Piano Forum



Does Rachmaninoff Touch Your Heart?
Today, with smartwatches and everyday electronics, it is increasingly common to measure training results, heart rate, calorie consumption, and overall health. But monitoring heart rate of pianists and audience can reveal interesting insights on several other aspects within the musical field. Read more >>

Topic: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?  (Read 8624 times)

Offline clarinetist

  • PS Silver Member
  • Newbie
  • ***
  • Posts: 21
What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
on: April 04, 2017, 12:11:02 PM
Here's what I've learned in the last year or so:

Bach - Two-Part Invention #1
Beethoven - Pathetique Sonata (Op. 13), 2nd movement
Debussy - La fille aux cheveux de lin (from Preludes, Book I)
Debussy - Des pas sur la neige (from Preludes, Book I)
Shostakovich - Prelude #1 from the 24 Preludes (Op. 34)
Chopin - Waltz in c# minor (Op. 64 #2)

Fortunately, unlike what I stated in this post, I finally was able to learn the c# minor waltz. This was because I intentionally aimed to improve some fundamentals of piano technique that I was getting wrong (pressing keys down = bad) and I've intentionally improved my sightreading skills.

My objectives are the same (note the added underlined emphasis):

Quote
My interests are mainly in late-Romantic and 20th century music (Rachmaninoff, Chopin, Ravel, Debussy, Prokofiev, etc.).

I'm mainly interested in some repertoire that I can have to play for my teacher once I meet up with him again in the summer/fall that I can pull together in 2-3 hours a week of practice. Do any of you have recommendations, given this information? I've had a hard time learning fast pieces - most (if not all) of the pieces I've learned are at a slow to moderate tempo, so something fast that would be doable in that time frame for me would be great.

Any suggestions? I'll be working to get my scales and arpeggios to eighth notes at quarter note = 240 as well. (This will obviously take a long time, but better now than later.)
Sign up for a Piano Street membership to download this piano score.
Sign up for FREE! >>

Offline mjames

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2553
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #1 on: April 04, 2017, 02:38:19 PM
Op. 25 no. 6
Op. 25 no. 11
Ballade op. 52

For Chopin

Gaspard de la Nuit by Ravel is good for a warm-up exercise.

Offline clarinetist

  • PS Silver Member
  • Newbie
  • ***
  • Posts: 21
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #2 on: April 04, 2017, 03:24:37 PM
Op. 25 no. 6
Op. 25 no. 11
Ballade op. 52

For Chopin

Gaspard de la Nuit by Ravel is good for a warm-up exercise.

I really hope you're trolling.

Although I may appear ignorant of piano repertoire at my level, I'm definitely aware of technically difficult works for piano and know I'm definitely nowhere near the skill level to approach these pieces.

Offline dogperson

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1559
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #3 on: April 04, 2017, 08:54:45 PM
I really hope you're trolling.

Although I may appear ignorant of piano repertoire at my level, I'm definitely aware of technically difficult works for piano and know I'm definitely nowhere near the skill level to approach these pieces.


You know it's a shame Some people just can't either offer genuine help or refrain from replying at all

Since you Are a Debussy  fan, look at
Snow is falling or flowers in the rain ... sorry I'm typing from my cell phone, and don't really have easy access for the French Title  but you can find it this way   

For Chopin, I gravitate toward the slow as well but you might want to look at the mazurkas  such as Opus 50 number three. Not sure this meets your fast enough criteria

If you don't find anything appealing,  i'll do some more thinking and I'm sure there are other fmembers here that will offer some real advice

Offline mjames

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2553
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #4 on: April 04, 2017, 10:21:00 PM
No, I'm not trolling. I'm being serious. Those are my recommendations. I don't understand people who make recommendation threads. Instead of waiting for people to give you lists of music you were going to listen to anyways, why not just go on youtube and do the job yourself? Use the search function and read threads about all the composers you mentioned. All of their works are categorized in terms of difficulty. All of their works have organized playlists on youtube. Go and listen to music and make your choice. You're the one who knows you the best, not us.

Sorry for not appealing to your laziness.

Offline clarinetist

  • PS Silver Member
  • Newbie
  • ***
  • Posts: 21
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #5 on: April 04, 2017, 11:35:16 PM
No, I'm not trolling. I'm being serious. Those are my recommendations. I don't understand people who make recommendation threads. Instead of waiting for people to give you lists of music you were going to listen to anyways, why not just go on youtube and do the job yourself? Use the search function and read threads about all the composers you mentioned. All of their works are categorized in terms of difficulty. All of their works have organized playlists on youtube. Go and listen to music and make your choice. You're the one who knows you the best, not us.

Sorry for not appealing to your laziness.

Thank you for assuming that I didn't do any research prior to writing this thread. /s I had searched this forum for Chopin, Rachmaninoff, Debussy, and Ravel threads, and essentially, most repertoire I've heard already that would be appropriate at my level would be something like a Mazurka or a Waltz by Chopin, most of which I'm not interested in pursuing. There are way too many Mazurkas and Waltzes out there that Chopin wrote, and I don't have the time to listen to all of them. Furthermore, mostly everything that I know of by Debussy, Rachmaninoff, and Ravel is inaccessible.

Saying that Gaspard de la Nuit is a warm-up exercise for someone who is playing grade-8-ish repertoire is like recommending that a beginner warm-up with Rach 3.

