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Topic: Trouble with smooth and even left hand  (Read 1591 times)

Offline sarahlou

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Trouble with smooth and even left hand
on: January 12, 2023, 04:00:17 PM
Hi,
I知 an adult learner (since about a year). I知 struggling to get my left hand to sound even in terms of tone. I wondered if there were any specific types of exercises or techniques I could practice to try to help. I only have an electric piano (touch sensitive) at home, but weekly lessons and occasional practice on an upright. My teacher has just said it will come with time. I expect this is true, but really want to feel I am working on the issue too. Any help really gratefully received.

Online brogers70

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #1 on: January 12, 2023, 05:01:45 PM
Maybe you're already doing this, but a simple thing to do is just to work on slow scales with the left hand and to pay careful attention to evenness of tone. Listen very carefully to each individual note, comparing it to the previous one and to the sound you had imagined for it. If you do it slowly enough it's almost a kind of meditation.

Offline ranjit

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #2 on: January 12, 2023, 06:21:58 PM
If you can already do this in your left hand, then:

Mirror practice and Bach.

The keyboard is symmetrical about D and Ab. Play the mirror image with your right hand and then try to imitate it with your left hand.

Offline sarahlou

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #3 on: January 12, 2023, 06:28:07 PM
Thank you so much. I haven稚 paid much attention to scales and I think your advice is very helpful. Thank you, I will do this.

Offline frodo3

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #4 on: January 13, 2023, 06:23:52 PM
If you can already do this in your left hand, then:

Mirror practice and Bach.

The keyboard is symmetrical about D and Ab. Play the mirror image with your right hand and then try to imitate it with your left hand.

Also symmetric around C when looking at diatonic notes of C major scale.  C major also allows you to play left and right hand together without strange sounding results.  Consider also playing C major scales with both hands in contrary motion starting with C.  Do also hands separate - first with good hand followed by weak hand like Ranjit suggests.

EDIT:  Bach 2-part inventions would be logical place to start in ranjit's suggestion if they are appropriate to your ability level.

Offline roncesvalles

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #5 on: January 17, 2023, 05:44:51 PM
What sort of figurations (scales, arpeggios, double notes, passagework, etc.) are you having difficulty with and at what tempo?  Is there a particular piece in which you're having issues?

Offline sarahlou

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #6 on: January 17, 2023, 05:54:57 PM
Arpeggio formations. I find that the note played by the 5th on the left hand I am unable to control volume and tone and even timing as effectively.

Offline roncesvalles

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #7 on: January 17, 2023, 07:32:24 PM
I think a lot of things can go into playing arpeggios.    Usually left hand arpeggios are played in a lower dynamic level than right hand figuration, so playing softer and controlled is important.   I would start off by just playing with the 5th finger alone on one note, with the other fingers completely relaxed and resting.  Start off slowly and try to just play an even rhythm.   Sometimes with the fifth finger even this is tricky at first because it shares a tendon with the 4th and doesn't get as much use as the other fingers.  Then try to do that with a range of dynamics, with crescendoes (I wouldn't try to get too loud at first, just bring up the dynamic) and decrescendoes until you have control of the sound in an even tempo, first slowly and then more quickly when you get more comfortable.  After you can do those things, I would focus on P and PP dynamics just repeating the note with your fifth finger.  Do a little of this every day, to increase both control and fluidity.
As for the arpeggios, one thing you can try, just for practice's sake, is starting with the second note of the arpeggio (if the arpeggio is ascending first).  Make sure you can play the whole arpeggio with every finger you use but without the root/5th finger evenly in the desired dynamic.  If the arpeggio comes back down, play the note before the fifth finger plays again, and then pause.  Give yourself a moment to really focus on the fifth finger, and try playing it in the same dynamic.  I'd practice this for a while, and as you get more comfortable, to make less of a gap, until finally there isn't one.   I'd pick a phrase (often about four bars) or progression to focus on, so it's a little less repetitive than playing the same arpeggio over and over. 

