The Right Age to Start Children?

[kjherlong]

I have a daughter who will turn four soon and a son who is 10 months old. I would like to put both of them in piano, at an appropriate age, of course. I, myself, began lessons when I was nine years old, and I believe that is a little too late. What is the right age, rather a good age, to start children in piano? My daughter has shown some interest, especially when I play. When I play, she wants to sit next to me and "tickle the ivories". Interestingly enough, my 10 month old son always crawls over to the piano every time I sit and play. He stands up and reaches for the keys. He's done that for two months now. Does anyone have good advice/information on a good age to start children in piano who seem to have an interest? Thanks!

-Kevin

[bronnestam]

If you by "start in piano" mean lessons in the traditional way, with a schedule, appointments, assignments for next week etcetera, etcetera, I would say: ABSOLUTELY NOT before the age of six, the very earliest.

Starting at the age of 9 is definitely not "a bit too late". To late for what??? As a pianist you learn and develop during your whole active career, and it is just a stupid myth that what you haven't learned before adolescence, you will never learn properly. It might be some truth when it comes to gymnastics, and also learning to speak a language without a slight accent, but it is NOT true for piano playing.

What you can never repair afterwards, though, is a lost childhood. Could piano lessons be harmful, then? Well, if they are directed by teachers and adults. Young children should guide themselves as much as possible, because every child is an individual and therefore everyone has their own individual path to follow. We have a ridiculous school system that destroys generation after generation by forcing every child into a certain pattern just because they are at a certain age - not considering any aspect about personal development, maturity, interests, personality ... And those children who are not reasonably "average" are called untalented, slow, even "disturbed" ...

OK, so this was a general remark, it was not about piano playing in particular. But it breaks my heart to see small children being "educated" because their parents truly believe that they earlier you start, the better you will become ...

So, if you children ask you for help and guidance, you should give them that. Of course you should let them be with you when you play, do sing-alongs, have fun together. Of course they should be allowed to explore the piano. But don't force anything on them.

That is my opinion. I am not a teacher, I am an engineer. But I am also a mother and a human being. I talk out of life experience. Take it or leave it.

[faa2010]

Hi,

It is nice that your children have shown curiosity in the instrument. The right word I think is curiosity, not interest.

There is no formal age to begin, what it could be important, is that children should be conscious first in what is music, the meaning of music and how to enjoy it. Having curiosity by the instrument and hearing the sounds it makes is good. Also in preschool they can learn it.

Singing and dancing are good options to start with, they are basic and they can teach two of the most important things in music: melody and rhythm. This is also done in preschool.

Also during the process, please don't expect the next:

- They can be future Mozarts.

- They like it (but in the end they are not really interested).


Your duty as parent, and possibly as a teacher, is just to introduce them to the piano and the music, if they still show genuine interest and want to continue will be their own choice in their lives. And if they grow to like it, they you can send them to music workshops or piano classes during summer, it is good by short periods.

Please don't do the mistake some parents do: being impatient, wanting to send them quickly to formal classes, not letting them enjoy their childhood as they should, turning the music into their enemy or in something to hate.

[michael_student]

I'm interested in this topic because I come from a musical family and I have a couple daughters I'm hoping will continue the tradition. 

My cousins earn their living as musicians (one plays keyboards in bands, another plays jazz piano, another is a session guitarist) and one of them started his son on drums at age 3.  A year later, his son practices at least an hour a day without anyone asking him to -- it's the first thing he wants to do when he wakes up.  I think he's inspired by seeing his dad onstage, practicing a lot, and giving lessons.

I have not stimulated the same interest in my daughters yet, and I think it's because I haven't been leading by example.  That's part of what's prodded me to start taking lessons myself, and of course practicing a lot.

[bronnestam]

My cousins earn their living as musicians (one plays keyboards in bands, another plays jazz piano, another is a session guitarist) and one of them started his son on drums at age 3.  A year later, his son practices at least an hour a day without anyone asking him to -- it's the first thing he wants to do when he wakes up.  I think he's inspired by seeing his dad onstage, practicing a lot, and giving lessons.

