What is wrong with me? I do not like Liszt...

[ronde_des_sylphes]

obvious and rather shallow

If all you ever hear is a few Hungarian Rhapsodies and some of the flashier TEs and paraphrases, that is understandable. But there is much more to Liszt than that. Some of his contemplative, religious and death-preoccupied music is like no other, e.g. Funerailles, the Benediction, Vallee d'Obermann, Pensee des morts (which I find quite disturbing). I find him the most protean of all composers. And you must remember that Liszt wrote his music from the perspective of there not being technical hurdles at all - for him.

[rubinsteinmad]

If all you ever hear is a few Hungarian Rhapsodies and some of the flashier TEs and paraphrases, that is understandable. But there is much more to Liszt than that. Some of his contemplative, religious and death-preoccupied music is like no other, e.g. Funerailles, the Benediction, Vallee d'Obermann, Pensee des morts (which I find quite disturbing). I find him the most protean of all composers. And you must remember that Liszt wrote his music from the perspective of there not being technical hurdles at all - for him.

True

[mjames]

how can anyone hate the b minor sonate

[distantfieldrelative]

how can anyone hate the b minor sonate

By listening to Yundi Li play it. Among others.

[stoudemirestat]

Liszt is one of my favourite composers. I would like to suggest that those who dislike him to not see their opinions as ones that will not change at some point, whether via a simple change in taste or a more thorough examining of his output. Of course, not liking his music is entirely understandable and a valid taste to have (as is disliking any composer), but my point is that your experience is not the only possible one (and if you don't trust my judgement, perhaps Brendel Arrau's, or Barenboim's). Many of my favourite Liszt works I did not like much at first.

Here are some favourites of mine with some links for whoever may be interested:

Some obvious ones, with no links required: Piano Sonata, Annees de Pelerinage, Transcendental Etudes, HPER, etc etc.

Bist Du

Romance Oubilee

Pace Non Trovo (The song, not as well known, is every bit as good)

Variations on Weinen, Klagen, Sorgen, Zagen

A La Chapelle Sixtine (a paraphrase on Allegri's Miserere and Mozart's Ave Verum Corpus)

Die Lorelei

And many, many others, but I only listed ones I've been involved with recently so as to ensure a fresh perception.

[stoudemirestat]

I would never think to overuse tremolos like that.

Fair enough: as a Liszt lover one of the qualifications I have is that I'm frequently frustrated with his overuse of tremolo and repeated chords of a rather static harmony: the Unstern! I especially can't find myself liking, despite any 'forward looking traits' it might possess.

I do advise that you try Nuages Gris a few more times in your life, as it a piece that has been much admired by many (starting with Schoenberg, Stravinsky, and Debussy) and even those who don't typically like Liszt much. Generally considered to be one of his masterpieces (not that this means any of us 'should' like it, but that many discerning listeners have found something very enjoyable in it). I find it to be a moving piece of music myself...

[jimroof]

I decided to start reading through one of my senior recital pieces, Mephisto Waltz 1.  I actually find this piece fun to play, but it brought home one of my observations numerous times...

Liszt will find some nice little progression that modulates nicely to the same sequence.  The first time he does it - oh... that's nice.  The second time - yeah... I heard it right the first time.  The third time - yeah... I know about that already.  The fourth time - is there going to be a fifth time... really?

It is as if he found something of interest then just milked it dry.  Even if I am wrong and he never did the sequence more than three times, I still get the impression that it is a bit overused.  I find no such spots in any thing I have ever played or read by Chopin.  I do find some sections in Beethoven Sonatas where sequential material is repeated a lot, but in that case it is mostly due to need to reach V to set up the recapitulation.

In fairness, I do not know the pieces that many are pointing to as better examples of Liszt.  But, I think the fact that one has to look through significant volumes of work to find an 'example' sort of turns the definition of 'example' on its ear. 

