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Bold and Creative Pianists (Read 4347 times)

Offline josh93248

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Bold and Creative Pianists
« on: August 13, 2015, 01:46:01 PM »
I feel there's something lacking in modern piano playing.

BOLDNESS AND CREATIVITY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't just want a good traditional performance, I want something new, fresh and exciting.

We seem so obsessed now in the tiniest degrees of technical aptitude, refinement and "correct" playing that we have lost something very important. The latitude for the mistakes and freedom for development of CREATIVE BOLD PLAYING.

Now I don't necessarily exclude Jazz or other genres in this but I feel that its far harder to find classical pianists like this so I'd prefer to focus on classical.

Now, I'm not going to get into who I think is creative and bold yet as I think that would just spark a debate about my choices. I want to hear what YOU all think. Also, please give examples :)
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Offline ajlongspiano

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #1 on: August 14, 2015, 02:35:58 AM »

Offline mjames

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #2 on: August 14, 2015, 08:44:53 AM »


"Guys can i have some bold and creative modern pianists"

>Suggests Cortot


lol.

Offline josh93248

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #3 on: August 14, 2015, 09:14:25 AM »
"Guys can i have some bold and creative modern pianists"

>Suggests Cortot


lol.

I actually enjoyed the Cortot, even if it wasn't modern. Do you have any suggestions?
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Offline mjames

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #4 on: August 14, 2015, 09:51:51 AM »
Since some of you called Arturo and Hamelin boring/dull I doubt you'll enjoy my suggestions. Out of the top of my head these are some of the pianists I enjoy:

yeoul eum som
Irina Mejoueva
Yuja Wang
Sultanov



Offline visitor

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #5 on: August 14, 2015, 09:57:41 AM »
Since some of you called Arturo and Hamelin boring/dull I doubt you'll enjoy my suggestions. Out of the top of my head these are some of the pianists I enjoy:

yeoul eum som
Irina Mejoueva
Yuja Wang
Sultanov



Thanks for saving me from having an aneurism over yeol not immediately making the list
There is also (will post examples)
Maksim Mvrica
Nikolai Tokarev
Fazil Say
These are also some of my favorite current starts and top pia it's o listen to normally for the reasons stated by op. Only here we have technical mastery coupled w bold creativity
 :)

Offline josh93248

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #6 on: August 14, 2015, 10:04:14 AM »
Since some of you called Arturo and Hamelin boring/dull I doubt you'll enjoy my suggestions. Out of the top of my head these are some of the pianists I enjoy:

yeoul eum som
Irina Mejoueva
Yuja Wang
Sultanov




As I said I respect Hamelin I just am not moved by him. I actually never said I disliked Arturo, his Scarlatti is brilliant for one thing.

I also quite like Yuja Wang, whose La Valse is terrific. I haven't really looked at the others but will when there's time.
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Offline visitor

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #7 on: August 14, 2015, 10:12:33 AM »
Thanks for saving me from having an aneurism over yeol not immediately making the list
There is also (will post examples)
Maksim Mvrica
Nikolai Tokarev
Fazil Say
These are also some of my favorite current starts and top pia it's o listen to normally for the reasons stated by op. Only here we have technical mastery coupled w bold creativity
 :)

NT

Offline outin

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #8 on: August 14, 2015, 10:13:21 AM »
Stephen Hough!

Offline visitor

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #9 on: August 14, 2015, 10:20:40 AM »
Stephen Hough!

Yes!!

Also adding which should have been on my
original list
Vestard Shimkus
Noticing that the most boldly creative of the lot are pianists composers




Are we luring to those still alive?  Until recently we could count Earl Wild antd were he he alive today I would put him at top of list w Hough an d Shimkus and Pletnev

Ps to above lot that play and compose well I would add who is shockingly not yet mentioned
Volodos

Offline stevensk

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #10 on: August 14, 2015, 10:30:22 AM »

Listen to HJ Lim!
She plays wonderful, bold, reckless, crazy, new, wonderful and fresh!








Offline josh93248

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #11 on: August 14, 2015, 10:43:35 AM »
I'll say we're not limited to those alive although if they're still around all the better and I'll take a look at some of these guys later tonight. They all sound pretty interesting, thanks for responding to my thread guys! :)
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Offline visitor

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #12 on: August 14, 2015, 02:14:36 PM »
I'll say we're not limited to those alive although if they're still around all the better and I'll take a look at some of these guys later tonight. They all sound pretty interesting, thanks for responding to my thread guys! :)
cool in that case, yes Wild. All day long. Just look at what he did to this Liszt (I believe his edition/transcription is published)

Offline ajlongspiano

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #13 on: August 14, 2015, 03:38:48 PM »
The modern era in music was from 1890 to around 1975. So technically Cortot is a modern pianist. The word we'd use for present day pianists/musicians would be contemporary. I just thought by modern you meant anytime in the last century.

