Hanon 1-20 technique

[georgey]

Hello.  A couple years ago I was unable to find a good example of a video of someone playing Hanon 1-20.  I looked again yesterday and found the following on youtube.

This appears to be a good example.  For the most part: Nice, even sound, nice looking hands that are still, nicely curved fingers.  Does it appear that the following shows proper technique for these exercises?  Do you have another video example that may be better?  I should have posted this on the Student's corner instead.  I'll do so next time. Thank you.

[georgey]

Sorry for the second post on this.  I’m sure there are MANY members of pianostreet that can play Hanon better than the example I gave.  This is the best example of a Hanon video that I can find.  Is there a better example available?   Thanks again.

[bronnestam]

I think you can play these exercises in different ways. Just as an example, exercise No. 5 can be made with focus on wrist rotation which I see nothing of here.

To ME it is pointless to play like this. I do some Hanon exercises when I encounter a problem during the study of a piece and want to refine something technically. But then I have a context for the exercise. Without context, it makes no sense to me. Why not play the C Major Sonata by Mozart or some Invention by Bach instead? They sound so much nicer and they also contain similar technical aspects.
But I also think this is a decision for each and everyone to make. If you feel satisfied in playing Hanon just like that, then it is probably of benefit to you.

[adodd81802]

Hi Georgey,

Maybe if you could put your request into context so it can be understood the purpose of your request?

Are you trying to find good technique?
Are you purely looking for a whole run of Hanon studies from 1-20, as it's a very basic set of patterns that even a beginner pianist can perform even sight read in my opinion.

It's not really a performance piece merely perceived as a set of finger exercises to improve other performances and finger strength. (controversial)

[feddera]

Not the whole book, but perhaps worth a look:

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[georgey]

I am interested in seeing a good performance of Hanon out of curiosity and also for inspiration to practice these exercises. 

I am interested to see what the hands look like during performance of Hanon at or very near the high tempo recommended by Hanon (not at breakneck speeds) from a very good to world class piano player. Best would be all 60 exercises played by a world class player, but I would like to see at least the first 10 or 20 exercises at 108 BPM.  I’m guessing that many or most world class players have played Hanon at least at one point.   

What do world class piano player’s hands look like playing Hanon?  How do they sound playing Hanon?  I can get an idea by watching videos of world class players playing concert pieces such as Bach inventions, Mozart sonatas, Chopin etudes, etc., so it is not necessary to see them play Hanon, but it would be fun for me to see.  With the popularity of Hanon, I thought I might see at least a couple students at Julliard or Curtis or some other top school record and post their playing of Hanon during a practice session.  Thanks for the responses!

[visitor]

fyi the jazz hannon ones super cool, and there's some pretty decent examples out there. i find these way more motivating than other ones.

am thinking about starting to work on some of these some point mid 2016
https://www.amazon.com/Hanon-Private-Lessons-Peter-Deneff/dp/0634018736

[adodd81802]

I am interested in seeing a good performance of Hanon out of curiosity and also for inspiration to practice these exercises. 

I am interested to see what the hands look like during performance of Hanon at or very near the high tempo recommended by Hanon (not at breakneck speeds) from a very good to world class piano player. Best would be all 60 exercises played by a world class player, but I would like to see at least the first 10 or 20 exercises at 108 BPM.  I’m guessing that many or most world class players have played Hanon at least at one point.   

What do world class piano player’s hands look like playing Hanon?  How do they sound playing Hanon?  I can get an idea by watching videos of world class players playing concert pieces such as Bach inventions, Mozart sonatas, Chopin etudes, etc., so it is not necessary to see them play Hanon, but it would be fun for me to see.  With the popularity of Hanon, I thought I might see at least a couple students at Julliard or Curtis or some other top school record and post their playing of Hanon during a practice session.  Thanks for the responses!

In response to this, I just don't think you're going to find it. I would find it difficult to believe a world class pianist (either in the beginning or well into their career) would consider a few low-level finger exercises worthy of recording.

Furthermore it would be potentially misleading, I think for a world class pianist to perform this and give the impression that it provided or aided to their "world class" ability (I imagine you are familiar with the controversy around these particular exercises)

Lastly, what you see and what you feel is two different things, I believe you would have nothing to gain from "seeing" a good pianist perform these exercises. Inspiration is probably the wrong word, inspiration is ideas, example, for composing. As previously stated, Hanon studies are nothing more then technical exercises, they're there for you to identify your own weak areas and use them to aid you overcome that (again results are questionable) 

A piano teacher would be the best person to demonstrate these studies or any other studies to you so it can be explained exactly what's going on and also if any of them are going to be beneficial to you.

You are better off finding musical studies, such as Czerny studies which you will find a lot of these examples online, and provide technical benefits on a more musical level.

It is also a bold statement to suggest that every world class pianist would have touched Hanon because I can guarantee you that's not the case. These are by no means a set of studies, in which if you complete at the goal tempo you can then move onto Chopin Ballads, or Beethoven Sonatas.

I hope this response doesn't come off aggressive, i'm simply trying to broaden your goals here, I've played through all 20 exercises, i'm not now off to Carnegie Hall xD

Plan A should be - get a teacher - see if the studies are necessary for you.
Plan B run through them, if there are any you struggle with, practice those, do so with caution, and do not let them take more then half of your practice sessions, you can have time better well spent on other things.

