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Topic: etude op25 #2 (chopin)  (Read 4779 times)

Offline gyzzzmo

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etude op25 #2 (chopin)
on: January 07, 2005, 03:00:17 PM
Hi everybody.

How should this etude be played? in 2/2 (6/8) or in 4/4?
To my opion 2/2 makes this piece far too easy to be a chopin etude.


Gyzzzmo
(when you say 4/4, you should try to play it in 4/4)
1+1=11

Offline Hmoll

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #1 on: January 07, 2005, 03:15:10 PM
Hi everybody.

How should this etude be played? in 2/2 (6/8) or in 4/4?
To my opion 2/2 makes this piece far too easy to be a chopin etude.


Gyzzzmo
(when you say 4/4, you should try to play it in 4/4)

Gyzzmo,

Look at the time signature. It's in 2/2.  The tempo indication is "presto," so 2 beats to the measure, at about 116 - or so - beats per minute hardly makes this piece easy.
"I am sitting in the smallest room of my house. I have your review before me. In a moment it will be behind me!" -- Max Reger

Offline chopin_girl

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #2 on: January 07, 2005, 03:16:14 PM
how the hell does measure make a piece difficult?
"As this cough will choke me, I implore you to have my body opened, so that I may not be buried alive." - Chopin's last written words

Offline gyzzzmo

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #3 on: January 07, 2005, 03:26:05 PM
there are thousends versions of his etudes, chopin changed them himself a lot. (i've seen it in 2/2, 6/8 and 4/4.
The etude is very easy to my opion, all close notes and you never have to jump.
That really makes it a easy piece for me.

You really should try to play it in 4/4.

Gyzzzmo

oh, chopin_girl:
try playing a part only with your right hand and play it as 4/4, so each thriol is a 1/4 note.
Then then add the left hand and try too play it in the 4/4 rithm of the right hand.
1+1=11

Offline musicsdarkangel

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #4 on: January 07, 2005, 06:16:03 PM
Definitely play this piece in 2.  To play it in 4 would make it not sound musical.

Listen to the left hand.  There is a pedal on each set of those triplets.  But even if you didn't pedal, how could you phrase the left hand musically unless it is in 2?


P.S.  If you are able to play it at moderately fast tempo in 4, please send me a recording. 

Offline anda

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #5 on: January 07, 2005, 06:16:52 PM
so, gyzzzmo, do you play this etude in 4/4? like i said (https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,6172.0.html), i'd be very curious to hear how this sounds, so, can you send me a recording?

Offline gyzzzmo

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #6 on: January 07, 2005, 09:52:09 PM
hi,
i try to play the piece in 4/4. But it is impossible to do it without any accents, and at high speed. But maybe it isnt supposed to be.

I havent got the possibility yet to record it.

Have you tried to play it 4/4?
Its difficult isnt it? I would call it the 'brain-splitting etude'then.

Gyzzzmo
1+1=11

Offline Awakening

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #7 on: January 08, 2005, 07:28:42 AM
It's definitely considered one of the easier etudes, but that's all relative.  In general, anything by Chopin is going to be difficult in one way or another, because he wrote complex, romantic pieces with a lot of depth and emotion.  Conveying that emotion is a challenge for any pianist, even though the technical difficulties may not be overwhelming.  25/2 is fast, which means that it requires stamina and careful, precise practice and a good memory.  However, the notes seem to fall under the fingers well, and there are no chords to speak of.  Not considered an "easy" piece, but easy compared to a harder Chopin Etude, such as 10/4, for example.  Not an easy piece for me to play at this stage in my education. 

Offline anda

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #8 on: January 08, 2005, 09:30:02 PM
hi,
i try to play the piece in 4/4. But it is impossible to do it without any accents, and at high speed. But maybe it isnt supposed to be.
HALLELUJAH!

Quote
Have you tried to play it 4/4?
Its difficult isnt it? I would call it the 'brain-splitting etude'then.

it's not supposed to be a 'brain-splitting etude'. it's all about musicality, it's about fluidity - it's supposed to be very fast and fluid.