I'm not sure of the type of arpeggio you're playing, but there is often a jump back down to the root where it's hard to not accent with the fifth finger.   If this is the case, I'd play the upper notes in tempo, and jump to where the lower note played by the fifth is, with your jump also in tempo, but wait a split second for you to get calibrated and able to focus on the sound you're making.  So do the jump but don't immediately try to play--let your hand relax and your mind focus on the sound you want to make, and then play it.   Often in jumps we can tense up because we immediately start stretching the fingers in anticipation of the note.  This tension can make it harder to control the sound, especially if we're supposed to be playing softly.

If evenness in rhythm or sound is the issue, tension in your fingers and hand (and brain!) can also be contributing to the difficulty.   I used to have a lot of tension, and it still crops up in difficult or awkward passages, and something I like to do is to play whatever figure staccato whenever I have tension.  When we play legato, we often have to have more than one finger activated at a time.  This can especially cause tension in the left hand, because a lot of arpeggios use a fingering like 5421 if they span an entire octave, and 5 and 4 share a tendon.  So try playing finger staccato in the desired dynamic, at first slowly and letting your hand and fingers relax between notes.  With staccato we start by applying force downward but then let go, letting the rebound of the key push the relaxed finger back up.  I often notice that a passage feels so much lighter in my hands when play it staccato a time or few, because it promotes relaxation between notes, when with legato we're activating 2 fingers at once (sometimes more if playing is fast and we're anxious to get the next note in time).  Play the note, let go, feel the relaxation coming back into your hand, play the next.  Pretty soon you'll be doing this close to tempo, and your hand has learned to do the motions with a lot less tension, so when you come back to a more legato articulation, you can feel the difference.  I do this a lot whenever a passage feels heavy or awkward under my fingers, because it's often resistance/tension between fingers in the hands that contributes to this feeling, so if we can practice to minimize that tension we can go back and often play a lot more cleanly and with the kind of articulation we really want.

There's so much that goes into arpeggio playing that you should really talk to your teacher about this.  I haven't even touched on rotation and how it can help relieve tension by avoiding "locking" your hand into a stiff position (often when starting out we want to have all of our fingers in place for arpeggios as if we were playing big chords), and sometimes there needs to be a kind of choreography of the hand, especially if there is a mix of black and white keys.   

Don't lose hope; these things take time.  There's often a steep learning curve and slow, gradual progress, and then one day this will be easy to you.

Offline ranjit

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #8 on: January 17, 2023, 08:18:50 PM
The fifth finger does not share a tendon with the fourth, as far as I know. It's only the 3 and 4 that share a tendon.

You need to develop neural independence of the fifth finger. Also, you need to make sure not to play the 5 just with the finger going up and down but with the entire wrist and hand supporting it in a rather curved position.

Offline sarahlou

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #9 on: January 17, 2023, 09:41:10 PM
Thank you for taking the trouble to give such detailed guidance roucesvalles, you have suggested so many useful techniques. I look forward to giving them a go. As I致e mentioned in another thread, I知 struggling to get much technique input from my teacher, so these are particularly useful. Thank you ranjit too for the advice. I find my 5th does tend to straighten, so I will try to maintain a more curved position as you suggest.

Offline frodo3

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #10 on: January 17, 2023, 10:51:17 PM
What sort of figurations (scales, arpeggios, double notes, passagework, etc.) are you having difficulty with and at what tempo?  Is there a particular piece in which you're having issues?

Great that you asked the correct question!  I just assumed that she was referring to scales.  Just for clarification, I assume that you are referring to "broken chords" when you say "arpeggios".  I think of 4 octave arpeggios in Hanon when I hear the term arpeggios where the 5th finger is used only on the lowest note of the left hand if the 5th finger is even used at all.   

One of the hardest challenges when communicating in a forum with people you don't know is trying to make sure there is a "meeting of the minds" as they say.  It is too often the case that 2 individuals have a conversation where they are talking about completely different things and both don't realize it!  But we all try our best!   :)

EDIT:  I realize there may be different definitions for "broken chord" and "arpeggio" in regard to the piano.  I am familiar with the use of these terms from the book "Foundations of Technique" by Murray McLachlan.

