performing on bad pianos

[anda]

all great pianists, besides being great, played only on best pianos. all these recordings we listen to today were made on the best pianos. i mean, horowitz even carried his piano with him arround the world - that's how much he hated the idea of having to perform on a piano he wouldn't like. and truth is anything sounds better on a good piano, and also true is that none of these recordings would sound just as good if they were made on poor instruments. (no disrespect intended here)

so do you have any personal experiences? anybody know what i mean - having to get on stage and play on a piano that will scream/whisper/sound like broken glass/be uneven/do anything to keep you from playing as you planned to? or worse: have you ever got up on the stage with an accute feeling that, after the morning rehearsal, the piano totally hates you?

(this is not a thread about good/bad pianos, it's about performing on impossible pianos)

[chopinguy]

I remember in one of my performances in front of the school in middle school, I had to play the Fantasie-Impromptu.  The grand piano had the dynamic range from about p to between mp and mf on a good piano, and the pedal half-worked.  Even so, everyone seemed to like it, even the music teachers.  It was fairly in tune.  Now that I look back, it was not so bad.

My music teacher did tell me a story about when a famous pianist had to perform somewhere in Asia in a hotel.  He got up to the stage, and realized the piano was slightly tilted (as in one of the legs was shorter).  Around the hotel auditorium there were axes, I think for in case of fire somehow.  He eventually got frustrated enough that he marched off the stage, seized and axe, and started hacking away at the longer leg.  So, it became level and he started playing again.

Now, he was performing in a place where it was ridiculously humid, and in a D major piece, one of the vital keys (I think it was G) began to stick, and then more keys began to stick. Anyways, eventually the pianist got so frustrated that he marched off the stage, took the axe, and began chopping at the piano again.  The audience at first thought it was because it was uneven, but soon they realized that he was not trying to level the piano, but that he was actually killing it!  After he destroyed the horrible piano, he left the stage.

I don't think this is totally accurate, I'm just recalling it from memory.  I think it happened a few years ago...

[amanfang]

I played at an Assisted Living place one time, and the A-flat below middle C would stick.  It was really bad when a guy came and played that night and played Chopin's Raindrop prelude.....

[shasta]

I played at an Assisted Living place one time, and the A-flat below middle C would stick.  It was really bad when a guy came and played that night and played Chopin's Raindrop prelude.....

LMAO!  I guess his version would've been the "Not-Quite-Raining" Raindrop Prelude.

I've had pianos roll away from me, I got a splinter in my finger from a crappy wooden piano bench just prior to beginning a recital, I've played outdoors on pianos plopped down in the grass that have been rained on... uggh

The best story is the one of Arrau playing in an outdoor recital in Chile and having chickens fly out of the piano as he began to play...

[pianobabe56]

Okay. I was performing as part of a Cello/Violin/Piano trio for a statewide competition (AWESOME experience). They had a gorgeous Yammy grand piano in the practice room, but as soon as we got into the performance room, I almost cried (half from nerves, half from the sight of the piano  ) It was scratched up like you wouldn't believe! I sat down to play, and it had this stringy, out-of-tune sound like you get in those rag-time pianos in bars in lousy westerns. *sigh* It really was terrible- absolutely the WORST piano I have EVER played on in my life! Oh well.

[jon]

A few months ago I was playing the Wilde Jagd for a piano competition and I was pretty excited cause the piano was a Steinway.It was not the worst I have played on such as pianos at nursing homes or trailor parks, but the key action was incredibly stiff.I've heard this is how alot of Steinways are but it was hard to perform also when the piano started shaking and moving not to mention I could hear trumpets and other instruments playing very loudly in the next room.

[galonia]

Once I played in one of my teacher's recitals, and she chose her church as the venue.  The piano was very old and badly maintained, so the keys were a bit chipped and all, however, you play whatever you have.  So I sat down and started my Mozart sonata KV 330 which is written in C Major.  The sound which came out was definitely NOT C major - I thought I had accidentally transposed my sonata!  But I looked down at my hands as I continued to play, and I looked like I was hitting the right notes.  I was really surprised.  At my next lesson, I asked my teacher and she said I was right, the piano is tuned a semitone lower than standard concert pitch so that it is in tune with the organ, and so that the congregation has an easier time singing the hymns!   

