Faure - Nocturne No.2 Op.33 No.2

[cbreemer]

Today's recording project !

[ronde_des_sylphes]

It's good, and nearly very good, but imo it's lacking that final something - a certain element of fantasy or expansiveness at the right point. I think many of us are haunted by a feeling of trying to "get things right" and that militates against attaining that little bit extra. My teacher told me that, at the Paris Conservatoire, he was taught that rubato was acceptable up until the point where the tempo was distorted by a factor of two. Contemporary performance suggests that this is rather an old-fashioned view..

I like the sound more than on some of your recordings - it seems to suit the music, and (not sure) perhaps there's some una corda being used here?

Anyway, if it sounds like I'm being negative, it's a matter of frustration, because I think this is so close to being excellent, but not quite there. It's obviously music you have an affinity for, your piano's distinctive sound fits and technically there are no obvious flaws (apart from two or three of fumbles just before the middle, perhaps?) You should definitely keep doing Faure, apart from anything else he's manifestly under-represented recordingwise. Well played!

[cbreemer]

Thanks Andrew. I don't think I will attain excellency any more than perfection, but coming ever closer to it is a lofty goal. There are indeed two or three dodgy notes here. Fumbles none, I believe. I'm not using any u.c. here. But I like the sound better too, is its probably because I changed the position of my recorder. It's now on a tripod listening directly into the grand, sort if the conventional position it seems. I wonder why I never bothered before to try this out.

[gvans]

Bravo! I think you did a wonderful job on this recording, very articulate and well-played. Nothing wrong, IMO, with using UC and changing textures, perhaps that might have increased your dynamic range, but still, this is a quibble. Lovely piece, incredibly difficult, and superb pianism.

May I also say, "Kudos!" for the painting slide show, it was all a wonderful time warp into fin de siecle Paris!

Many thanks for posting this.

[cbreemer]

Thank you Glen ! I simply did not think of using u.c. here. I need to get used to the idea as I've always steered away from it, not liking the sound. I recently found it sounds much better on a recording than it does live. So no reason not to use it - only that it tends to creak.
 
I was very much taken by Jean Beraud's paintings, an artist I had never heard of before I went to look for suitable images. Some of his works have a palpable atmosphere making you want to dash off for Paris.

[emill]

hi 

Sometimes I feel that being a pianist seems to limit one's enjoyment of a piece with all the "rules"
one has to conform with... how this or that should be played or should sound... I feel, as I see my
son Enzo mature as a pianist begin to be "encumbered", unlike when he was much younger when his spontaneity was as "free as a bird". 

I feel that goes with listening to a piece too.  A non-pianist just goes with how a piece affects him without a thought to form or structure.... frankly for me you have just played quite an enjoyable piece to listen to.

[cbreemer]

Thank you Emill. If it is enjoyable to play, it should be enjoyable to listen to Faure and I have always been good buddies (or so it feels to me at least) and I am not bothered much about how is music "should" be played. I make a point of getting the notes right and be faithful to the
composer's intentions and directions, and in the small leeway allowed beyond that I just do whatever I think sounds best. I know for many people this is not original and individual enough
but I cannot do it any other way. I detest performers who make the composer subordinate to
their own egocentric idiosyncrasies.

[ronde_des_sylphes]

Sometimes I feel that being a pianist seems to limit one's enjoyment of a piece with all the "rules"
one has to conform with... how this or that should be played or should sound... I feel, as I see my
son Enzo mature as a pianist begin to be "encumbered", unlike when he was much younger when his spontaneity was as "free as a bird". 

This is an interesting point. I broadly feel there are three main stages in the development of a pianist: 1. Isn't truly aware of rules, plays by feeling. Unless supremely gifted, the pianist will be viewed by professionals as 'undisciplined' and not taken seriously.2. Learns the rules, and acts in accordance with them. Is now considered a pianist, and taken seriously.3. Learns how and when to (judiciously, one hopes!) bend and even, occasionally, break the rules. Is now an artist, but is also prone to subjective opinions as to the merit of what's being done. This is the rarest of the three.

[michael_sayers]

Hi cbreemer,

Congratulations on the very sensitive and insightful playing of this Faure Nocturne!