Offline dcstudio

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #14 on: August 14, 2015, 05:53:55 PM »
I know you said "living"  and this guy was a jazzer


but VERY creative and VERY BOLD

Thelonius Monk




 that is, for me, who comes to mind when someone says "bold and creative" piano

Offline schumaniac

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #15 on: August 14, 2015, 06:03:24 PM »
Listen to HJ Lim!
She plays wonderful, bold, reckless, crazy, new, wonderful and fresh!








Bold, reckless, crazy, yes, but only for the sake of it :I

Offline stevensk

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #16 on: August 14, 2015, 08:35:13 PM »
Bold, reckless, crazy, yes, but only for the sake of it :I


-Could be, but I think its her style.

Offline stevensk

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #17 on: August 14, 2015, 08:41:17 PM »
I know you said "living"  and this guy was a jazzer

but VERY creative and VERY BOLD

Thelonius Monk



that is, for me, who comes to mind when someone says "bold and creative" piano

...Hm, ordinary jazz...whats bold and creative here?

Offline dogperson

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #18 on: August 14, 2015, 09:25:53 PM »
Yes!!

Also adding which should have been on my
original list
Vestard Shimkus
Noticing that the most boldly creative of the lot are pianists compos

Are we luring to those still alive?  Until recently we could count Earl Wild antd were he he alive today I would put him at top of list w Hough an d Shimkus and Pletnev

Ps to above lot that play and compose well I would add who is shockingly not yet mentioned
Volodos

Ah, Shimkus!  I am a huge fan
Shimkus' Rhapsody in Blue is magical!

 

Shimkus and Chopin

 




Offline stevensk

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #19 on: August 14, 2015, 09:33:35 PM »
Ah, Shimkus!  I am a huge fan
Shimkus' Rhapsody in Blue is magical!

 
Shimkus and Chopin
 


-Ok...but what is "bold" and "creative" here?  ::)

Offline dcstudio

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #20 on: August 15, 2015, 01:45:01 AM »
...Hm, ordinary jazz...whats bold and creative here?


 

 Thelonious Monk was part of that small but select group of jazz musicians who were responsible for the birth of a new kind of jazz - bebop.

 a sub-genre which is arguably the most difficult kind of jazz to play that there is.........I'd say that's pretty BOLD and CREATIVE....  I have never heard anyone describe him as ordinary..

in fact--if you were to say something like that in a room full of jazz pianists...  I would fear for your safety..

but we are all friends here...  
 not everyone likes Thelonius...  but he was anything but "ordinary jazz"  -- and that's not an opinion it's a fact.   Just ask anyone at the Thelonius Monk Institute of Jazz



Offline josh93248

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #21 on: August 15, 2015, 07:43:10 AM »
I've already listened to Thelonius and from what I heard he is pretty original and creative so I'll go with DC on this one.

But I agree with Stevensk that Shimkus, while good, isn't particularly bold or creative insofar as I can see.

I find HJ Lim interesting, I think she goes a touch too far maybe but I mostly like it and she's quite different so I'll make a mental note of her, thanks.

I know Volodos and think he's excellent, I actually should listen to more of him so thanks for reminding me.

I enjoyed Earl Wild too, I'll have to look into him more.

Thanks again everyone, I'm enjoying this and I'll get to more of your suggestions soon :)
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Offline rubinsteinmad

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #22 on: August 15, 2015, 01:38:51 PM »
Wei Luo. Just listen to her Paganini Variations (Brahms)

Offline stevensk

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #23 on: August 15, 2015, 05:13:29 PM »

If we talk jazz I strongely recommend Hiromi Uehara


Offline dcstudio

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #24 on: August 15, 2015, 06:05:32 PM »
I've already listened to Thelonius and from what I heard he is pretty original and creative so I'll go with DC on this one.

But I agree with Stevensk that Shimkus, while good, isn't particularly bold or creative insofar as I can see.


;) hey josh--he is pretty original and creative--but not bold and creative?  I'm confused.

you don't have to be a Thelonius fan to respect what this guy did.  I don't particularly care for Schoenberg --  but I respect his accomplishments

it's really not a question as to whether or not you like his music---It is not for everyone...  or even his playing--his technique  was really bold...lol almost heretical

but I think he must sound ordinary to you because those that came after him copied  his style-- Thelonius was the one who invented that sound you hear.... that now sounds so "normal"--  maybe now you will understand,  he was the FIRST to sound that way.

all of these concert pianists you mention...   not one of them is credited with creating a sub genre...   and bebop is to jazz---as impressionism is to classical music.

it's kinda like calling Bach--ordinary counterpoint... :o ;D

so are you seriously calling the man who invented bebop...  unoriginal?   not particularly bold or creative?  really?  

you don't think it was at all creative of him to give us the sound you now refer to as "ordinary jazz"? or bold of him to play in a way that was never done before?