Offline Hmoll

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #9 on: January 09, 2005, 12:17:05 AM
there are thousends versions of his etudes, chopin changed them himself a lot. (i've seen it in 2/2, 6/8 and 4/4.
The etude is very easy to my opion, all close notes and you never have to jump.
That really makes it a easy piece for me.

You really should try to play it in 4/4.

 

There are not thousands of versions ( I assume you mean editions) of this piece. HJowever, I've seen lots of different editions, and none of them have the time signature of 4/4.  If you know of any editions that have this piece in 4/4, let us know what they are.

The most basic understanding of this piece, and the overall rhythmic pulse of it, has the piece in 2/2. It makes absolutely no musical sense to think of it in 4/4.
"I am sitting in the smallest room of my house. I have your review before me. In a moment it will be behind me!" -- Max Reger

Offline gyzzzmo

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #10 on: January 09, 2005, 01:24:43 AM
thank you all for the reply's,

gyzzzmo.

(i must admit i still try to play the piece in 4/4, if only for my technique)
1+1=11

Offline Awakening

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #11 on: January 09, 2005, 02:55:52 AM


There are not thousands of versions ( I assume you mean editions) of this piece. HJowever, I've seen lots of different editions, and none of them have the time signature of 4/4.  If you know of any editions that have this piece in 4/4, let us know what they are.

The only version of this piece that I have looked at has it written in common time.  It's in an anthology of piano music that my teacher loaned me because it also contains Brahms' Rhapsody Op.79 No.2.  The anthology is entitled "The Romantic Period Volume III - A Repertory of Piano Works of the 19th Century" Selected and Edited by Denes Agay. 

Offline rhapsody in orange

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #12 on: January 23, 2005, 01:40:36 PM
Here's a little something I've found over at another site. I personally play it in cut-time (2/2) and it somehow give me the feeling that I'm playing it in 6/8. Anyway here's something just for a read.

Opus 25 no.2

This genesis of this work is to be found in Op.10 No.2, but this time with the added exercise of an essentially contrapuntal harmony in the left-hand triplets that combines with the right-hand figuration to produce a continuous series of delicate cross-accents and syncopations. The work divides into 3 sections bars 1-36, 37-50 and 51-69 but once again the divisions between these sections, particularly the first two, are blurred by the moto perpetuo of the right- and left-hand figurations.

The main difficulty with this work is that it is all too easy for the piece to fall into a false rhythm; the work is in 4/4 time, but it is very difficult for the pianist not to make it sound like six beats in the bar. The skill on the part of the pianist therefore, is to make the first note of each right-hand triplet very slightly detached and accented without disturbing the fluidity of the piece. Not only does this require a sensitive touch, but it also requires excellent legato playing, for, except where marked, the sustaining pedal must not be used. The central section, although short, does contain conflicting dynamics that are a reminder of Op.10 No.12, where crescendos in one hand must coexist with diminuendos in the other. This work should therefore be considered a mind exercise in that each hand must operate almost independently of the other; the triplets in both hands must be heard, but the 4 beats in the bar must be clear to the listener along with the sometimes conflicting dynamics that serve to bring out the left-hand counterpoint melody, especially in the central section.

This work is best learnt in two halves the opening section (bars 1-36) followed by the central and final sections (bars 37 onwards). I would also advise learning the right-hand figuration separately from the left, so that you can perfect the fingering before adding the left-hand. With both hands together, practice until you are up to the correct speed without any dynamics and pedal. Add these once you are happy that you can play the work from start to finish both piano and sempre legatissimo.
when words fail, music speaks

Offline brsmpianist

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Re: etude op25 #2 (chopin)
Reply #13 on: January 28, 2005, 12:43:58 AM
it's not supposed to be a 'brain-splitting etude'. it's all about musicality, it's about fluidity - it's supposed to be very fast and fluid.

YES I second that!  Ive heard too many people perform this piece way too slow... its a supposed to be a fast etude.  One comment about the left hand... bring out the bass notes (beat 1) it is a melodic line too, instead of plodding through all the quarter notes.  :)
 

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