Chopin Op. 10 no. 12 fingering

[cheese758]

What is best fingering to use in bar 15 - 17?
I'm currently using 51421245 and then leaping to the next set of notes, starting with the same fingering. The fingering written on the music is 51421241 which is a normal arpeggio fingering. I find that I miss less often with my fingering. However, I want to use the fingering that will pay off in the long run (best fingering for fast tempo). Which one would you guys recommend?

[quantum]

Welcome to Pianostreet!

The fingering I use is 51421241.  You need to consider if doing the 5-5 jump works better for your hand at performance tempo.  I think it is less taxing on the 5th finger to do the 1-5.  

For the 1-5 you may wish to practice in isolation getting from 4-1 as well as the minor ninth 1-5.  Practice as solid chords using the fingering of your choice.  Think of the hand formation of the solid chord as you play the arpeggio.  

[michael_sayers]

l.h. -

bar 15:
5142 1241 4142 1241

bar 16:
5142 1241 4142 1241

bar 17:
5124 2313 2313 1423

bar 18:
1324 2312 3412 3124


Mvh,
Michael

[tenk]

5/5 jump would be very awkward, and very well may be impossible at concert tempo. I use something slightly different than Mr. Sayers, highlighted in bold below:

l.h. -

bar 15:
5142 1241 5142 1241

bar 16:
5142 1241 5142 1241

bar 17:
5134 2413 2413 2413

bar 18:
2431 2312 3123 4124

t

[yadeehoo]

Up 5142, down 1231 for every chord on bars 15 & 16, pretty straightforward. Strive to keep your wrist centralised

[yadeehoo]

I made a video just for you (also cause I wanted to)
Watch carefully the thumb/Wrist movement

Peace

[tenk]

I made a video just for you (also cause I wanted to)
Watch carefully the thumb/Wrist movement

Peace

Hmm. I can't say I've ever seen someone play those arpeggios with such exaggerated wrist movements. You'd be better suited to just shift your entire hand position and pedal lightly on the transition. Not sure what you mean to tell him/her to keep their wrist "centralised" -- yours is rather contorted, especially on the upward runs. Just my observations.

t

[yadeehoo]

I have the Urtext version of this song and nowhere is mentioned I have to use the pedal. I play the whole song without pedal. I think it was the purpose of this etude, wasn't it?

[tenk]

I too have an Urtext edition, and you are right that there are no explicit pedal markings. That does not strictly mean "no pedal" though, more of a "pedal at your discretion". I don't know that I've heard any professional play it completely dry of pedal. 

[yadeehoo]

That's interesting. I can feel the drama rising up if I try to use the pedal, but I've developed a certain enjoyment playing the whole piece without pedal, sounds like a flapping fan, kinda cool

[tenk]

Check out this really cool 1959 recording from Bolesław Woytowicz. All of Op. 10, very little to no pedal.

[yadeehoo]

Very nice how we can hear the fingerings in details. Sounds closer to how Chopin himself would've played it. But I guess Liszt's dramatic playing style took over

[maxyim]

Tagging this thread for later reference, always felt like my fingering in that section was horrible.