If that is the case then please give your definition of "bold and creative"  because I believe I have misunderstood  ;D


Offline dcstudio

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #25 on: August 15, 2015, 06:28:09 PM »
If we talk jazz I strongely recommend Hiromi Uehara




ok... so you like progressive/fusion jazz... and that's why you think he sounds ordinary.


lol...she quotes Thelonius  --at about 5:35 in her solo 

 ;D







Offline josh93248

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #26 on: August 15, 2015, 11:42:32 PM »
;) hey josh--he is pretty original and creative--but not bold and creative?  I'm confused.

you don't have to be a Thelonius fan to respect what this guy did.  I don't particularly care for Schoenberg --  but I respect his accomplishments

it's really not a question as to whether or not you like his music---It is not for everyone...  or even his playing--his technique  was really bold...lol almost heretical

but I think he must sound ordinary to you because those that came after him copied  his style-- Thelonius was the one who invented that sound you hear.... that now sounds so "normal"--  maybe now you will understand,  he was the FIRST to sound that way.

all of these concert pianists you mention...   not one of them is credited with creating a sub genre...   and bebop is to jazz---as impressionism is to classical music.

it's kinda like calling Bach--ordinary counterpoint... :o ;D

so are you seriously calling the man who invented bebop...  unoriginal?   not particularly bold or creative?  really?  

you don't think it was at all creative of him to give us the sound you now refer to as "ordinary jazz"? or bold of him to play in a way that was never done before?


If that is the case then please give your definition of "bold and creative"  because I believe I have misunderstood  ;D



I said that *SHIMKUS* didn't seem particularly bold or creative, NOT THELONIUS, I think THELONIUS is PLENTY BOLD AND CREATIVE.

Sorry to shout DC, I just don't want you under the impression I can't tell Thelonius is a very creative man ;)
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Offline Petter

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #27 on: August 16, 2015, 12:19:36 AM »
*Thelonious  >:( but hey, not even his biographer got it right…
"A gentleman is someone who knows how to play an accordion, but doesn't." - Al Cohn

Offline dcstudio

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #28 on: August 16, 2015, 01:21:18 AM »
I said that *SHIMKUS* didn't seem particularly bold or creative, NOT THELONIUS, I think THELONIUS is PLENTY BOLD AND CREATIVE.

Sorry to shout DC, I just don't want you under the impression I can't tell Thelonius is a very creative man ;)


well don't I feel like an A$$...lol.   you are absolutely right.  That's what I get for not paying attention...  sorry Josh... 

we good?  ;D

Offline josh93248

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #29 on: August 16, 2015, 06:55:38 AM »

well don't I feel like an A$$...lol.   you are absolutely right.  That's what I get for not paying attention...  sorry Josh... 

we good?  ;D

Totally :)
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Offline schumaniac

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #30 on: August 17, 2015, 01:21:10 AM »
Wei Luo. Just listen to her Paganini Variations (Brahms)
From the Cliburn Junior competition?

Yes, her playing was amazing; she programmed both Paganini books plus La Valse.
Bold? Yes
Creative? I don't think the judges agreed

Offline rubinsteinmad

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #31 on: August 17, 2015, 03:09:59 AM »
From the Cliburn Junior competition?

Yes, her playing was amazing; she programmed both Paganini books plus La Valse.
Bold? Yes
Creative? I don't think the judges agreed

I actually thought the opposite :-[ But that's OK. It's just that my taste is not as refined as yours.  Also, I haven't heard anything by her besides the Brahms and a Haydn Sonata, so....

Prior to listening to her, I thought Brahms' piano music was boring crap, INCLUDING/ESPECIALLY the Paganini Variations  (and all of the Klavierstuck and Intermezzi ::)). After hearing her play with so much creativity (comparing to the people I've heard before), my opinion completely changed ;D

I think the sole unpolitical reason she didn't get in the finals was the Brahms issue (or maybe not. I've only heard her play Brahms and Haydn ;D). Critics complained that it was too "light" for Brahms, which, according to them, should be played heavier. I see what they're saying, but I think they should educate themselves a bit more before actually publishing their reviews and making a fool of themselves.
Those variations, OPUS THIRTY-FIVE ::),  were written from 1862-1865. Brahms was in this late20's/early 30s. He was pretty lean back then ::) I've heard that Paganini Variations played heavily, and that just about makes me bored 8)  But that's why I thought her playing wasn't that "bold". Her loud sections weren't very loud.

