Piano Forum

Topic: Notation question on Clair De Lune measure 49  (Read 2283 times)

Offline biscuit

  • PS Silver Member
  • Newbie
  • ***
  • Posts: 3
Notation question on Clair De Lune measure 49
on: December 14, 2023, 11:59:37 PM
Hi,
I'm very confused about the notation in measure 49 of Debussy's Clair De Lune (see attached). In the lower staff, the first note is a Gb. Why does it have two stems? Is it a dotted half note or a 16th note? If it is a dotted half note, how am I supposed to play the 2nd Gb mid-measure? Is the long curved line connected to the same note at the end of the measure a slur or a tie? Can someone please clarify how this measure is to be played and why it is notated the way it is?

Thanks!
Dan

Offline themeandvariation

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 861
Re: Notation question on Clair De Lune measure 49
Reply #1 on: December 15, 2023, 12:15:28 AM
It is a theoretical marking. Debussy is saying by giving the downward stem : I wish I could have another 'voice' enter here which would also sustain the Gb. He knows this can't be done. So the Gb is struck three times in that measure. He just wants you to know that he also wishes it could be sustained. As a compromise, you could hit the first Gb a little bit louder to create a slight allusion to his wish.
4'33"

Offline biscuit

  • PS Silver Member
  • Newbie
  • ***
  • Posts: 3
Re: Notation question on Clair De Lune measure 49
Reply #2 on: December 15, 2023, 12:30:31 AM
Wow, a "theoretical marking" ? That's a new one for me. What is the point if it can't be played? Is he anticipating someone orchestrating the piece? How is anyone new to this piece supposed to know that? Thank you very much- I'll articulate the three Gbs as you suggest.
-Dan

Offline lelle

  • PS Gold Member
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2506
Re: Notation question on Clair De Lune measure 49
Reply #3 on: December 15, 2023, 02:55:36 PM
What is the point if it can't be played?

The score is ultimately a guide for how the piece should sound. What he wants is that you create the illusion that the G flat is part of an independent voice that sounds throughout the bar, accompanied by another voice that plays the arpeggios even if this is not physically possible to do on a piano.

A big part of the art of playing the piano is to create the illusion that a percussive instrument, whose sounds start decaying as soon as they appear, actually is an instrument with sustained notes that are bound together, like the human voice.

To create this illusion, you can adjust the loudness of the individual sounds, and listening so the next sound sounds connected to the previous, and you got the pedal. In this particular instance, I would play the G flat more loudly relative to the arpeggios, which I would play extremely softly, with the goal of creating an overall sound of softness. The ear will "remember" the G flat as sounding, even if you in fact have to restrike it softly two times to play the arpeggios, if you successfully achieve this illusion. Pedal is needed too of course.

Quote
How is anyone new to this piece supposed to know that?

You know that through by asking the question you just asked and/or being taught that this is how it works, reinforced by the experience of playing many pieces where this type of notation appears. It's pretty common especially in romantic and impressionistic repertoire.

Offline biscuit

  • PS Silver Member
  • Newbie
  • ***
  • Posts: 3
Re: Notation question on Clair De Lune measure 49
Reply #4 on: December 16, 2023, 05:35:10 AM
Thank you so much for the detailed reply, it is very helpful. I have a number of recordings of this piece, so I'll listen to this passage to hear how different pianists interpret it.
For more information about this topic, click search below!

Piano Street Magazine:
New Piano Piece by Chopin Discovered – Free Piano Score

A previously unknown manuscript by Frédéric Chopin has been discovered at New York’s Morgan Library and Museum. The handwritten score is titled “Valse” and consists of 24 bars of music in the key of A minor and is considered a major discovery in the wold of classical piano music. Read more
 

Logo light pianostreet.com - the website for classical pianists, piano teachers, students and piano music enthusiasts.

Subscribe for unlimited access

Sign up

Follow us

Piano Street Digicert