Well, I don't want to claim that every child who starts early will be ruined ... but there is an assumption, going all over our society, that the earlier you start, the better you will be. Or that children who work diligently already at the age of 5 are progidies and future superstars. There might be a few of them. But there are also those who lose their interest later on, or just reach their peak very early. And yet some other who start very late and become big stars as well - you can find all variations and the only conclusion you can draw from that is that it is a very individual thing.

But as long you do something out of your own free choice, and not because Mom and Dad want it, or because Teacher wants it, or because you simply lack other choices, you will probably do well.

Small children often love to do what Mom and Dad do. That does not, unfortunately, mean that they will follow in their parents' footsteps all the way. (I speak from my own bitter experience here.) My children are teens now and sometimes they are NOT easy to love ...

Yeah, of course you should encourage a little child who wants to play an instrument! Let them enjoy themselves! But again, it should be on their terms, not yours. They might have their very own ideas on what they want to do - just let them, as long as they don't harm themselves or anything else. And don't be sorry if they don't show "early interest", and do NOT blame yourself if you don't introduce them as early as possible.
Just never tell your children that they cannot do certain things, that they are not talented enough, that it is not appropriate for them etcetera. Noone is born a "failure", we all have our talents, interests and goals in life. So don't push your children away from the piano, telling them they are too young. But as faa2010 writes, don't interpret their curiosity as deep interest either. Children are curious and they want to explore things. They want to do what their parents do.
As a start ...

[michael_student]

Well, I don't want to claim that every child who starts early will be ruined

Oh yes, I agree with everything you wrote in both posts, in case it sounded otherwise. 

A few months ago we took our 4.5yo daughter to a lesson from my teacher who's a lot of fun with kids.  This was after preschool, at a time she's usually exhausted, so we planned to only stay for 15 minutes.  Unfortunately we got carried away and 15 minutes turned into nearly an hour.  She wasn't especially interested in going back, and we haven't asked her to.  I know I shouldn't push her, and in the meanwhile I should really work on creating a musical environment at home the way my cousins have.

[indianajo]

I started piano study age 8, with my mother one year, then a teacher after that. I took a lesson a week and was expected to practice 30 minutes a day.   I have a long attention span, I probably could have started earlier.
But what my parents did start me on age three, was a record player and a record collection.  they bought me CBC classical records that used full orchestral pieces, only there was a narrator that told a story as the piece went along. Tschaikovski was one favorite, that Sleeping Beauty record really scared me with the finger prick happening at the end of side one, and the sleeping part starting side two.   There wasn't as much media saturation in those days, and I was quite passionate about quality classical music from this age.  I had some of those "teddy bear picnic" type short records, and they just didn't seem as cool as the classical ones with the story.  I was allowed to tune the AM radio sometimes, and there wasn't anything there as cool as the classical records with stories, either.  
Kids like control, and I liked toy cars because my Dad drove a car, toy earthmovers and trains because I observed them in a coal mine across the road, I wanted a toy typewriter because Mother wrote letters on a typewriter.  I  would have enjoyed simple piano lessons with my Mother much earlier, because she played in public a little.  She took me on her bike (Dad made a seat for me on the front) to the elementary school where she played simple songs for the classes, and I was quite intrigued.  If she had showed me how to pick out on an instrument "early at the morning, down at the station" which was my favorite song, I would have really enjoyed that I'm sure.  I was quite tiny age 3-4 and couldn't really reach a real piano bench without a risk of falling, as I was quite clumsy with my large muscles and had wobbly balance. The floor was my home, I fell out of bed age three and a half as soon as I got out of the bars of the baby bed, and terrified myself.   I always had fine hand control, though. One of those little toy pianos, with the metal bars that make real music, sitting about a foot off the floor; I would have really enjoyed into one of those.  My nephew had one my Mother bought him, but he never had the passion about music that I and Mother did.  
Music to me is not a profession, but a hobby, and I don't see the competitive side of music lessons as being useful.  Reading and languages are much more the realm where kids should have an early start.  I didn't read before first grade, that was discouraged in those days, but my parents talked to me a lot and Mother read stories to me.  I probably knew 50000 words by the time I got to first grade (the parents couldn't afford kindergarten, it required tuition in those day) , I learned to read in about two weeks when phonics were explained to me, and had read all the train books in the first and second grade section of the library by Christmas, and was allowed to dive into the big kid books.   So I view Sesame Street as silly, but talking to the child and allowing him to participate in adult activities is a great practice.  Dad let me "help" him wash the car and build a barbeque pit out of river rocks, before I was five.  I loved those times.    Lots of families these days have a string band where the kids plunk away on miniature instruments over in the corner while the adults play real songs, and those kids are amazing performers by the time they are ten. You see them on KET-TV all the time.  Piano could be that sort of family practice too, I am sure. 

