Beethoven Op. 111 Arietta

[jamienc]

For some of the really seasoned pianists:

The tempo of the Arietta at the beginning of the movement is really problematic when progressing through the movement as the l’istesso tempo markings are to be performed true to the indications Beethoven requests in his score. My question is (and I already know the answer, I just want opinions): is it worth taking a much slower tempo at the beginning to make the progressive build to the third variation true to Beethoven’s indication to keep the same tempo through to the “dream sequence?” If faster at the start, the third variation is almost impossible, but manageable if the beginning drags a bit. How would you handle this situation from an interpretive and “purist” point of view?

Thanks in advance!

[dinoimeri]

For some of the really seasoned pianists:

The tempo of the Arietta at the beginning of the movement is really problematic when progressing through the movement as the l’istesso tempo markings are to be performed true to the indications Beethoven requests in his score. My question is (and I already know the answer, I just want opinions): is it worth taking a much slower tempo at the beginning to make the progressive build to the third variation true to Beethoven’s indication to keep the same tempo through to the “dream sequence?” If faster at the start, the third variation is almost impossible, but manageable if the beginning drags a bit. How would you handle this situation from an interpretive and “purist” point of view?

Thanks in advance!

Hello, jamienc.

As you said, you already know the answer but then how to make it work? I had the same feeling as if the music just stands still and nothing is happening after the dramatic first movement - which has always been easier for me to perform (musically speaking).

But, maybe nothing in particular should happen. To me, if the first movement is the unavoidable fate which brings the sadness and anger, the beginning of the second movement is the Acceptance of that fate. The acceptance then - slowly but surely - turns into appreciation and even love and hope that was once lost. I can imagine Beethoven seeing himself and his life in a completely different light with forgiveness and gratitude. So, simplicity is definitely the key to this - as far back as I can remember (I played it many years ago) there are barely any dynamics written in the beginning except a piano and crescendo at the end of the phrase and I feel a very strong intention by the composer there.

I would definitely choose a slower tempo and try to build up the movement as a WHOLE, we need time to make this development from the rock-bottom to the gates of heaven at the end of the movement. It's always good to experiment, just halt your expectations of the phrase and enjoy listening to and living every single note and chord like time doesn't exist.

All the best,
Dino

[anacrusis]

Late Beethoven is very deliberate and meticolous with the instruction he provides, so start from what's in the score and figure out how to make that work.

[jamienc]

Yes, I quite understand the nature of dedication to the score and take everything into consideration with regards to dynamics, articulation, tempo and such. I’ve learned all but Op. 106 from the last five sonatas, and can say that the Arietta is the one movement that poses the greatest challenge to achieve the “steamroller” effect when it comes to tempo. As I mentioned above, remaining true to the rhythmic diminutions through the third variation renders the theme to be played quite slowly if the l’istesso tempo is to be followed accurately. Otherwise, the third variation is so near-impossible to play that one must noticeably change the tempo to keep things tidy.

So, I suppose what I’m really asking here is- would you prefer a super slow theme and first variation to keep true to the score indications and allow the third variation to be controllable, or do you take great liberties with the tempo as it progresses through that variation as to avoid the first two pages dragging on seemingly forever? I’ve heard many interpretations of this movement after having learned it and noticed that nobody accurately handles the tempo the way it is instructed in the score. Are performers justified in their musical decisions to take such liberties?

Thank you for your response, Dino. I enjoyed the depth of your post!

[brogers70]

I think that in Op 111, as in many pieces Beethoven was purposefully extreme in his tempos. He wanted the slow to be very slow and the fast very fast, and the cumulative effect of the increasing diminutions with a steady pulse is important. So I'd say, don't worry about the theme being too slow - it can work even at a very slow tempo. If you yourself are not feeling frustrated or impatient with the slow tempo, there's a good chance you'll convince the audience to listen more meditatively. It's certainly a challenge to shape a long line at a very slow tempo, but I've heard people do it, and maintain concentration right through it.

[jamienc]

I think that in Op 111, as in many pieces Beethoven was purposefully extreme in his tempos. He wanted the slow to be very slow and the fast very fast, and the cumulative effect of the increasing diminutions with a steady pulse is important. So I'd say, don't worry about the theme being too slow - it can work even at a very slow tempo. If you yourself are not feeling frustrated or impatient with the slow tempo, there's a good chance you'll convince the audience to listen more meditatively. It's certainly a challenge to shape a long line at a very slow tempo, but I've heard people do it, and maintain concentration right through it.

Thank you! Your response accurately describes the option I have decided is more true to the score even if the theme is slow to start. My focus has been on the most precise dynamic and voicing control of the melody and careful analysis of where that melody is in subsequent transformations as it gets buried deeper and more abstract within the growing complexity of the texture. (Beethoven didn’t call them variations but everyone refers to them that way… from here on out they are “transformations” to me). What a remarkable work of art this movement is. I just think it is so satisfying and “correct” as his last statement in the Sonata form. The last four pages are so glorious I can barely keep control of myself when I’m practicing it.

Thanks all!