Piano Forum



International Piano Day 2024
Piano Day is an annual worldwide event that takes place on the 88th day of the year, which in 2024 is March 28. Established in 2015, it is now well known across the globe. Every year it provokes special concerts, onstage and online, as well as radio shows, podcasts, and playlists. Read more >>

Topic: Bach Scholar - Tempos  (Read 2468 times)

Offline samwitdangol

  • PS Silver Member
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 110
Bach Scholar - Tempos
on: May 06, 2020, 05:43:49 PM
Hello!

At the beginning of his Bach Invention and Sinfonia videos, BachScholar states that he has used an "innovative science method" to figure out the ideal tempo that Bach would have wanted. Does anybody happen to know what this "innovative science method is?" I'm curious; I can't understand how someone can figure out what tempo Bach would have wanted.

Offline quantum

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 6221
Re: Bach Scholar - Tempos
Reply #1 on: May 06, 2020, 06:40:29 PM
Even if one could determine the "ideal" tempo Bach would have wanted, what would that mean for your own playing of this music?  Tempo is informed by many factors such as the instrument, performance space, and acoustic.  Could the composer possibly have accounted for every permutation of performance variable in determining his "ideal" performance tempo? 

I find ears as one of the best informants for determining tempo. 
Made a Liszt. Need new Handel's for Soler panel & Alkan foil. Will Faure Stein on the way to pick up Mendels' sohn. Josquin get Wolfgangs Schu with Clara. Gone Chopin, I'll be Bach

Offline samwitdangol

  • PS Silver Member
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 110
Re: Bach Scholar - Tempos
Reply #2 on: May 06, 2020, 06:44:08 PM
Even if one could determine the "ideal" tempo Bach would have wanted, what would that mean for your own playing of this music?  Tempo is informed by many factors such as the instrument, performance space, and acoustic.  Could the composer possibly have accounted for every permutation of performance variable in determining his "ideal" performance tempo? 

I find ears as one of the best informants for determining tempo.

Yes, I agree. There's no such thing as the "ideal" tempo, because tempo is subjective.
I'm just curious as to how someone today could figure the tempo that someone three-hundred years ago wanted.

Online brogers70

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1601
Re: Bach Scholar - Tempos
Reply #3 on: May 06, 2020, 07:02:45 PM
Hello!

At the beginning of his Bach Invention and Sinfonia videos, BachScholar states that he has used an "innovative science method" to figure out the ideal tempo that Bach would have wanted. Does anybody happen to know what this "innovative science method is?" I'm curious; I can't understand how someone can figure out what tempo Bach would have wanted.

I can't remember exactly, but it had something to do with tempi such that the time it takes to play the prelude is some simple fraction of the time it takes to play the fugue, or vice versa. It seemed pretty arbitrary to me.

Offline samwitdangol

  • PS Silver Member
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 110
Re: Bach Scholar - Tempos
Reply #4 on: May 06, 2020, 07:11:30 PM
I can't remember exactly, but it had something to do with tempi such that the time it takes to play the prelude is some simple fraction of the time it takes to play the fugue, or vice versa. It seemed pretty arbitrary to me.

Thank you!

Offline perfect_pitch

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 8494
Re: Bach Scholar - Tempos
Reply #5 on: May 07, 2020, 02:10:44 PM
At the beginning of his Bach Invention and Sinfonia videos, BachScholar states that he has used an "innovative science method" to figure out the ideal tempo that Bach would have wanted. Does anybody happen to know what this "innovative science method is?" I'm curious; I can't understand how someone can figure out what tempo Bach would have wanted.

BachScholar is a pompous arsehole who thinks he knows better than he really does. I questioned him once about a performance he was uploading as he played the piece accenting it like you would in a 12/16 manner, instead of standard semiquavers in a 3/4 time signature and he went off in a tirade, claiming I was an ignoramus (or something similar), and when other people backed me up - he started disabling comments for his videos.

He also claims to be a publisher, but it's been proven that he takes out of print scores, trims margins a little and sells it as if it is his.

I wouldn't listen to anything he says.

Offline samwitdangol

  • PS Silver Member
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 110
Re: Bach Scholar - Tempos
Reply #6 on: May 07, 2020, 02:24:33 PM
BachScholar is a pompous arsehole who thinks he knows better than he really does. I questioned him once about a performance he was uploading as he played the piece accenting it like you would in a 12/16 manner, instead of standard semiquavers in a 3/4 time signature and he went off in a tirade, claiming I was an ignoramus (or something similar), and when other people backed me up - he started disabling comments for his videos.

He also claims to be a publisher, but it's been proven that he takes out of print scores, trims margins a little and sells it as if it is his.

I wouldn't listen to anything he says.

I looked through some past threads and noticed that he has quite a reputation here at PianoStreet.
I also noticed that most of his videos have comments disabled.
Is he really the same as he was a few years ago? Still a fraud?

Offline dogperson

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1559
Re: Bach Scholar - Tempos
Reply #7 on: May 07, 2020, 07:11:52 PM
I looked through some past threads and noticed that he has quite a reputation here at PianoStreet.
I also noticed that most of his videos have comments disabled.
Is he really the same as he was a few years ago? Still a fraud?


He has not changed one fraction of an inch

Offline samwitdangol

  • PS Silver Member
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 110
Re: Bach Scholar - Tempos
Reply #8 on: May 11, 2020, 03:40:25 AM
He has not changed one fraction of an inch

What a disappointment. He really doesn't seem like a bad person when you first go to his channel.

Offline v1ct0r

  • PS Silver Member
  • Newbie
  • ***
  • Posts: 7
Re: Bach Scholar - Tempos
Reply #9 on: May 21, 2020, 04:27:13 AM
My teacher taught me about this, first of this applies to some of his works not all, but there is a technique called PROLATIO in which for example the c minor prelude the beginning is played exactly half the tempo as the middle section marked presto which is two times the speed then the end is back at the original tempo. Another crazy thing I’ve heard is Benjamin Zander talking about playing the prelude in c Major twice as fast or faster because he believes the repeated broken chords was because the harpsichord did not sustain and so it acted as a sustain however with modern pianos the sustain is there and would make this far too murky. Many people have claimed they found the formula but it really depends on many things like the decay, the harmony, harmony rhythm, style, mood of the piece, voicings, it’s open to interpretation there’s even a pianist who doesn’t use any pedal in Bach to mimick the harpsichord style and uses his fingers only to sustain which is foolish since we can enhance the music with pedal. My teacher specialized in Bach studies and interpretation and Juilliard so that PROLATIO technique is where he learned it. Hope that helps
For more information about this topic, click search below!
 

Logo light pianostreet.com - the website for classical pianists, piano teachers, students and piano music enthusiasts.

Subscribe for unlimited access

Sign up

Follow us

Piano Street Digicert