[hfmadopter]

I took a lesson a week and was expected to practice 30 minutes a day.   I have a long attention span, I probably could have started earlier.

This is actually a very good point, at 8 you were able to concentrate and keep attention and perhaps sooner you could have. And as an adult you have gone on to enjoy playing piano. I can't see pushing a kid who isn't ready in this way. A little push yes but not like you read about with these "special kids".

[1piano4joe]

Hi kjherlong,

Bastien makes a primer book for the young beginner written for five and six year olds.

Sheetmusicplus has 14 customer reviews of this book. One of them from Texas said, "Great Product. My son was playing song within minutes. And previously had shown little interest in the piano."

I think it is much more important to have the right kind of teacher for such young students as well as the right method. I feel very strongly that a positive experience with the right teacher and method could foster a genuine interest while a negative experience with the wrong teacher and/or method has a greater chance of turning a student off. If it's a drag why would they bother? If it's fun, happy times like an ice cream cone then what's not to like?

The Suzuki philosophy is, "Emphasis on playing from a very young age, typically starting formal instruction between the ages of 3 and 5 years old and sometimes beginning as early as two years of age." This quote is from Wikipedia.

I believe they do group activities that include hand clapping, singing, dancing, etc.

Just some food for thought, Joe.

P.S. Welcome to Pianostreet!

[Bob]

Pre-birth.  I'd go with that.

Otherwise, as early as possible with some kind of positive music experience.  Actually sitting down at the piano?  Whenever they can handle it, but the sooner the better, as long as they still enjoy it and aren't feeling forced.

[falala]

But as long you do something out of your own free choice, and not because Mom and Dad want it, or because Teacher wants it, or because you simply lack other choices, you will probably do well.

So you don't believe in making them go to school then?

[michael_student]

So you don't believe in making them go to school then?

I'm not the person you asked, but I'm not certain kids should be forced to go to school. 

Maybe my opinion will change when my girls get older.

[Bob]

They'd have to choose it though.  Or they're not going to stick with it and would probably resent it later.  Or they might thank you for forcing them to play.  Could go either way.

[piano4567]

They have to ask imo. Looking at someone play piano is natural for any kid. If you were playing golf and your children were sat next to you they'd probably touch the clubs and giggle as well.
I asked at the age of 5, well demanded actually, to learn. Otherwise (I teach young children so I know), they'll just have no interest and practicing will be forced. If they don't enjoy it there's no point. Find something else like a sport to get them started in a hobby.

[bronnestam]

So you don't believe in making them go to school then?

Actually I think school has damaged many children. I have a son with authism/ADD, and let's say that school from time to time has been a pure disaster for him. He will be 18 soon. He is intelligent. He has failed completely when it comes to grades.

Otherwise, I want to point out that we discussed very young children in this thread, and my first suggestion was that you should not give lessons to children until they are at least 6 years old. If there is any trained psychologist here, I think he or she could tell why this is not appropriate in general cases. After all, if you look around the world, most children in most cultures happen to start school when they are about 6. Not much earlier than that. There is a reason for that!

[faa2010]

... my first suggestion was that you should not give lessons to children until they are at least 6 years old. If there is any trained psychologist here, I think he or she could tell why this is not appropriate in general cases. After all, if you look around the world, most children in most cultures happen to start school when they are about 6. Not much earlier than that. There is a reason for that!

I agree with your idea, there is a reason of why at 6 children start elementary school.

The educational system has put more concern in the subjects related to intellectual coefficient (IQ), which they have been more praised and fomented without paying attention to the emotional intelligence.