A year later, one of the groups of that church asked my teacher if she could organise an evening recital, and I was one of the artists.  We played in a small hall adjacent to the church, so this piano was in tune.  But it was even more poorly maintained than the piano in the church, so the wood of the a lot of the keys were exposed.  As I played, I felt as though the skin was being sand-papered off my fingers.  After this recital, my mother was chatting with a gentleman who commented on how well I played, and she said, "Yes, a pity that the piano is so awful."  Later, I told her that the man is the new pastor at the church.   

Happy ending: the church bought a new piano, and it is kept in the church building, and it is tuned at concert pitch.

[TheHammer]

The sound which came out was definitely NOT C major - I thought I had accidentally transposed my sonata! But I looked down at my hands as I continued to play, and I looked like I was hitting the right notes. I was really surprised. At my next lesson, I asked my teacher and she said I was right, the piano is tuned a semitone lower than standard concert pitch

The same happened to Beethoven when performing his first Piano Concerto in C Major. Well, he solved the situation by just transposing the Concerto in C# Major - while playing it of course!

[lostinidlewonder]

Ive played concerts many times around the place, and especially places where piano isnt really heard that often! I remember playing near a town in Antalyia (southern turkey) and the instrument was so crap midway through playing a few of the hammers actually broke, so there was no sound when i tried to hit them.

Ive found encountering bad Rooms to play in happens much more and can make the piano sound rubbish just as bad.

One international concert pianist i know personally who i shouldnt name, was so afraid of some bad pianos he actually put a ring of garlic around it. Cos he thought it was possessed cos it sounded so bad. lol.

It is good though to ply on a bad piano sometmies. Some honky Tonk music sounds utterly fantastic on a totally out of tune piano.

[jsfripp]

This is a very interesting one indeed. I did once have to give a recital on a piano that was very uneven and certainly became no great friend of mine before the concert. I had to give a 90mins recital in front of nearly 2500 people on something that seemed impossible to control. What I learnt was that, if one cannot do as Horowitz did (...!) to make the most of the morning rehearsal but really trying your utmost to explore as many different colours on the piano as possible. I found myself looking solely at what the piano could not do, rather than what it could, and although it was not a Steinway D or a Fazioli that I am used to, it helped just to think positively. Try to find boundries in terms of quiet playing, explore levels of voicing part playing, and just listen really intensely to what you are doing, not what you want to happen. That is the only advice I can give really to anybody in that situation!!!

[donjuan]

Yeah, performing of bad pianos is frustrating..I remember in an elementary school recital (500 kids sitting crosslegged in the Gym type of thing) I had to play a solo on their shitty stoneage Heintzman spinet and with the right pedal, it goes down halfway but doesnt come back up unless you put your foot under it and push it back up!  But you see, the thing is this- the wheels on the piano broke off earlier so the piano sits about an inch lower than it should and I couldnt get my foot under the pedal to push it back up.  haha so you can imagine what the music must have sounded like!  for the whole piece the damper pedal was stuck down...
it was just noise!!

and of course the worst part - everyone in the gymnasium is a musical ignoramous so the teachers are all like 'oh, that was a nice SONG, and you play it so well!!!"
donjuan

[Etude]

I once played in a recital at my old primary school, about 2 years ago.  The E-flat below middle C was stuck down and to make matters worse, I had programmed the second movement of Sonata Pathetique which has the repeated E-flat in the accompaniment.  At least no one noticed.  The piano was also quite out of tune.

