Starting late while having strong discipline and limitless free time

[invinea]

Hello there.

Here's the deal: I'm 21 and I've played classical guitar since I was 14. My theory and score reading should be in check.
Recently I've decided to quit uni and focus only on my music skills. Since I have the privilege of being supported by my parents while studying I was thinking about doing something crazy: quit classical guitar too and start to dedicate literally all my free time to piano.
I'm pretty sure that I can practice for up to 8 to 10 hours everyday (I'm already doing it with my guitar) and I've got the money to take lessons everyday from pianist who is currently teaching in one of the best conservatories of my country, although he still doesn't know yet to what extent I want to devote myself to music.

That said my ambitions are not low: I truly want to master at least technically the instrument (on the musicality/talent part I'm already confident about myself), and personally I don't think I can be satisfied with any lesser result. 
I want to be able to play the Hammerklavier sonata at a concert level before I die.

Now, here's my question: how crazy is this? I know that the odds are extremely slim but as long as I can be a master in this craft I'll be satisfied. I don't really care about money or becoming famous, but from myself I expect the best and nothing less.

Are there some hard barrier (linked to my age) that will prevent me from doing it? Is relentless effort and dedication enough to become a great pianist, considering how much time I can easily devote to the instrument?

Thanks in adance for any answer.

[adodd81802]

Surely, you know whether or not it is crazy?

Have you not set the same standard to classical guitar? If so then you should be fully aware of the work that is required and potential obstacles that you may face.

Admittedly the instruments are fundamentally different but there are still points where the paths cross. For what reason would you want to switch in the first place?

A piano teacher every day will ensure that you can progress not only faster than someone without, but hopefully correctly, when others are in "trial and error mode"

It would be crazy if you had no support, no good instrument, no teacher and hope to quit your job and do this on a whim then yes.

One thing you should consider is your future. being a master of an instrument, isn't necessarily what sells yourself as a professional pianist. Is your financial supply truely endless? As of the small % that actually can claim to have mastered the instrument, an even smaller % can make a fine living off it.

Lastly RE your 8-10 hours a day of classical guitar... I don't think you can productively apply that same time at the piano. I'm not even sure what you can be doing at the guitar. Maybe i'm just being pedantic. Certainly initially apply a lot of time and effort into grasping the fundamentals, but as you progress, you'll probably do yourself a favour to occupy your mind with other things.

I mean think of potentially the last 7 years of 8-10 hours a day on classical guitar, and you're thinking to just switch instrument now. Sure you won't forget guitar, but what if this happens again with piano in another 7 years and you have really nothing to show for your accomplishments?

[invinea]

Surely, you know whether or not it is crazy?

Have you not set the same standard to classical guitar? If so then you should be fully aware of the work that is required and potential obstacles that you may face.

Admittedly the instruments are fundamentally different but there are still points where the paths cross. For what reason would you want to switch in the first place?

A piano teacher every day will ensure that you can progress not only faster than someone without, but hopefully correctly, when others are in "trial and error mode"

It would be crazy if you had no support, no good instrument, no teacher and hope to quit your job and do this on a whim then yes.

One thing you should consider is your future. being a master of an instrument, isn't necessarily what sells yourself as a professional pianist. Is your financial supply truely endless? As of the small % that actually can claim to have mastered the instrument, an even smaller % can make a fine living off it.

Lastly RE your 8-10 hours a day of classical guitar... I don't think you can productively apply that same time at the piano. I'm not even sure what you can be doing at the guitar. Maybe i'm just being pedantic. Certainly initially apply a lot of time and effort into grasping the fundamentals, but as you progress, you'll probably do yourself a favour to occupy your mind with other things.

I mean think of potentially the last 7 years of 8-10 hours a day on classical guitar, and you're thinking to just switch instrument now. Sure you won't forget guitar, but what if this happens again with piano in another 7 years and you have really nothing to show for your accomplishments?

In this case I'm really concerned about the technical aspect of learning the instrument as such a late age. Are there actual, anatomical inhibitions that start showing if you don't practice piano in your first years of life?

As I stated earlier I intend to take lessons everyday. I'm pretty sure about this and I want to do things the right way.

I can honestly say that financially I'm stable and as far as I know there won't ever be a period in my life in wich I'll actually have to endure poverty (unless the economy collapses, but I can't really do much about it). I think that I'm in the right enviroment to completely devote my life to the instrument.