Mvh,
Michael

[michael_sayers]

This is an interesting point. I broadly feel there are three main stages in the development of a pianist: 1. Isn't truly aware of rules, plays by feeling. Unless supremely gifted, the pianist will be viewed by professionals as 'undisciplined' and not taken seriously.2. Learns the rules, and acts in accordance with them. Is now considered a pianist, and taken seriously.3. Learns how and when to (judiciously, one hopes!) bend and even, occasionally, break the rules. Is now an artist, but is also prone to subjective opinions as to the merit of what's being done. This is the rarest of the three.

Hi ronde_des_sylphes,

It is worth observing that these so-called "rules" which are intended to suppress freedom of expression are a metaphysical fabrication, and presumably are only considered by the rule enforcers to be applicable to a 3% and consequently shrinking segment of the commercial music market.

Another thing to consider: great artistry is possible while adhering to these rules - many pianists of the 20th century have proven this, in my opinion.


Mvh,
Michael

[sabtan]

Hi there,

What a coincidence am learning this for my LTCL repertoire too.
Overall a good job
Perhaps may need U.C on some areas if you don't mind me saying??
The 1st page, do you think the down beats are a little heavy?

Just my 2 cents worth. I love this piece, one of my favourites. When it's more polished will perhaps upload my version.

[cbreemer]

Thanks sabtan. Indeed some u.c. would have been nice, I just did not think of it. Not sure what exactly you mean with the downbeats, but I feel there could have been yet mode diminuendo at
the end of phrases.
Good luck with practicing and performing this great piece !

[sabtan]

Hi all, this is my version of it:

https://soundcloud.com/sabrina-tan-9/faure-nocturne-no2-in-b-major

Apologies for the not so great audio quality. Am going to invest in a better recording device in the near future.

Hope you enjoy this.

 

[cbreemer]

Interesting to hear someone else working no this one too! Indeed the recorded sound is not great, and there are a suite some extraneous noises (I'm surprised to hear creaking piano benches in so many recordings).

This is coming along nicely, I'd say - but there is work to be done still. If you want to perform
this one, I see 3 points of attention:

1- Accuracy. There are many read errors c.q. mistakes (on that stood out is the B natural halfway
bar 33). Faure can be tricky harmonically, if you want to do it properly you really need to question each and every note you play.

2 - Dynamics. There is very little if any dynamic contrast, everything is uniformly mezzoforte. The recording could be partly debet to this, but certainly not entirely.

3 - Rubato. There isn't any, not even any slight ebb and flow. The piece chugs along like a clockwork. This shows a good feeling for rhythm and tempo, all ok there, but stops dead all expression.

[sabtan]

Thanks for your input on this.

Yes I agree with point 1 and 2. Took me a while to read the notes properly, but sometimes may have slipped into my old habits. So will pay particular attention to it.

Not sure if I can agree completely on rubato. I do agree that there may be parts that may need slowing down, but I don't think there is much room for rubato on this Faure piece. I suppose you can when in transition to certain sections where it slows down or pick up, but there isn't a lot of places where you can rubato anywhere else.

In fact I'm surprised that most of the professional recordings go much faster than mine.

I think I've heard yours and you have quite a few sections with a lot more rubato. Perhaps that's how you interpret it.
Anyway food for thought!

[cbreemer]

Yes one has to be careful with rubato in Faure, you don't want to continuously push and pull the tempo like some pianists do in Chopin. I was thinking more about phrasing and breathing, some
reticence at the end of phrases, some agogic leaning on important notes or harmonies. It's difficult to explain, you need to feel these things before you can apply them successfully. It also
needs to be done more or less spontaneously. This is easier said than done ! It takes time and experience.
A fourth suggestion: be a bit more exacting with the pedal. Not that you handle it at all badly,
but I think that often you do not release it all the way, causing some smudging. Faure's music
must be sumptuous yet clear.

[goldentone]

You did a fine recording here.  If this piece is taken too fast, as I heard in other hands, it loses its ambiance and what Faure intended to convey.  I really enjoyed it.  Thanks for introducing the piece to me.

[cbreemer]

Thank you ! Assuming your feedback refers to my recording and not sabtan's version that was also posted here.

[goldentone]

Thank you ! Assuming your feedback refers to my recording and not sabtan's version that was also posted here.

Yes, your recording.