You know it's a shame Some people just can't either offer genuine help or refrain from replying at all

Since you Are a Debussy  fan, look at
Snow is falling or flowers in the rain ... sorry I'm typing from my cell phone, and don't really have easy access for the French Title  but you can find it this way   

For Chopin, I gravitate toward the slow as well but you might want to look at the mazurkas  such as Opus 50 number three. Not sure this meets your fast enough criteria

If you don't find anything appealing,  i'll do some more thinking and I'm sure there are other fmembers here that will offer some real advice
I've tried the Children's Corner several times now and have given up with the first movement (the Doctor Gradus) for now, because it's just too many notes. I can't figure out a way to approach this other than to stare at the keys as my fingers touch them, and slowly practice the runs - they're not straightforward arpeggios. Do people who play this piece tend to stare at the keys when they're playing it? My teacher had told me that "The Snow is Dancing" is harder than the Doctor Gradus. Do you have any insight here?

Gardens in the Rain from the Estampes - one Debussy piece I haven't tried playing yet; I'll look into it. Thank you! From looking at the sheet music, this reminds me a lot of the first movement of the Pour Le Piano. EDIT: From sightreading this, it's a lot more straightforward than the Doctor Gradus from Children's Corner. Thank you again!

And that's a very delightful Mazurka. Thank you for this as well!

Offline visitor

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5294
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #6 on: April 05, 2017, 12:21:53 AM

=)

Offline chopinlover01

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2117
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #7 on: April 05, 2017, 01:53:15 AM
Giant Steps.

Offline mjames

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2553
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #8 on: April 05, 2017, 02:38:10 AM
If you can play the waltz properly at the indicated tempo then ----> you can play all of them. Op.24 no.2, Op.42, and op. 64 no. 3 are my favorites.
The mazurkas, many of them are short and melodic, and provide a pretty decent challenge too.





Here's an accessible rachmaninoff piece:



There are lots of preludes by Rach and Debussy that grade-ish. Rach's d major, c sharp minor, gmajor...?
Debussy's girl with flaxen hair, no. 5 from book 1? Don't be lazy.

Offline danielo

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 49
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #9 on: April 06, 2017, 12:09:43 PM
Op. 25 no. 6
Op. 25 no. 11
Ballade op. 52

For Chopin

Gaspard de la Nuit by Ravel is good for a warm-up exercise.

Yes, it is a shame mjames that you felt the need to wade in with such a petty and snarky comment.....this piano forum is a community, we help each other, we give and take advice. Sometimes people just want an opinion, or maybe a window into a composer's work that they hadn't heard of before.

With regards to things to try after Chopin's waltz, I would say that Rachmaninov's famous prelude in C#minor would not be out of reach. Also Debussy's arabesques, Schubert's beautiful Impromptu No3, even Liszt's Liebestraum No.3. That is definitely more difficult but actually not as hard as it sounds. Codas are trickiest part and need plenty of slow practice. All those pieces are real crowd-pleasers, and not out of reach. Learning all of them will take your piano playing up a level.
Learning:

Rachmaninov Preludes Op10 1, 4 and 5
Chopin Ballade in G Minor
Chopin Etude Op10 No 2
Schubert Impromptu No 3

Offline imaginatorium

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #10 on: April 06, 2017, 08:05:05 PM
Perhaps if you aim to be a professional concert pianist you need to start thinking about playing the pieces your audience wants to get for their money. But otherwise, really, how can you ask "What piece"? A quick trip to IMSLP+piano produces: "Pages in category ‘For piano’: ... 23,603 total." OK, perhaps 90% of these are not interesting... I couldn't resist looking at the very first, a fantasy on "Ann Boleyn" (Donizetti's opera) by an obscure 19thC French composer, and yeah, it wasn't appealing. But 10% is still 2360. How many composers are named in this thread so far? 10+? What about Scriabin (preludes op11, etude op8-4), Bowen (op128), Granados, Scott Joplin, Lyadov (Op 57), Sibelius, Faure (nocturnes), MacDowell (Woodland sketches), Godowsky (transcription of the Swan from Carnival of the animals; not impossible), Lyapunov, Chasins (Flirtation in a Chinese garden), Dohnanyi (Rhapsody no. 3), Ibert (Histoires), Grieg, Shostakovich (Op. 5), Moszkowski (Etincelles), Prokofiev (Sonata 1), Nazareth (Maly, tango para piano), need I say more. These are all pieces I have played, tried to play, or meant to get round to learning properly, or heard as Horowitz encores or similar. If you just play the same pieces as everyone else, it's going to be hard to find your own individuality, and I think exploring really helps with musical thinking. Specially Scriabin. Try Opp 11-11, 16-1, 37-1, 37-2... Your jumping will improve, at least. HTH

Offline chechig

  • PS Silver Member
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 215
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #11 on: April 06, 2017, 08:53:55 PM
What about Reverie or Arabesque n 1 by Debussy?
Or Prelude n 13 op 28 or Nocturne in C sharp minor by Chopin? All this pieces are amazing!!
There is also a piece by Rachmaninov that I love, "Morceau de fantasie", but not the very difficult ones, this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kQYCsI5A78

Offline chopinlover01

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2117
Re: What to learn after Chopin's Waltz in c# minor?
Reply #12 on: April 07, 2017, 04:36:42 PM
The Rachmaninov Op. 3 are definitely a step up from the Op. 64/2, though.

I'd take a look at his other set of pieces, I think it was either Op. 10 or Op. 14.

You could also (gasp) play jazz. I'm a recent convert, and I promise, it does wonders for your classical playing.
For more information about this topic, click search below!
 

Logo light pianostreet.com - the website for classical pianists, piano teachers, students and piano music enthusiasts.

Subscribe for unlimited access

Sign up

Follow us

Piano Street Digicert