[anda]

My music teacher did tell me a story about when a famous pianist had to perform somewhere in Asia in a hotel.  He got up to the stage, and realized the piano was slightly tilted (as in one of the legs was shorter).  Around the hotel auditorium there were axes, I think for in case of fire somehow.  He eventually got frustrated enough that he marched off the stage, seized and axe, and started hacking away at the longer leg.  So, it became level and he started playing again.

Now, he was performing in a place where it was ridiculously humid, and in a D major piece, one of the vital keys (I think it was G) began to stick, and then more keys began to stick. Anyways, eventually the pianist got so frustrated that he marched off the stage, took the axe, and began chopping at the piano again.  The audience at first thought it was because it was uneven, but soon they realized that he was not trying to level the piano, but that he was actually killing it!  After he destroyed the horrible piano, he left the stage.

I don't think this is totally accurate, I'm just recalling it from memory.  I think it happened a few years ago...

here's the actual story - funny as long as you're not the star 

https://users.actrix.co.nz/dgold/fun/bangkok.html

[anda]

accidents happen all the time (pianos out of tune, keys not working, stuff like that). i remember years ago, in a piano competition (one of the very few i ever took part in), the guy playing right before me broke a hammer and several strings, so i had to wait for almost an hour to get on stage, meanwhile staying in a freezing "practice room" without a piano. the worst part was that on the end he ranked just after me! i would have disqualified him for such brutal behaviour...

but what i had in mind is slightly different: i could upload recordings by some local pianists whom i highly respect, recordings made on local sa-called "piano concerts", and you would probably say "that's dull, colourless" and so on. and if i would get same things recorded on a true concert steinway, you'd say "wow, who's playing? is this from dg?". so, where's the fairness?

[lostinidlewonder]

That piano chopper is an urban legend.

https://www.snopes.com/humor/nonsense/piano.htm

[dinosaurtales]

all great pianists, besides being great, played only on best pianos. all these recordings we listen to today were made on the best pianos. i mean, horowitz even carried his piano with him arround the world - that's how much he hated the idea of having to perform on a piano he wouldn't like. and truth is anything sounds better on a good piano, and also true is that none of these recordings would sound just as good if they were made on poor instruments. (no disrespect intended here)

so do you have any personal experiences? anybody know what i mean - having to get on stage and play on a piano that will scream/whisper/sound like broken glass/be uneven/do anything to keep you from playing as you planned to? or worse: have you ever got up on the stage with an accute feeling that, after the morning rehearsal, the piano totally hates you?

(this is not a thread about good/bad pianos, it's about performing on impossible pianos)

I would expect a recording to be done on a good piano, but you may misunderstand  the other part - my teacher spent a career doing concerts and she seems to think that most recital pianos that these guys have to use are plum awful.  She says even places like Carnegie Hall have bad ones - I guess it's just something recital pianists have to get used to - playing on whatever is avaialble.

[ehpianist]

I once played the Trout Quintet on a very very bright piano in Norther Ireland (I think it was a Petrof) but when I went to use the una corda pedal (the left one) the whole keyboard shifted and stayed there, it wouldn't shift back.  And it was one of these pianos where the difference between una corda and tre corde was like having two different pianos, there was no in between. So where needed I would play una corda then casually grab the top C on the keyboard and pull the thing back into place and then keep playing.

Then there have been the sqeaky pedals, the irregular voicing, the rattles, the shifting benches, the middle pedal that caused every damper to lift and not come back down (and I needed it for that performance), broken strings, sticky keys, keys that won't even go down.  You name it, I have probably played it.

Elena
https://www.pianofourhands.com

[anda]

I once played the Trout Quintet on a very very bright piano in Norther Ireland (I think it was a Petrof) but when I went to use the una corda pedal (the left one) the whole keyboard shifted and stayed there, it wouldn't shift back.  And it was one of these pianos where the difference between una corda and tre corde was like having two different pianos, there was no in between. So where needed I would play una corda then casually grab the top C on the keyboard and pull the thing back into place and then keep playing.

