Schumann/Brahms

[robatsch]

In an earlier discussion, I wanted to compare the piano works of Chopin and Schumann but I've come to realize that a more interesting comparison is the one between Schumann and Brahms since Schumann is known to have had a direct influence on the young Brahms. I was wondering whose piano works do you enjoy more?  Personally,  I love the Brahms intermezzi (especially 118 2) for the feeling of solace that they provide but overall I find that Schumann's piano works have greater dramatic tension and somehow seem more inspired (for example, the Arabeske, Kreisleriana, and the Fantasie).  I guess to sum it up I find  that Brahms piano works are better for easy listening but Schumann's often are of greater depth.  I'm interested to hear what everyone thinks.

Regards,

Michael

[j_menz]

By Schumann you appear to mean Bobby. I'd have thought Clara had a more enduring influence. 

[le_poete_mourant]

I guess to sum it up I find  that Brahms piano works are better for easy listening but Schumann's often are of greater depth.  I'm interested to hear what everyone thinks.

Rubbish. You'd be hard-pressed to find a composer of greater depth than Brahms.

[amytsuda]

When I think of Brahms, it is all about expansive harmony, chromatic chord progression with multiple color tones, and counterpoint. Brahm's choral works, string ensembles and vocal music highlight warm and beautiful harmonic quality. I must agree some of his piano solo pieces fail to fully demonstrate this quality but many of them still do (e.g. Op 118 No 2 mentioned above). Either way, I don't see any compositional style influence from Schumann....

[robatsch]

Rubbish. You'd be hard-pressed to find a composer of greater depth than Brahms.

Perhaps it is simply that Schumann's source of inspiration for his piano works is much clearer than that of Brahms.  To me, Schumann's works are much more about telling a story-- from his ongoing relationship with Clara (Romance, Opus 28 and the Fantasie) to retelling events in literary works (Papillions, Kreisleriana, etc).  There are many sudden abrupt changes in tempo and mood in Schumann's works that highlight the telling of these narratives.  Unlike Schumann, it is well-known that Brahms's preferred to write music in an absolute style.  His piano pieces, specifically the intermezzi, focus more on creating a certain mood or atmosphere.

[robatsch]

I must agree some of his piano solo pieces fail to fully demonstrate this quality but many of them still do (e.g. Op 118 No 2 mentioned above).

To clarify, I do love Brahm's piano music.  In fact, at the surface I find it even more beautiful than Schumann's.  However, I feel that Schumann's music is more colorful and imaginative.  To think of all the personal and literary influences that went into writing it!

[amytsuda]

Don't we sometimes call Brahms the last classical composer? Brahms wasn't into depicting any poem or image. So it makes sense and for ones who enjoy poems and narratives Schumann may appeal better. For ones to enjoy musical analysis Brahms is great. Since I used to play cello, Brahms is really special to me. On the other end, I really enjoy listening to Schumann's lieder (poems!).  

I think the most curious comparison to make is not Schumann/Chopin, not Schumann/Brahms, but Schumann/Liszt. I read Liszt was supporter of Pragramme music that depicts particular images or poems or characters and Schumann was opposed to such and a strong advocator of purity of German classical structure. I read Liszt was the early innovator of key ambivalence through uses of consecutive diminished chords. I read Schumann was opposed to such use of diminished chords. I sometimes feel Schumann is contradicting himself when it comes to his own compositions. Both of them produced great amount of vocal music. We all think Wagner is influenced by Liszt (daughter = wife what's not) but maybe by Schumann too? And probably more forum members will join the discussion if anyone asks which piano composition do you enjoy - Schumann or Liszt!