The F minor section of Chopin's Nocturne Op.15 No.1

[richard w]

It is the right hand in the opening bar of the F minor section (bar 25). If you can play it, please share with me the hand and arm movements you use.

If you haven't got the music to hand, basically it is a tremolo in sixths between Ab-F and middle C-Ab, at a fair speed in sixteenth notes.


Thanks for any help. Much appreciated.




Richard.

[johnnypiano]

Hi, Richard W.

This is the first piece I was asked to play at the R.A.M many moons ago.

I would come down strongly on the first beat of the bar, less so on beats two and three.  Then, to get up to A flat/C, make a diagonal movement towards the notes and back again.  Don't do a twisting (rotational) movement; this is more suitable for single note tremolo passages.  Let me know how it goes.  I love the harmonies along here.   

[richard w]

Thanks for the reply. Please could you clarify what exactly you mean by 'a diagonal movement'? I'm sure you understand exactly the movement you would use, and I'd get it straight away if you demonstrated. But in the absence of this possibility....

Anyway, are you using fingers 1-4, 2-5? Next, do you mean that the hand stays still relative to the forearm? To get the diagonal movement you must be moving your hand to the right, but do you move in or out of the keyboard? Finally, is your hand stretched out Ab to Ab or are you making the reach by (rapid) lateral movement of the hand?

Sorry for all the questions. Thanks for your help.



Richard.

[johnnypiano]

I wrote your answer away from the piano and now that I have retried the passage I find there is really no need to discuss diagonal movements (except that A flat is in a diagonal line from F).

1.  Yes.  Fingers 1-4,  2-5
2.  Emphasize beats 1  2  3
3.  If you concentrate your attention on these three beats rather than the intermediate ones, the passage will almost play itself.  Keep your hand rather firm and make sure all the finger tips are also firmly in contact with the keys and diredted downwards.   Any looseness, or attempt at rotary movements, and you will lose control.  Depending on the size of your hand you might have to stretch.
 
4.  As a variation, you could practise this with the emphasis on the off-beats.  It makes you think differently, and be more aware of the fine tuning you can get between fingers and hands.  Again - does this help?

[richard w]

Thanks again. Yes, it seems to be helping. It doesn't feel so impossible anymore, and I'm beginning to approach performance tempo, although I've got a fair way to go before the whole section is reliable at tempo. I think I'll get there in the end.

Thanks again.



Richard

[johnnypiano]

It's great you are getting somewhere with this; but it is a very difficult passage.

I'm thinking of starting a topic of difficult passages and see what others think.  Would that be a good idea?

All the best     

John

[richard w]

It's great you are getting somewhere with this; but it is a very difficult passage.

Indeed. Now I'm beginning to get somewhere with the notes, I realise that only part of the difficulty lies in 'just' finding the notes. The real work now starts with interpreting all of Chopin's expression indications and capturing the overall mood of the piece. I think this will take me longer to grasp.

I'm thinking of starting a topic of difficult passages and see what others think.  Would that be a good idea?

By all means - post away.




Richard.