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Topic: How to play fast and light on a piano with heavy keys (Read 6521 times)

beethovenfan01

Sr. Member
Posts: 288

How to play fast and light on a piano with heavy keys

on: June 04, 2018, 07:04:59 PM

Hi all,

So lately I've been getting into a lot more pieces that are predominantly fast and light (ie, Beethoven's Waldstein Sonata, Rachmaninoff's Prelude Op. 23 No. 7, and Debussy's Gardens in the Rain). The problem I face over and over again is the transition from my own home piano, which has fairly light keys, to the concert grands I perform on.

The issue comes in compensating for the difference in touch. When I'm playing something slow, heavy, or mostly loud, it doesn't matter so much. But when it comes to pieces like Debussy's Gardens in the Rain, which are not only fast but very dense and mostly P or PP, I have to dig into the keys more to avoid dropping notes. Unfortunately, this also results in a general increase in dynamics--P becomes MF, and MF becomes F or even FF (unfortunately). This, in my mind, destroys the music's intent.

Perhaps my ear is just too used to playing quiet and I need to readjust my mental dynamic higher? But this doesn't seem appropriate, as I've been told multiple times to bring my dynamics down, and when I listen to recordings after, my performances are often much louder than I would like. It's certainly exciting for the audience, but it doesn't convey the message I want.

Is there a technique gap here? If so, how would I fix it? I am currently at a loss as to how to approach this problem.

I do try out the pianos beforehand, but this rarely helps me. All it does it let me know ahead of time that I'm going to have to play louder ... which I don't want. So I end up more frustrated during the performance, focused on only one aspect of it instead all of it.

Any thoughts?

Thanks!

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Practicing:
Bach Chromatic Fantasie and Fugue
Beethoven Sonata Op. 10 No. 1
Shostakovich Preludes Op. 34
Scriabin Etude Op. 2 No. 1
Liszt Fantasie and Fugue on BACH

rachmaninoff_forever

PS Silver Member
Sr. Member
Posts: 5038

Re: How to play fast and light on a piano with heavy keys

Reply #1 on: June 04, 2018, 07:58:53 PM

I used to have that same problem but now I lowkey prefer the action to be as heavy as possible.

IMO I think it's a coordination and relaxation thing that just comes with experience and time

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louispodesta

Sr. Member
Posts: 1077

Re: How to play fast and light on a piano with heavy keys

Reply #2 on: June 09, 2018, 11:19:54 PM

All Concert Pianists (with the exception of Claudio Arrau) show up before Rehearsal and try out the piano, and then make recommended changes.

After that (before the Performance), they see to it that all of the necessary adjustments have been made.

Oh Gosh, that means: no Pianist would (having had a conversation with the Tuner/Technician who worked on the instrument), would ever Play/Perform on a "Stiff Action."

Please hold yourself to the same standard. I have!

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beethovenfan01

Sr. Member
Posts: 288

Re: How to play fast and light on a piano with heavy keys

Reply #3 on: June 10, 2018, 12:30:45 AM

Quote

All Concert Pianists (with the exception of Claudio Arrau) show up before Rehearsal and try out the piano, and then make recommended changes.

After that (before the Performance), they see to it that all of the necessary adjustments have been made.

Oh Gosh, that means: no Pianist would (having had a conversation with the Tuner/Technician who worked on the instrument), would ever Play/Perform on a "Stiff Action."

Please hold yourself to the same standard. I have!

Unfortunately as much as I would like that luxury, I generally haven't had that option ... maybe in the future that will change.

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Practicing:
Bach Chromatic Fantasie and Fugue
Beethoven Sonata Op. 10 No. 1
Shostakovich Preludes Op. 34
Scriabin Etude Op. 2 No. 1
Liszt Fantasie and Fugue on BACH

ted

PS Silver Member
Sr. Member
Posts: 4012

Re: How to play fast and light on a piano with heavy keys

Reply #4 on: June 10, 2018, 08:27:55 AM

My piano has a very heavy action, which visitors who play it always remark about, but I have never had a problem playing rapidly and lightly if required. In fact I have the opposite issue, and on the rare occasions I play another piano, invariably with a lighter touch, it takes me a few minutes to work out how to stop it running away with me. My daily use of a Virgil Practice Clavier might have some bearing on it of course.