[georgey]

Last post: "Furthermore it would be potentially misleading, I think for a world class pianist to perform this and give the impression that it provided or aided to their "world class" ability"

I agree.  I believe someone can practice Hanon 5 hours a day for 40 years and still not be able to play the exercises well, let alone actual music.  But a world class piano player would be able to perform the Hanon exercises with practice and play ALL 60 accurately with a beautiful sound in the fasted tempo suggested by Hanon.  It would be FUN for me to see and hear this.

Last post: “Lastly, what you see and what you feel is two different things, I believe you would have nothing to gain from "seeing" a good pianist perform these exercises.”

I may disagree with this.  A picture is worth a thousand words.  You can see in the example I provided of the person playing Hanon 1-20 that his hands are very quiet.  As Murray McLachlan says in his “Foundations of Technique” Chapter 3 - finger Independence: “ perhaps most serious of all is the inability to keep non-playing fingers quiet … leading to frustration and angst”.  

Last post Suggestion A – Get a teacher

This is what I will be doing in the near future.  Hanon will be about 10% of my practice for now. Thank you for this post!

[adodd81802]

I am glad you will be getting a teacher.

Maybe you should learn the exercises and perform them because you will be a long time waiting getting a professional pianist to take any enjoyment from playing them or recording them for that matter.

I don't think you can play them beautifully. they're not really designed to sound musical they serve a purpose, there doesn't need to be any emotion associated with them, only concentration on their purpose.

Lastly with regards to your picture comment - that's exactly my point a picture is worth a 1000 words which is completely up for interpretation. what you could see in the Mona Lisa, is most likely different from I, and from Hanon lol. It's good if there is no wrong answer, but with piano playing there are wrong answers and watching someone play, is not the same as knowing how they play. You can watch 100 performances of the same place and not 1 will look the same despite them all being played beautifully which is what brought me to my teacher comment.

I look forward to you posting some Hanon studies in the Audition forum, maybe you can set a new trend

[georgey]

Last comment about a picture: "It's good if there is no wrong answer, but with piano playing there are wrong answers and watching someone play, is not the same as knowing how they play."

You are correct.  Say you are playing Hanon and your fingers that are not playing are not quiet. Maybe your 5th finger is curling up or sticking way up in the air until it is used.  You see a good piano player play the same exercise with quiet hands so you know you are doing something wrong.  So you buy Murray McLachlan’s Foundation of Technique and read chapter 3 and learn what you are doing wrong AND HOW TO CORRECT IT.  Or you go to a piano teacher.  

I will not be posting Hanon, but I would love to see someone else if they are inclined to do so.

Clarification:  I said earlier “I believe someone can practice Hanon 5 hours a day for 40 years and still not be able to play the exercises well, let alone actual music.”

I am referring here to exercises practiced improperly without supplemental exercises and additional instruction.  I do believe that Hanon can be helpful though if practiced properly in part of a well -balanced program of practice.  

This will be my last post on this topic.  I will read any other posts that may come later though. Thanks!

[adodd81802]

No problem, I never meant to come across argumentative or anything like that, I was rather interested in your request and reasoning behind it. I would hate to see somebody hinder themselves unnecessarily so I commented.

I would agree with you to an extent but Horowitz was a world class pianist and not only did he curl his little fingers he also played with very flat fingers.

One could watch this and assume mimicking his style will achieve the same effect. There are some obvious rights and wrongs but when it comes down to the nitty gritty it's not something you see, it's what you know, knowledge that is often passed from teacher to student - to teacher to student. (a good teacher!)

I agree with your thoughts on Hanon and never questioned whether it could benefit (if practiced correctly) I just think because it's not the holy grail book it claims to be and certainly not by any means a performance piece you are unlikely to see any professionals playing it.

Lastly I wouldn't see anybody playing Hanon and assume that their technique or hand/finger shape has anything to do with playing Hanon which your original post lead me to believe was your opinion on the matter.

I hope you find Hanon beneficial. I also hope you don't spend too much time on the exercises or how to play them, your technique develops with real musical pieces and the assistance of a teacher.

Good luck.

[pianoplunker]

Hello.  A couple years ago I was unable to find a good example of a video of someone playing Hanon 1-20.  I looked again yesterday and found the following on youtube.

This appears to be a good example.  For the most part: Nice, even sound, nice looking hands that are still, nicely curved fingers.  Does it appear that the following shows proper technique for these exercises?  Do you have another video example that may be better?  I should have posted this on the Student's corner instead.  I'll do so next time. Thank you.

My experience with Hanon 1 - 20 began after I had already learned all of Bach's Inventions. I had brought Hanon to my teacher . He was delighted that a student would actually be ready to play them evenly at tempo. However he did not like the idea of playing them in lieu of playing music. So he had me practice them as two note slurs all the way through the patterns to help me with a problem I was having with two note slurs in a Mozart Sonata I was working on - it changed the whole thing into something useful as it actually did help me play music, even though I had already enough experience to play them evenly if I really wanted to.  None of that was in the prescribed tempo that Hanon suggests.  It was difficult and awkward but it did help to have a teacher who understood the whole thing. Sorry I cant find a video nor do I wish to try. Playing it evenly and precise is ok but you can do so much more with it

[CC]

Nobody should EVER get trapped with Hanon's nonsense. For my list of reasons, go to my web site below, then 3rd Edition, section 42.