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Topic: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition  (Read 3772 times)

Offline lalo57

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Is une barque sur l'océan à better option?  How much harder is it?
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Offline symphonicdance

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #1 on: December 05, 2015, 04:55:41 AM
Both are equally hard  :P

Offline dcstudio

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #2 on: December 05, 2015, 07:01:48 AM

I like the Jeux d'eau... not sure if it still qualifies as contemporary though.. you might want to move forward a few decades..   check with your school.   

Offline mjames

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #3 on: December 05, 2015, 11:02:53 AM
I know that most classical musicians are allergic to contemporary music but jesus christ man, use your head. Both compositions were published OVER A 100 YEARS AGO.

Miroirs: 1905
Jeux d'eau: 1901

More than a century has passed since their publications and youre still considering it as 'contemporary' music? Though considering the current state of the industry...I wouldn't be surprised if the schools you're applying to considered Ravel as a contemporary musician.

I would suggest a composer that's actually alive. Someone like Kapustin or whatever...bottom line is, don't be lazy. Do more research.

Offline visitor

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #4 on: December 05, 2015, 01:50:56 PM
I know that most classical musicians are allergic to contemporary music but jesus christ man, use your head. Both compositions were published OVER A 100 YEARS AGO.

Miroirs: 1905
Jeux d'eau: 1901

More than a century has passed since their publications and youre still considering it as 'contemporary' music? Though considering the current state of the industry...I wouldn't be surprised if the schools you're applying to considered Ravel as a contemporary musician.

I would suggest a composer that's actually alive. Someone like Kapustin or whatever...bottom line is, don't be lazy. Do more research.


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Offline dcstudio

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #5 on: December 05, 2015, 02:52:41 PM


no, Thank YOU! lol

OP ---contemporary ="with the times"  

 1950s forward is about the norm...  give or take.   Ravel wasn't a  "contemporary" composer when I went to school...  a long, long, time ago...can't imagine that he now qualifies 25 + years later.   Stranger things have happened though.

Offline briansaddleback

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #6 on: December 10, 2015, 07:13:18 AM
How about maple leaf rag? Pretty contemporary by your definition. Kill it at the audition.
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Offline dcstudio

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #7 on: December 10, 2015, 08:47:15 AM
How about maple leaf rag? Pretty contemporary by your definition. Kill it at the audition.

As awesome as the Maple Leaf Rag is it was published in 1899... it's Ragtime...     it will not qualify either .... :)

Offline quantum

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #8 on: December 10, 2015, 09:22:12 AM
We've been over this before.  Some people just can't get over the fact that their personal definition of "contemporary" is different then someone else.  Quote dictionaries all you like, but a term can be interpreted a multitude of ways. 

If an audition categorizes a composer as "contemporary" for the purposes of the audition, you would be wise to follow the given instruction regarding selection of repertoire, as opposed to presenting a protest.  Is it really worth it to be docked marks just because you don't agree with how a piece is categorized?

Just saying... if I was on jury, I would think twice about a candidate that could not follow simple instructions. 

Made a Liszt. Need new Handel's for Soler panel & Alkan foil. Will Faure Stein on the way to pick up Mendels' sohn. Josquin get Wolfgangs Schu with Clara. Gone Chopin, I'll be Bach

Offline mjames

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #9 on: December 10, 2015, 12:46:30 PM
Ah yes, we'll already aware of the fact that classical musicians don't really know how to use the word 'contemporary.'

Offline dcstudio

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #10 on: December 10, 2015, 02:25:21 PM


Just saying... if I was on jury, I would think twice about a candidate that could not follow simple instructions. 



I disagreed with my professor on "simple instructions" for my jury one semester...   he got up and started watering his plants as I performed/trounced the Pathetique (a forbidden Sonata)--and then gave me a C for the semester--oh...btw.. he LIKED me...lol. 

Do as they say if you wish to attend their school.

Offline visitor

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #11 on: December 10, 2015, 02:32:10 PM
+1 to both above. find what they mean by  contemp. if they use the proper and more correct and reasonable logic, then the Ravel selection would be 'dated' (quite the understatement). so a proper new piece would be in order. if they say contemp and they just want anything from 20th century or particular (a more proper but still conservative) post World War I piece may be in order. of they may be a bunch of stuffy old people who thing classical music died after Debussy so your Ravel is modern/contemp and fits.

if you have free reign, do broaden horizons, there's lovely stuff out there, ie this is 'newer newish' but in an older style slant, neo romantic sort of way

Offline briansaddleback

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #12 on: December 10, 2015, 08:26:40 PM
As awesome as the Maple Leaf Rag is it was published in 1899... it's Ragtime...     it will not qualify either .... :)
haha i was tongue in cheek
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Offline dcstudio

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #13 on: December 10, 2015, 08:59:32 PM
haha i was tongue in cheek

ha ha... I think you mean foot in mouth...  :)

Offline rubinsteinmad

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #14 on: December 10, 2015, 09:35:39 PM
If you really want Ravel....
I've learned both Jeux d'eau and Une barque de l'ocean, and I think Jeux d'eau was easier for the fingers, but it was more challenging for me to sightread.

However, I've learned from Visitor that "Contemporary" means Post-1950.