Usually I practice technique 2 hours in the morning and 2 hours in the evening, I'll usually spend about 1 to 2 hours in 30-minutes sessions learning pieces and at night I'll just improvise for my own pleasure. I'm thinking about switching instrument for pure aesthetic reasons. The more I grow up the less I like classical guitar as an instrument. For the last 4 years switching to piano has been an obsession and I've finally decided to give in.
Having had this opinion for so long I don't think that I'll change my mind in 7 years from now, especially considering that all my favourite solo music is written for piano.

[brogers70]

Go for it. I also switched from classical guitar to piano at 40, never having played piano at all, without infinite financial resources, daily teaching, or unlimited free time. I retired at 54 and found an excellent teacher who teaches me as though I were 14 and trying to develop a technique that would get me into conservatory. I'm not remotely close to being able to play the Hammerklavier, but the mid-level Beethoven sonatas are technically doable, Opus 14, Opus 26, the Pastorale, as well as the Well Tempered Clavier, and plenty of Brahms and Schubert. Before I retired I had about 1.5 hours a day to practice, now I do 3-4. There's an instinctive comfort with the keyboard that I think kids who start very young have, and it's taken me many years to get even some of that, but nether I nor my teacher really think there are any specific physical limitations due to age. You have many advantages and lots of time and if you love it, just do it.

The reasons I switched from guitar were...First, the guitar has a pretty limited range in both pitch and volume. Second, while there's a lot of great Baroque music available for guitar, and Spanish late Romantic and contemporary music, there's a big whole in the classical and early romantic repertoire. Sor and Carcassi just can't stand next to Mozart and Beethoven and Schubert.

I'm jealous of all your free time from such a young age.

[adodd81802]

There are studies to suggest that early exposure to the piano is essential for long term progression, however (without researching) I don't think this is limited to piano specifically, but actually the learning of a musical instrument in general.

There are aspects of co-ordination, rhythm and separate management that while come natural if developed early, are a very foreign concept to late starters.

As mentioned if you are competent in Guitar I see no reason why you couldn't succeed at the piano. There are many successful musicians that switched instruments (I am sure the knowledge of Pianostreet can provide you with names)

As long as you can come to terms with the final consequence - guitars get girls, pianos.. not so much

[timothy42b]

As long as you can come to terms with the final consequence - guitars get girls, pianos.. not so much

This. 

[kevingreiner]

Hello there.

Here's the deal: I'm 21 and I've played classical guitar since I was 14. My theory and score reading should be in check.
Recently I've decided to quit uni and focus only on my music skills. Since I have the privilege of being supported by my parents while studying I was thinking about doing something crazy: quit classical guitar too and start to dedicate literally all my free time to piano.
I'm pretty sure that I can practice for up to 8 to 10 hours everyday (I'm already doing it with my guitar) and I've got the money to take lessons everyday from pianist who is currently teaching in one of the best conservatories of my country, although he still doesn't know yet to what extent I want to devote myself to music.

That said my ambitions are not low: I truly want to master at least technically the instrument (on the musicality/talent part I'm already confident about myself), and personally I don't think I can be satisfied with any lesser result. 
I want to be able to play the Hammerklavier sonata at a concert level before I die.

Now, here's my question: how crazy is this? I know that the odds are extremely slim but as long as I can be a master in this craft I'll be satisfied. I don't really care about money or becoming famous, but from myself I expect the best and nothing less.

Are there some hard barrier (linked to my age) that will prevent me from doing it? Is relentless effort and dedication enough to become a great pianist, considering how much time I can easily devote to the instrument?

Thanks in adance for any answer.

Don't worry about starting too late and follow your dreams. You should be a musician for the enjoyment of music, and not worry about all of the bull crap like practicing for 8 to 10 hours a day.

Practicing isn't about time, but how you practice. The way we treat our piano is how the music will sound. Everything we do about music comes from our mind. That is my most valuable tip I can give you. Focus on your attitude at the piano, correct piano practice, and your goals! Don't worry about what anyone else thinks of your playing. You are young and have more time to live than you think!

[invinea]

Don't worry about starting too late and follow your dreams. You should be a musician for the enjoyment of music, and not worry about all of the bull crap like practicing for 8 to 10 hours a day.

Practicing isn't about time, but how you practice. The way we treat our piano is how the music will sound. Everything we do about music comes from our mind. That is my most valuable tip I can give you. Focus on your attitude at the piano, correct piano practice, and your goals! Don't worry about what anyone else thinks of your playing. You are young and have more time to live than you think!

Well, considering that my goal is to become a concert pianist I think that I should actually worry about how much am I practicing.
Also to be fair I always have lot of fun playing music, I feel that I can play and compose on classical guitar all day along, I don't see why should that change with piano.