[mjames]

>complaining about repetition
>i find no such thing in chopin


Cmon bro LOL

[jimroof]

>complaining about repetition
>i find no such thing in chopin


Cmon bro LOL

Chopin repeats, but he does not do the same kind of formulaic modulations that I hear in the Mephisto Waltz.  It's like Liszt finds a good way to get from Gb to Ab... then uses the very same thing to get from Ab to Bb, then Bb to C, then C to D. 

Chopin repeats are like Hitchcock films.  If he is boring you, he is doing it with a purpose that will soon be revealed.   With Liszt, it is not intentional.  It just happens.

An example of purposeful boredom from Chopin would be the F major Ballade.  He lulls you to sleep with the opening theme... then all hell breaks loose in Am.  The former sets the stage. 

[mjames]

Oh true. Well for chopin, idk about liszt...dont really know much about his music, but i agree with you about chopin.

Actually i would argue that late chopins music becomes far less repetitive and instead more ambiguous <_> especially the way the material develops

[pianiststrongbad]

I have heard a lot of people claim they don't like Liszt. But then after hearing a good live performance of his Sonata or some of the works from his Années de pèlerinage, they tend to say the opposite. Personally, I like a lot of what he wrote, but he also wrote a fair amount that I don't appreciate as well.

I recommend the B minor sonata - some of the thematic transformations are stunning (try analyzing it, or find an analysis which points out where all of the themes are). Perhaps you will find it repetitive, that is fine too. We don't all need to enjoy the same music.

[outin]

I have heard a lot of people claim they don't like Liszt. But then after hearing a good live performance of his Sonata or some of the works from his Années de pèlerinage, they tend to say the opposite. Personally, I like a lot of what he wrote, but he also wrote a fair amount that I don't appreciate as well.

While I doubt how that would work in this specific case, it is actually true that some music works best in live performance. Interestingly I have even enjoyed some Beethoven when played live 

[bernadette60614]

Nothing "wrong" with you.

I don't "like" the Impressionists....give me a late Picasso any time over a gauzy Monet.

So long as I like art and some of it speaks to me, I'm fine.

[swagmaster420x]

Some people just don't have the technique to appreciate Liszt. And some are just pessimestae, people who only look at the flaws at the things they don't appreciate. And there are some who are just plain jealous of the magnificent capabilities of Arrau, Kissin, Khodolenko, etc (yet may not even know it.). As a result, they vent their jealousy on Liszt (but they might not know it). The last option is some people are just too dumb to understand the beauty of Liszt, despite years of experience.

Which one are you?

yup

[reiyza]

I wonder if people dislike liszt due to the level of technical demand that his piece(s) requires.

I for one, don't dislike him, nor do I like him, yes, as mentioned, I've only heard few of his piece(s) such as the transcendental etudes, few raphsodies, few sonatas and I can say, they are beutiful in their own way, but to deliver/interpret the music, one should have a high technical ability. Cough *feux follets*

[ahinton]

I wonder if people dislike liszt due to the level of technical demand that his piece(s) requires.

By "technical demand(s)" I take you to mean demands on mécanique. This, however, cannot be a credible reason. Not all of Liszt's piano works are of transcendental difficulty and by no means all of his music is for piano anyway; has anyone ever deplored Liszt because of the demands that he allegedly places upon orchestral players, or upon singers? If so, it's a new one on me.

Best,

Alistair

[reiyza]

By "technical demand(s)" I take you to mean demands on mécanique. This, however, cannot be a credible reason. Not all of Liszt's piano works are of transcendental difficulty and by no means all of his music is for piano anyway; has anyone ever deplored Liszt because of the demands that he allegedly places upon orchestral players, or upon singers? If so, it's a new one on me.

Best,

Alistair

I did say I was just wondering, then again, his most popular liebestraum and la campanella seems to have grown an attachment with me. Maybe I slightly disliked liszt due to the fact that I will never learn his piece(s) that well up to performance level.