"Broken chord" example:  C E G C' C E G C' played with fingering 5 4 2 1 5 4 2 1 in LH and C' is an octave above C. - requiring rotary mvts of wrist and a relaxed wrist.

"Arpeggio" as I defined earlier.

Sorry - Just wanted to clarify!   :)

Offline roncesvalles

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #11 on: January 18, 2023, 01:16:41 AM
The fifth finger does not share a tendon with the fourth, as far as I know. It's only the 3 and 4 that share a tendon.
The fifth finger does share a tendon with the fourth (extensor digitorum).  The fourth also shares a tendon with the third, and the third has some connection to the second finger, as well.  You can see the results of this by holding your hand parallel to the piano or a table and lowering your fingers individually towards the table/piano.  With the fifth the fourth finger will follow some, as well as the third finger to a degree.  With the fourth finger, the third and fifth will move downward (and the second will also do so to a more subtle degree).  Do it with the second finger and the third finger moves down (and the fourth minimally).

Most of the tension I've encountered in my own playing has been with the high connectivity of the fingers, especially the fourth finger.  It used to be extreme for me (flying pinky) but still crops up a little in four note arpeggios with 4-3 stretches.   The shared tendon with 2-3 leads to some tension at the highest speeds in which I can trill, so for long trills I usually use 1-3 or 1-3-2-3.

Offline frodo3

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand - Final edit completed
Reply #12 on: January 18, 2023, 02:00:01 AM
Arpeggio formations. I find that the note played by the 5th on the left hand I am unable to control volume and tone and even timing as effectively.

I would recommend that you read "Foundations of Technique" by Murray McLachlan.  Available on Amazon for about $14 USD.  This is an easy book to read*.  120 total pages - 7 inches by 9.75 inches.

He discusses in chapter 3 the "Touch and Press" technique where the fingers are on the key before playing the note.  He also discusses there the concept of developing finger independence and thumb separation and separating the fingers.  After this, in chapter 11 he discusses "broken chords" - the technique you are having problems with.  You can skip chapters 5 thru 10 for now.  In fact, you probably only need to read chapters 3 and 11 -maybe 10 pages or less!  Work with your teacher to learn the sine-wave movements from the wrist required for your "broken chords" discussed in chapter 11.

You need to develop the touch and press playing technique with finger independence first before going to broken chords. 

In chapter 3 he writes: Finger independence from the "touch and press" approach is vital for evenness, control, economy of movement and ease for a whole range of challenges, including double notes and trills.

* - The 1st 3 chapters are very easy to read and understand for a beginner.  Chapter 3 is a must for everyone IMO. Just a suggestion.  Good luck!   :)

Offline sarahlou

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #13 on: January 18, 2023, 09:57:21 AM
Thank you all so much, you are all incredibly knowledgeable and so generous with your time; I知 so pleased I found this site. I am going to order the Foundations on Technique book that you recommend. Thank you once again.

Offline frodo3

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Re: Trouble with smooth and even left hand
Reply #14 on: January 20, 2023, 07:44:04 PM
Thank you all so much, you are all incredibly knowledgeable and so generous with your time; I知 so pleased I found this site. I am going to order the Foundations on Technique book that you recommend. Thank you once again.

Great!  2 points to consider for the "Foundations of Technique" book:

1) The rotary movements required for your broken chords (e.g. C E G C' C E G C' fingered 5 4 2 1 5 4 2 1  of left hand) are actually described on page 44 of the book in chapter 7 "Touches Part 3 - Legato, flexibility and rotary movement".  Be sure to also read at least pages 44-45 of this book.  And be sure to work with your teacher to help learn this concept. 

2) This book is a piano technique book;  It is not a piano method book.  As such, it may briefly describe an exercise to illustrate the technique, but it will not give a comprehensive list of exercises for the technique.  You probably will be able to understand chapter 3 (the most important chapter here) without any help from a teacher.  If you do need additional help or additional exercises to perform, you can post your request here or work with your teacher.  Note:  The double note exercises (e.g. trills in 3rds played by 1 hand) in chapter 3 should be ignored by you at this point since it is too advanced for a beginner. 
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