 12th with notes in between, for example), but there is not much opportunity in the piano literature to display blocked 11th & 12th intervals.

A good stretch between 2 and 5, though, is quite often assumed. Ideal seems to be a ninth.

[outin]

A good stretch between 2 and 5, though, is quite often assumed. Ideal seems to be a ninth.

I'll give up 

[dima_76557]

I'll give up  

No need to. I'm talking about the kind of repertoire that you may not even want to play. If you have that kind of stretch, you won't have to stretch at all in the pieces themselves, which is just convenient. Besides, there are always musical solutions around the problems.

[mhhudson15]

No need to. I'm talking about the kind of repertoire that you may not even want to play.

How do you know what type of repertoire he wants to play? Lots of classical pieces have large stretches, as I'm sure you know. As has been previously mentioned, it is extremely useful to be able to stretch for large intervals and chords.
And as for my hand size, I barely scratch a ninth...

[dima_76557]

How do you know what type of repertoire he wants to play?

Outin has written more than once about her likes and dislikes. There's lots of suitable repertoire for her hands. Should she stumble upon problems in this respect, I'll be more than happy to suggest ways around certain problems.

[outin]

Outin has written more than once about her likes and dislikes. There's lots of suitable repertoire for her hands. Should she stumble upon problems in this respect, I'll be more than happy to suggest ways around certain problems.

I do think it's good that I like Baroque and don't care for Rach  

But I do have to dismiss pieces Id like to play because there's so much to rework  

But it still seems huge for most females to be able to play over an octave with 2 and 5. I can just about do a 7th because my 2nd is long

My sincere thanks for the offer. So far I get tips from my teacher who has small hands and likes to play Rach...

[dima_76557]

But it still seems huge for most females to be able to play over an octave with 2 and 5. I can just about do a 7th because my 2nd is long

It's not that you have to really play a 9th with 2-5. It's more a principle that is meant to avoid injury. It's an assumed finger span to be able to play the music as written without hurting yourself, without really having to stretch your fingers while playing, much like a ballerina is expected to do the splits, although she will hardly use it in performance.

[outin]

It's not that you have to really play a 9th with 2-5. It's more a principle that is meant to avoid injury. It's an assumed finger span to be able to play the music as written without hurting yourself, without really having to stretch your fingers while playing, much like a ballerina is expected to do the splits, although she will hardly use it in performance.

I wish I could play without streching my fingers, but it seems I have to do that a lot. I have never hurt myself streching, but playing does not feel comfortable either.

[cwjalex]

a 9th between 2 and 5 seems insane to me.  my hand length is only slightly bigger than the average woman so i sympathize with you girls!  what motivated me to start this thread was another thread i started about a chord in rach's prelude in c sharp minor that is giving me trouble.  the left hand chord is F#, A, E, F# and the 2 and 5 stretch for me is just barely possible but extremely uncomfortable.  i bet for you with monster hands that can reach 11ths and 12ths this chord is easy grrrrrrr.

[dima_76557]

i bet for you with monster hands that can reach 11ths and 12ths this chord is easy grrrrrrr.

You may not believe this, but big hands do have their disadvantages too, you know. Depends on the kind of pieces you have to play. You, for example, could simply leave the top f# out in your LH of that one chord and problem solved since you can play the rest already and it won't be noticed too much in the general noise. But can you imagine what I have to go through to play "simple" passagework in Mozart or Scarlatti with nowhere to hide? It may take me 50 years or so to get that right because my hands were simply not made to do it.

[amytsuda]

I can do Octave with 2 and 5... not 9th. I guess that's why I like Mozart and Chopin!

[j_menz]

A good stretch between 2 and 5, though, is quite often assumed. Ideal seems to be a ninth.

I'm struggling to think of an instance where this is required. Perhaps you could provide an example.

[flashyfingers]

No need to. I'm talking about the kind of repertoire that you may not even want to play. If you have that kind of stretch, you won't have to stretch at all in the pieces themselves, which is just convenient. Besides, there are always musical solutions around the problems.

This is exactly why I think that I just don't have the hands to play an entire set of Liszt etudes. I used to think I was tall, and had big hands, but I figured out that I am most certainly not.

Anybody know if Martha Argerich ever played entire cycles of etudes, complete sets? Because I am about her height and hand size.
All I found was one set of the Chopin etudes.

Not that that makes her less of a pianist. In fact, I think she is smart for doing what she does best (um…everything?!) and with her own approach to performing music, not necessary like it is a horse race.

I have to assume and ask at the same time.

My hands are small I can reach 9ths and 10ths, but that is still small.

[dima_76557]

I'm struggling to think of an instance where this is required. Perhaps you could provide an example.

You won't be able to find it because there aren't any where you have to do it physically. The principle is simple ergonomics: it's good to have more than required so you will never be using your limit. Cortot thinks an octave is enough between 2-5. Actually, he has a table of all "ideal" stretches between all the fingers:

[outin]

You won't be able to find it because there aren't any where you have to do it physically. The principle is simple ergonomics: it's good to have more than required so you will never be using your limit. Cortot thinks an octave is enough between 2-5. Actually, he has a table of all "ideal" stretches between all the fingers:

Oh dear...maybe this explains why playing is so difficult for me physically. I can barely make a 3rd with 4-5 and it already requires me to turn my hand... I have this tight webbing between my fingers that doesn't seem to respond to any kind of streching exercises...I would need to use scissors to change that 

[j_menz]

You won't be able to find it because there aren't any where you have to do it physically. The principle is simple ergonomics: it's good to have more than required so you will never be using your limit.