Then there have been the sqeaky pedals, the irregular voicing, the rattles, the shifting benches, the middle pedal that caused every damper to lift and not come back down (and I needed it for that performance), broken strings, sticky keys, keys that won't even go down.  You name it, I have probably played it.

Elena
https://www.pianofourhands.com

unfortunately, i know what you mean... 

[janice]

So where needed I would play una corda then casually grab the top C on the keyboard and pull the thing back into place and then keep playing.

LOL--I can just picture this and the first thing that comes to mind is a picture of someone typing on a very very old typewriter and when they get to the end of the line, instead of hitting the 'return' key (which came out years later) they had to reach up with the right hand and manually push it back so that they could start typing on a new line.  (btw--younger folks, the "return' key was what is now the 'enter' key.)

[ehpianist]

(btw--younger folks, the "return' key was what is now the 'enter' key.)

Was that, like, back when they had those things called 8-tracks?

Elena
https://www.pianofourhands.com

[janice]

Was that, like, back when they had those things called 8-tracks?

YES!!! My parents had an 8-track player in their car.  I felt special!!  LOL (btw--younger folks, 8-track tapes preceeded cassettes, which preceeded CDs and then MP3s)

(feels ancient, but a bit happy that she can educate the younger folks!)

(goes back to rocking chair)

[hodi]

i remember playing bach's tocatta and fugue in d minor in a concert on a really crapty piano, the performance was rather bad, and it was mainly because of the piano!

[xvimbi]

the performance was rather bad, and it was mainly because of the piano!

Well then, apparently, I have been playing on bad pianos all my life, and they must have been REALLY bad, with the hammers hitting the wrong strings (like D rather than E), or with the pianos playing ff when I CLEARLY meant pp, and so on 

[anda]

one very recent: i accompanied a student in a recital. the piano i played on had just one problem (i mean, besides the fact that it's an old poor vienese): the fis in octave 1 sounded as fis+g! (the dampfer hit 2 groups of strings). so, my bigest concert for the recital was not to touch the fis

[anda]

i don't know if this qualifies - the piano wasn't too bad, but it was placed in a very tight space, so we were playing sitting very close to the piano (we had a 4 hands recital), i played up and i had to stretch my right elbow every time i had to play under c2. eventually i ended up with a light cramp, had to stop practicing for the next 3 days - and that meant my next recital (that happened to be solo) i got on stage with only the morning rehearsal 

[ehpianist]

4 hands in a cramped space... no fun, like we aren't cramped enough playing four hands.

I just remembered there was also the piano that was soooooo out of tune that every note was half a step lower, a C was a B, etc.  It was very disconcerting because I expected a certain sound to come out of the note and it was something completely different.  My hands had the impulse to compensate by playing half a tone up but I have no experience transposing and that would have been worse.  Took a while to get used to.

Elena
https://www.pianofourhands.com

[Axtremus]

Was playing four hand on a 9 foot concert grand that couldn't play loud and couldn't project -- the treble was especially weak, and the hall was quite noisy as well. I was playing the left half (secundo). After the performance, my partner who played the right half (primo) said to me: "I couldn't hear myself at all. I just played as hard as I could from memory and followed your beat."

Oh... the venue had only one adjustable piano bench. No duet bench. So I let my partner took the bench. I took a folding chair, stacked a thick phone book on it, and sat on that.

Also performed the same four-hand piece of a disappointing dinky upright once -- forget about dynamics and pedal control and phrasing -- we just played the notes and the rhythm, and hoped that the people at the back could hear us.

[anda]

Oh... the venue had only one adjustable piano bench. No duet bench. So I let my partner took the bench. I took a folding chair, stacked a thick phone book on it, and sat on that.

same thing happened to us - just 2 weeks ago! only thing, i'm not as mannered as you  i took the bench and my partener had to settle for a regular chair sitting on beethoven sonatas - thickest one we found on the spot 

[vivacelife]

My friend recorded her playings in a tape and sent it to a scholarship and they replied that her piano is out of tune and bad that they can't really comment on her playing... :-[Don't let that happen 2 u