Offline quantum

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #15 on: December 10, 2015, 10:15:08 PM
I think the problem lies with the duality between defining "contemporary" as a relative function of time, versus the said term as descriptor for certain stylistic devices that appeared in music of the 20th century.  The fact that at some point in time these two meanings may have coincided further compounds the problem.  It is clear that there are those who have a difficult time relating multiphasic meaning towards a particular term of like spelling (I would relate this as similar to a person with perfect pitch unable to hear the notes of a transposing instrument).  Nonetheless, I feel what is needed are a clearer set of discreet terms for these points.  

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Do what the audition asks of you.  Audition time, as well as course time are not the best places to be making political stances.  If you want to voice your beef do it on your own time, not during an audition and not during lessons.  There is no requirement for you to continue to do what your teacher asks of you.  
Made a Liszt. Need new Handel's for Soler panel & Alkan foil. Will Faure Stein on the way to pick up Mendels' sohn. Josquin get Wolfgangs Schu with Clara. Gone Chopin, I'll be Bach

Offline shostglass

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #16 on: December 14, 2015, 01:26:25 AM
How about one of Ginesteria's piano sonatas, or the not so played original piano version of Villa-lobos's Bachianas Brasileiras no.4 both are beautiful and not too challenging.

Also if you want something "contemporary" thats a  universally accepted and seen as acontemporary piece than you might want to search past 1950.

Offline rubinsteinmad

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #17 on: December 14, 2015, 03:27:59 AM
At the Telekom Beethoven Competition in Bonn, zey make you do a piece written after 1980 :P

Offline dcstudio

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #18 on: December 14, 2015, 07:02:33 AM
At the Telekom Beethoven Competition in Bonn, zey make you do a piece written after 1980 :P

wow...do I ever feel old now... anybody else?  geez.   ???

Offline rubinsteinmad

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #19 on: December 16, 2015, 12:18:52 AM
wow...do I ever feel old now... anybody else?  geez.   ???


At school in my French class, somebody said that the '90s were vintage. ;D The teacher was a little disconcerted... ::)

Offline dcstudio

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #20 on: December 16, 2015, 01:49:10 AM
At school in my French class, somebody said that the '90s were vintage. ;D The teacher was a little disconcerted... ::)

Vintage?  no... the '68 Mustang I drove in 1980 to HS was "vintage"  the 90's are like last week to me. lol.   Geez...  :o

Offline rubinsteinmad

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #21 on: December 16, 2015, 01:51:33 AM
Vintage?  no... the '68 Mustang I drove in 1980 to HS was "vintage"  the 90's are like last week to me. lol.   Geez...  :o

lol it wasn't me who said it (the girl who said it was born in 2004 lol)

Offline daniloperusina

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Re: how is Jeux d'eau for contemporary pièce in an audition
Reply #22 on: January 05, 2016, 12:25:59 AM
I think the problem lies with the duality between defining "contemporary" as a relative function of time, versus the said term as descriptor for certain stylistic devices that appeared in music of the 20th century.  The fact that at some point in time these two meanings may have coincided further compounds the problem.  It is clear that there are those who have a difficult time relating multiphasic meaning towards a particular term of like spelling (I would relate this as similar to a person with perfect pitch unable to hear the notes of a transposing instrument).  Nonetheless, I feel what is needed are a clearer set of discreet terms for these points.  

***

Do what the audition asks of you.  Audition time, as well as course time are not the best places to be making political stances.  If you want to voice your beef do it on your own time, not during an audition and not during lessons.  There is no requirement for you to continue to do what your teacher asks of you.  

I agree. The 20th century has been labelled with many genres, of which contemporary is not one. Rather, they have been Impressionism, Expressionism, Electronic, Twelve-tone, Serial, Post-serial, Neo-classical, Modernism, Post-modernism, Minimalism, Chance Music. Among others.

If I go to a concert labelled Contemporary, I'd not hear Debussy, Ravel, nor Schoenberg nor Stravinsky. Neither would I hear Prokofiev or Schostakovich. I'd hear freshly composed music. The pieces might be a few years old, but they would not be as old as 1980.
Contemporary means new music relevant to what's happening now on the composers' scene, not what happened 20 or 30 years ago or more.

The dilemma with labelling such a category in an audition is that it likely doesn't correspond to what it actually means. It would probably indeed stretch back to 1950 as suggested, or further.

Was I in such a jury, what I'd like to see is a performance of something that differs in terms of structure/technique/musical language/notation from the, for lack of a better term, "baroque/classical/romantic/impressionistic/neo-romantic/neo-classical" canon, with by which I'd mean Bach/Mozart/Beethoven/Chopin/Liszt/Debussy/Ravel/Rachmaninoff/Prokofiev. I wouldn't be a stranger, although it would certainly not be "contemporary", to Schoenberg/Webern/Berg/Cage/Berio/Feldman/Boulez/Ligeti/Gubaidulina/Schnittke. These are but a few of the more established and universally acclaimed, by now "classic", 20th century composers (most of them are long since deceased), not least for their compositions for piano. There are many more, but these are certainly among the most acclaimed of the avant-garde, i.e "breaking-new-ground", composers of the last century. 

Auditioning with any of these would give a hint that you have some orientation in what could be called a more contemporary "structure/technique/musical language/notation". Personally, I've played some Schoenberg and Schnittke, worked on some Webern, Berio and Feldman, fell short of working on some Cage because I didn't have eraser-gums and screws at hand to put on the strings, and I've premiered two new compositions at concerts. Not a lot by any means, but...

Anyway, my thoughts on "contemporary" at an audition.
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