Better still to learn to work with what you've got. That isn't going to change.

Cortot thinks an octave is enough between 2-5. Actually, he has a table of all "ideal" stretches between all the fingers:

Another one to file in my "Why the French shouldn't (be allowed to) philosophise" folder.

[dima_76557]

Better still to learn to work with what you've got. That isn't going to change.

Of course. We are talking about "ideals" here without making compromises to what is written as it is written. Of course there are technical and musical ways around this. The goal is: prevent injury, but avoid getting musically shallow results. There are many examples of very successful pianists with rather small hands but they worked diligently on their stretches anyway (Alicia de Laroccha, for example, did that to the extreme)

[kobethuy]

I found out that there is one misconception about hand span is that: Baroque music helps increase the span of your 2 and 5. However this is not entirely true. The span increase to some extend but the main change is in there strength. You can't hold them in place for too long if you are not accustomed to.

[dima_76557]

Oh dear...maybe this explains why playing is so difficult for me physically. I can barely make a 3rd with 4-5 and it already requires me to turn my hand... I have this tight webbing between my fingers that doesn't seem to respond to any kind of streching exercises...I would need to use scissors to change that  

Please have a look at the following 2 clips about 7/8 keyboard pianos and how they change people's lives:
Reduced-Size Keyboards Part 1 (the professor there has a very particular pronunciation of the word "piAnists". )
Reduced-Size Keyboards Part 2

So instead of blaming either Cortot or nature, or - worse even - denying the problem and coming up with methods of piano playing that produce superficial musical results, it would be best to address the problem seriously and force the dealers to produce and sell more of these.

[outin]

Please have a look at the following 2 clips about 7/8 keyboard pianos and how they change people's lives:
Reduced-Size Keyboards Part 1 (the professor there has a very particular pronunciation of the word "piAnists". )
Reduced-Size Keyboards Part 2

So instead of blaming either Cortot or nature, or - worse even - denying the problem and coming up with methods of piano playing that produce superficial musical results, it would be best to address the problem seriously and force the dealers to produce and sell more of these.

I already knew about these...It's my plan to get one of these keyboards after I first get my grand

[bernadette60614]

Enormous!  I can easily stretch an octave and fairly easily stretch to 12 notes.  I also wear a size 11 shoe.

What makes me self-conscious as a woman, makes me strangely proud as a pianist.

[amytsuda]

12 notes! You are one lucky woman!

[cwjalex]

Enormous!  I can easily stretch an octave and fairly easily stretch to 12 notes.  I also wear a size 11 shoe.

did you really say you can fairly easily stretch to 12 notes?  so you can "fairly easily" reach from C to the next octave's G "fairly easily" ?!  are you like 7 feet tall or something?

[didymos]

I have the opposite problem. My fingers are about an inch too long. Fine for the big stretches, but for most notes it's like trying to scramble eggs with a three-foot spatula.

Any cures for this, short of surgery?

[cwjalex]

I have the opposite problem. My fingers are about an inch too long. Fine for the big stretches, but for most notes it's like trying to scramble eggs with a three-foot spatula.

Any cures for this, short of surgery?

just out of curiosity what is the length of your fingers?  and what do u mean for most notes?  are there certain chords that are difficult to play or certain sequences?

[flashyfingers]

I don't think it matters what hand size you have. There are difficulties in playing both stretches and notes that are close together. No matter what size hands you have, you should have a difficulty toward one of those.

[dima_76557]

I don't think it matters what hand size you have. There are difficulties in playing both stretches and notes that are close together. No matter what size hands you have, you should have a difficulty toward one of those.

It's about proportions, I think, not about absolute size. Ideal would seem a broad hand palm with fingers that are not too long in comparison and that don't differ too much from each other in length, otherwise technical problems are bound to occur in any type of music. For small hands, flexibility is a must. For bigger hands - compactness of the palm.

[bernadette60614]

Yes, I have big hands and long fingers.  In fact, when it comes to hand and finger size I'm something of a genetic oddity.

And, this is not scientific, but I also weight lift and I think having overall body strength (including grip strength) makes it more possible to for me to do things which my hands than wouldn't be achievable if I wasn't so freaking strong!
 

[flashyfingers]

Yes, I have big hands and long fingers.  In fact, when it comes to hand and finger size I'm something of a genetic oddity.

And, this is not scientific, but I also weight lift and I think having overall body strength (including grip strength) makes it more possible to for me to do things which my hands than wouldn't be achievable if I wasn't so freaking strong!
 

Can we please see a pic? lol I also love to work out.

[amytsuda]

It's about proportions, I think, not about absolute size. Ideal would seem a broad hand palm with fingers that are not too long in comparison and that don't differ too much from each other in length, otherwise technical problems are bound to occur in any type of music. For small hands, flexibility is a must. For bigger hands - compactness of the palm.

You just explained why I have so many technical problems. Small hands with oddly long middle fingers with tiny thumbs and pinkies. I suffer from all these jumping around Octave chords. Can I ever fix my technical problems or I guess I just don't have hands for it?