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"Mistakes are the portals of discovery." - James Joyce

louispodesta

Sr. Member
Posts: 1077

Re: How to play fast and light on a piano with heavy keys

Reply #5 on: June 10, 2018, 11:07:28 PM

Quote from: beethovenfan01 on June 10, 2018, 12:30:45 AM

Unfortunately as much as I would like that luxury, I generally haven't had that option ... maybe in the future that will change.

Thank you for your thoughtful inquiry. It (unlike what you naturally assume), is not a problem specific to you but, instead, is universal in nature - in my opinion.

So, if you do not have the intestinal fortitude/GUTS! to demand/insist that the instrument that you play/perform on is properly "Regulated," then I want you to think about this reality.

When you play "For The Rest Of Your Life," those who would critique you will NEVER consider that the Piano is to blame. Ever!

For the record, (I was in attendance) people are still talking about the 1974 Performance of Claudio Arrau in Austin, Texas. Why? Because when he played the Schumann Symphonic Etudes, you could not hear the scale passages at the top.

The idiot technician had lightened up the action to that point. And, the idiot performer did not test it out ahead of time.

All the best.

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lostinidlewonder

PS Silver Member
Sr. Member
Posts: 7839

Re: How to play fast and light on a piano with heavy keys

Reply #6 on: June 11, 2018, 05:59:41 AM

Over time you get accustomed to play different types of piano, the ones I dread are those with keys slightly narrower than normal! Something I notice when I play very light action pianos is that I keep my fingers slightly lower than necessary I can play much more lazily however with heavy action I tend to be "more above" the keys, my fingers more raised, I may sit upright more.

It is without doubt that a piano with very heavy action will tax your stamina more so than one with lighter action, this is a problem that is difficult to solve unless you have much experience playing on heavier actions. I grew up with a heavy action Bechstein so when I played the Yamahas at school or at my teachers studio it felt super light and I had to learn to play quieter. I never experienced the challenges coming from a light piano to heavy but see it all the time with my students (especially those who come play on my old Bechstein). Over time they get accustomed to a heavy action but it takes a while and some lament how much more efficient in technique one needs to be for fast runs on a heavy action, that technical tightrope certainly is narrower. I generally encourage them to play quieter than normal on heavy action so they can preserve their stamina and still play with technical efficiency and as they build up their affinity with a heavy action they can then focus on a larger sound.

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scarlattian

PS Silver Member
Newbie
Posts: 1

Re: How to play fast and light on a piano with heavy keys

Reply #7 on: September 04, 2022, 02:18:51 AM

Quote from: louispodesta on June 10, 2018, 11:07:28 PM

Thank you for your thoughtful inquiry. It (unlike what you naturally assume), is not a problem specific to you but, instead, is universal in nature - in my opinion.

So, if you do not have the intestinal fortitude/GUTS! to demand/insist that the instrument that you play/perform on is properly "Regulated," then I want you to think about this reality.

When you play "For The Rest Of Your Life," those who would critique you will NEVER consider that the Piano is to blame. Ever!

For the record, (I was in attendance) people are still talking about the 1974 Performance of Claudio Arrau in Austin, Texas. Why? Because when he played the Schumann Symphonic Etudes, you could not hear the scale passages at the top.

The idiot technician had lightened up the action to that point. And, the idiot performer did not test it out ahead of time.

All the best.

Hi Louis,

I am thrilled to find your reference to the 1974 Arrau concert in Austin, Texas, the only mention of it I could find anywhere online. I was there and do remember that the Symphonic Etudes was in the program but not anything else except that later I went back stage and shook Mr Arrau's hand which to this day I still remember as being the softest, most supple male person's hand I have ever touched. Anyway, could I please ask you to remind me of the date of the concert, what else he played that evening and where I can read the discussions/talks about his performance which you mentioned above?

I would appreciate your help.

Ghiaath Beiràque
Australia

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cuberdrift

PS Silver Member
Sr. Member
Posts: 618

Re: How to play fast and light on a piano with heavy keys

Reply #8 on: September 07, 2022, 11:25:23 AM

Just practise slowly and also use the first part of the Liszt exercises to strengthen the fingers.

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Topic: How to play fast and light on a piano with heavy keys (Read 6521 times)

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