Go for it. I also switched from classical guitar to piano at 40, never having played piano at all, without infinite financial resources, daily teaching, or unlimited free time. I retired at 54 and found an excellent teacher who teaches me as though I were 14 and trying to develop a technique that would get me into conservatory. I'm not remotely close to being able to play the Hammerklavier, but the mid-level Beethoven sonatas are technically doable, Opus 14, Opus 26, the Pastorale, as well as the Well Tempered Clavier, and plenty of Brahms and Schubert. Before I retired I had about 1.5 hours a day to practice, now I do 3-4. There's an instinctive comfort with the keyboard that I think kids who start very young have, and it's taken me many years to get even some of that, but nether I nor my teacher really think there are any specific physical limitations due to age. You have many advantages and lots of time and if you love it, just do it.

The reasons I switched from guitar were...First, the guitar has a pretty limited range in both pitch and volume. Second, while there's a lot of great Baroque music available for guitar, and Spanish late Romantic and contemporary music, there's a big whole in the classical and early romantic repertoire. Sor and Carcassi just can't stand next to Mozart and Beethoven and Schubert.

I'm jealous of all your free time from such a young age.

Thank you for your experience and support.

[indianajo]

The too late question has to do with how developed your fine motor control has been encouraged by guitar practice.  
The brain grows extra connections in areas where it has been used.  This is easier in youth.  Many youth miss out on fine motor control of the hands and fingers because they spend their time kicking and heading a football, for example.
Your left finger control area (using the conventional posture of holding the guitar)  should be very good.  The left hand picks out the chords.
Your right finger control area will be good if you are a finger picker. If you use a pick, thumb and forefinger only, your 3,4,5 finger control may be undeveloped.  
To concentrate development of 3,4,5 in  the days you may have left, I would do Schmitt exercises, which develop the finger strength and control, equally.  These are available from PIanostreet for download.  I used the G. Schirmer version.  I only did them for 18 months, and only for about 10 minutes a day.  The total of my practice, as a child, maxed out at an hour a day.  
I hope you are enjoying yourself.  Best of luck in achieving your endeavors.  

[scientificpianopractise]

Go for it.  But don't take too much advice.  Piano practice has so far been extremely inefficient.  Forget about Hanon & Czerny.  Use my "Hanon in 60 seconds".  And then think about what you are practicing and limit the practice to two hours a day...

[dogperson]

Go for it.  But don't take too much advice.  Piano practice has so far been extremely inefficient.  Forget about Hanon & Czerny.  Use my "Hanon in 60 seconds".  And then think about what you are practicing and limit the practice to two hours a day...

Another ad opportunity?   Really disgusting

[adodd81802]

Go for it.  But don't take too much advice.  Piano practice has so far been extremely inefficient.  Forget about Hanon & Czerny.  Use my "Hanon in 60 seconds".  And then think about what you are practicing and limit the practice to two hours a day...

"don't take too much advice" just take my advice, yeah sure buddy. #Shamelessadvertisingforpersonalselfgain

[dogperson]

"don't take too much advice" just take my advice, yeah sure buddy. #Shamelessadvertisingforpersonalselfgain

Interesting that the Amazon web 'look inside' only shows the foreward and not part of the exercises,  nor has scientificpianopractice ever shared any section of this book with the forum.  It seems like no  comments are really wanted...  just an ad for 'buy me',  'contribute your money with no idea of the value'.

[bernadette60614]

I would ask: What level of concert artist? 

My piano teacher is a concert artist...but her concerts are in local venues.  She has a Masters' in Piano Performance with Honors and started piano when she was 5. She also attended conservatory as a high school student. 

I don't think it is realistic to expect that you will become a world class concert pianist at the level of Kissin, Van Cliburn, Gould starting at 21.  You may, however, have a local concert career. 

[pianoamatuer]

Gopher it man.
Following brogers70, all I gotta add is well.. here's some encouragement!
If you can believe it, your mind will achieve it. Heard that from somewhere.
Oh, yeah. Piano is loads of fun but it does have its roadblocks. Expect frustration. But you should be familiar with that concept. Life just loves to frustrate us!
Piano shouldn't treble you too much though, especially if you really have that long term desire to play the instrument.  See what I did there? 

[quantum]

Well, considering that my goal is to become a concert pianist I think that I should actually worry about how much am I practicing.

How you practice - what you do while practicing - matters far more than how long your sessions are.  If you could accomplish the work of 8 hours in 1 hour, why would you not do that?

[outin]

How you practice - what you do while practicing - matters far more than how long your sessions are.  If you could accomplish the work of 8 hours in 1 hour, why would you not do that?

It's quite a common mistake to think that if you can achieve x amount in 1 hour, you can achieve 5 times x in 5 hours.