Yes, people can be a genius or very intelligent, but what about the emotional intelligence (EQ)?, how can they handle failures, frustrations, adversities, social issues and dealing with problematic characters in their lives?

There shouldn't be any matter of what children decide to do in the end, just remember that parents should teach and re-learn if it is necessary moral values like respect the others, work hard and honestly, eat healthy, how to deal with adversities, and express themselves without feeling limited. About trusting their parents will depend if parents react either positive or negatively.

Also I think the problem is when schools (at every age) start to be seen only as business that they become less concerned about the children's development.

[anima55]

My advice would be to begin lessons around the age of 7 years.

[falala]

Actually I think school has damaged many children. I have a son with authism/ADD, and let's say that school from time to time has been a pure disaster for him. He will be 18 soon. He is intelligent. He has failed completely when it comes to grades.

Actually I do also have misgivings about school, but examples of individuals badly served by it because of a disability that puts them among a small minority are not really relevant. The point is that we make children do things all the time - lessons at school just being the most obvious example. Many of the kids doing maths at school because they have to will end up qualified and vocationally fulfilled engineers or financiers. Many of those doing English will end up writers, journalists or teachers. Etc. etc.

There's an assumption that an activity can only be enjoyable and take root long term if every instance of that activity is entered into by "choice", made freely out of all possible available choices. This is just not true. It happens often that people sit down to an activity for some reason other than choice (because they have to earn a living; their boss tells them to; they have to for their spouse or kids; or just because they have a life routine that is structured that way) and end up enjoying it and learning from it. I've seen this happen with kids all the time.

In reality, most of the ways we curtail children's choices and make them do stuff work by sheer social ubiquity. Small kids don't generally question the fact that they have to go to school, because everyone else does and it doesn't occur to them that there's an alternative. By the same token however, I've seen environments in rich private schools where kids don't really question the fact that they have to learn a musical instrument either, for the same reason.

Generally, however, music is hived off from compulsory education to the realm of "choice" made after school hours when kids are knackered and just want to watch TV and play computer games. 'Cause it's not important of course.

Kids are naturally capricious, take the route of least resistance and don't have the life experience to think in long term patterns or recognise the value of delaying gratification. It's our job to help them develop those skills, and until they have done so to structure their lives with some sense of long term developmental outcomes, not just short term choices. With sensitivity to the personality, preferences and development of the individual child, of course.

[falala]

My answer to the OP is to start INFORMAL music making as early as possible, certainly as soon as the child can stand up and coordinate movement and control the voice enough to sing a few notes. This can lead into group music-making activities a la Orff, Kodaly etc, by 3 or 4.

The right time to progress from there to focused individual instrumental lessons will depend on the child and hopefully (along with appropriate choice of instrument) be informed by those less formal experiences. But as others have said, I would not normally suggest this before about 6 or 7.

[bernadette60614]

I'm a parent and not a music teacher, but I think that this is a little like "how do I teach my kids to read?"

My answer would be:

Expose them to music.  Piano music, hip hop, rock, jazz, whatever.  We dance around the house, we play beats on pans, we sing.  We just have music as a part of our daily life without any formal lessons.

Let them see how you enjoy piano.  Go to the piano with a smile on your face.  Be excited about what you are learning.  IF and I'm capitalizing that intentionally, IF they show an interest, let them just play with the keys...just let them bang around if that is what it takes.

Show them some simple notes.  This is a C. This is another C. This is another C.  Make a game out of it. Then, take each note and make a game out of it.

Find simple versions of their favorite songs and play them on the piano.  Let them watch you.

I tried to "teach" our son piano, but he had no interest.  One day, I sat down, he sat down next to me and said:  Mom, let me show you something.  He had taught himself how to play Hot Cross Buns (which he had learned at age 6 during the obiligatory recorder lessons at school) on piano, just by playing the note game with me.

Then, I asked him if he wanted to take lessons. I found a playful teacher whose philosophy is that if they enjoy piano, they will enjoy practicing, and he loves to practice, which I think is the fundamental step is learning how to play.

So, the "right" age...when they show you they are ready.