I liked Xiaoxuan Li's Haydn far more than her Haydn, though. I thought it had more life, BY FAR. I haven't heard Anna Boonyanit play in the Cliburn yet, but her performance at the Russian Music Competition of the Beethoven Sonata Op. 2 #3 is just exquisite and so lively. Also, Evelyn Mo's Ballade #1 was just SO INSPIRING!!! I wish I could be that musical when I'm 16. I know what you'll say:
     "Sorry, kid, but that ain't gonna happen"

Sorry, but I'm too opinionated ;D FORGIVE ME OR ELSEEEEEEE!

Offline rubinsteinmad

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #32 on: August 17, 2015, 03:18:57 AM »
ELSEEEEEEE!


Lol. It's spelled "Elsa". I got it completely mixed up :P
Someday I'm going to write a Paraphrase on "Let it Go", and it will include the beginning of Scarbo ::)

Offline schumaniac

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #33 on: August 17, 2015, 04:05:10 AM »
I actually thought the opposite :-[ But that's OK. It's just that my taste is not as refined as yours.  Also, I haven't heard anything by her besides the Brahms and a Haydn Sonata, so....

Prior to listening to her, I thought Brahms' piano music was boring crap, INCLUDING/ESPECIALLY the Paganini Variations  (and all of the Klavierstuck and Intermezzi ::)). After hearing her play with so much creativity (comparing to the people I've heard before), my opinion completely changed ;D

I think the sole unpolitical reason she didn't get in the finals was the Brahms issue (or maybe not. I've only heard her play Brahms and Haydn ;D). Critics complained that it was too "light" for Brahms, which, according to them, should be played heavier. I see what they're saying, but I think they should educate themselves a bit more before actually publishing their reviews and making a fool of themselves.
Those variations, OPUS THIRTY-FIVE ::),  were written from 1862-1865. Brahms was in this late20's/early 30s. He was pretty lean back then ::) I've heard that Paganini Variations played heavily, and that just about makes me bored 8)  But that's why I thought her playing wasn't that "bold". Her loud sections weren't very loud.

I liked Xiaoxuan Li's Haydn far more than her Haydn, though. I thought it had more life, BY FAR. I haven't heard Anna Boonyanit play in the Cliburn yet, but her performance at the Russian Music Competition of the Beethoven Sonata Op. 2 #3 is just exquisite and so lively. Also, Evelyn Mo's Ballade #1 was just SO INSPIRING!!! I wish I could be that musical when I'm 16. I know what you'll say:
     "Sorry, kid, but that ain't gonna happen"

Sorry, but I'm too opinionated ;D FORGIVE ME OR ELSEEEEEEE!


"When I'm 16"
Wait, what, how old are you?
(I'm 14 btw and there are a couple of other "young people" here too)

I think it may have been more because of her Rachmaninoff 1st concerto performance... which wasn't the most inspired or passionate in my opinion.

Offline rubinsteinmad

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #34 on: August 17, 2015, 02:23:37 PM »
"When I'm 16"
Wait, what, how old are you?
(I'm 14 btw and there are a couple of other "young people" here too)

I think it may have been more because of her Rachmaninoff 1st concerto performance... which wasn't the most inspired or passionate in my opinion.

I will not tell you how auld I am.  ::) Don't they teach you internet safety in school???? ;D ;D ;D  

No, I haven't heard her Rachmaninoff Concerto. I only heard parts of it, and I got bored (lol). I mean, it's not a very inspiring concerto compared to his more famous concerti. Also, as I said, the only pieces I heard her play full were the Brahms and the Haydn. I loved her Brahms, but I agee with you for the Haydn... it wasn't very inspired or lively.

EDIT: You forgave my opionoatedness.  ;D You've let it slide WAY too many times. I'd LOVE to have you as my school principal ;D ;D ;D

EDIT/P.S.: Let's just say I'm about the age you started PianoStreet ;)

Offline rubinsteinmad

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Re: Bold and Creative Pianists
«Reply #35 on: August 17, 2015, 02:46:25 PM »
OK, I don't know if this counts as "bold" or not?? But the Creativity side really shows. Listen to Rafael Lipstein playing Tarantelly by Liszt. It's a whole different level than other, much more recognized players around his age. He plays SO MATURELY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(I haven't heard him play the "Canzone" part of Tarantelly yet, though, but I know that his Tarantelly side is just really mature>)
I think he's the best on Tarantelly on YTube!!! And he's 16!! Still, I wish Arrau played it. I'm not a big fan of Bolet, but I think he's 2nd best on YTUbe for this piece. If Arrau recorded it, it would be a different story ;D

But Wikipedia says that ARRAU RECORDED THE COMPLETE AdP!!!!!

But it's not on Amazon OR YouTube. Which is just plain sad.