What is Thumb Over Technique?

[solo@web]

I've heard that There is a wonderful technique for playing rapid arpeggio and scale.
That is Thumb Over Technique.
Do you know it?

[willcowskitz]

1. What exactly makes you think you deserve more attention than one post can get you?

2. https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php?action=search

3. My God how annoying you are.


Have a nice day.

[Etude]

 

[Allegroconfuoco]

Have a look at this thread:
https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,1918.0.html

[rlefebvr]

Don't be put off by members who think they own this forum.

Most of us are nice and we hope you stay on and keep coming back.

That being said, there are several threads on the subject already, one most recently. Do a simple search and you will see.

If you are like me, you will find them all lacking and the best way is to find someone to show you. I have yet to find anyone who knows what thumb over is, although they probably already do it and do not realize it.

[willcowskitz]

Don't be put off by members who think they own this forum.
Most of us are nice and we hope you stay on and keep coming back.

Aww how touching, a true daddy-son setting of a fresh new, instantly evoked imaginative relationship that just radiates warmth of compassion and understanding towards the anonymous and therefore completely innocent new character in this enthrilling roleplay.

You can think what you want of me, because I don't act according to those expectations. Even if I act on impulse, they're sincere impulses that have just, real roots that can be derived to idiotic behaviour in people that I more or less "have to" interact with. If somebody makes their first impressions by triple posting a cheaply and lazily constructed, duplicated message on three different areas of the forum, using all possible attention-grabbing magnets available for them, doesn't care to elaborate on their question, not ready to work themselves for the information they request using the search function, and yet still demand as much attention from people browsing the site, hell yes it does piss me off; it just shows the general ungrateful and egocentric mentality of people. Then there's social all-goodie-goodies who are so used to working by the pattern of not exposing anything personal, including emotions, of themselves because it apparently might cause their otherwise so fluently flowing social interaction "skills" to get bit sticky with all the friction from freedom of expressing one's thoughts in such "feeling"-based contexts, that "getting along" with everybody goes above everything else, even pragmatic or ethical vision (if they have any). I help those who deserve it, I openly reject those who deserve it. Those who have been in the either end of this scale, know this. Though its rare and on some observations "immature" (for all those static-minded "adults" that believe that pretending and least possible amount of signals is the only way of going about interacting with people) for me to "flip" like this, its just as blind of you to welcome any ass to "join the discussion" and ignore anyone who isn't emotionally as transparent as a brick wall, with their seriously flawed communication-syntax reasoning skills and inability to act according to the environment, not vice versa.

[rlefebvr]

Although I agree with some of your frustrations and understand where you are coming from, I do have a problem with members who have tenure that go after new forum members just trying to get a feel for the place, no matter how lame the question. No one is forcing you to answer. Did someone make you a moderator. Do you own and operate this forum. Do you have more rights then others because you pay a annual fee. I don't think so. Just another loud mouth drunk screaming a the top of his lungs hoping someone will notice.

All I see is a big bully beating up on a kid 5 years younger then he is and then applauding himself for it.

Any moron can beat up on the weak. Go after someone your own size and then I will applaud your rhetoric.

[solo@web]

Thanks  rlefebvr
This moron is talking insted of thinking.take a look at his activities
 
https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php?action=profile;u=2389;sa=showPosts

shame on him

[xvimbi]

Please search the forum. It's been discussed many times.

[rlefebvr]

Don't be see quick to thank me.

Willcowskitz  may have spoken more harshly than even he wanted to, although I doubt he will admit it, but he is still on the mark with his comments.

Posting questions  in more the one forum is simply wrong and unnecessary.

The question has been asked many times and there are many threads available on the subject. A little search would not hurt.

You are new and I am giving you the benefit of the doubt, that is all.

Also, the orange text is very aggressive even if it is not meant to be.

Enjoy the forum, lots of great people here.
 

[solo@web]

Hi to everyone
After sending my request someone sent me this in my Email and I think this is very useful text. Unfortunately I don’t have any source about it; even I’m not sure is it cut from a book or not? I only want to share it with you….
 
Different usage of thumb for playing (Fast) Scales and Arpeggios

Scales and arpeggios are the most basic piano passages; yet the most important method for playing them is often not taught at all! Arpeggios are simply expanded scales and can therefore be treated similarly to scales; thus we shall first discuss scales in detail and then note how similar rules apply to arpeggios. There is one fundamental difference on how you must play the arpeggio (a flexible wrist) compared to the scale; once you learn that simple difference, arpeggios will become much easier, even for small hands.

There are two ways to play the scale. The first is the well-known "thumb under" method and the second is the "thumb over" method. In the Thumb under method, the thumb is brought under the hand in order to pass the 3rd or 4th finger for playing the scale. This Thumb under operation is facilitated by the unique structure of the thumb, located below the palm. In the Thumb over method, the unique structure of the thumb is ignored and it is treated like the other 4 fingers. Both methods are required to play the scale but each is needed under different circumstances; the Thumb over method is needed for fast, technically difficult passages and the Thumb under method is useful for slow, legato passages, or when some notes need to be held while others are being played.

The Thumb under method is more frequently taught probably (1) for historical reasons and (2) because the Thumb over method is not needed (though it may be preferable) up to the intermediate level. In fact, with sufficient effort and work, it is possible to play fairly difficult passages using the Thumb under method and there are professional and excellent pianists who think that Thumb under is the only method they need. In reality, for sufficiently fast passages, they have subconsciously learned (through very hard work) to modify the Thumb under method in such a way that it approaches the Thumb over method. This modification is necessary because for such rapid scales, it is physically impossible to play them using the Thumb under method and stress becomes unavoidable at high speeds. Therefore it is important for the student to start learning the Thumb over method as soon as they are past the novice stage, before the Thumb under habit becomes ingrained into passages that should be played Thumb over.

Many students use the method of playing slowly initially and then ramping up the speed. They do fine using Thumb under at slow speed and consequently acquire the Thumb under habit and find out, when they get up to speed, that they need to change to the Thumb over method. This change can be a very difficult, frustrating, and time consuming task, not only for scales, but also for any difficult, fast passage -- another reason why the ramping up method is not recommended. The Thumb under motion is one of the most common causes of speed walls. Thus once the Thumb over method is learned, it should always be used to play the scale except when the Thumb under method gives better results. Even with the methods taught here, you will find that you can "get away with" certain motions at slower speeds while you cannot at higher speeds. We show below how to find the necessary motions using parallel set exercises and to apply them at the appropriate speeds.

The main piano playing muscles for the thumb are in the forearm, just as for the other 4 fingers. However, the thumb has other muscles in the hand that are used to move the thumb sideways in the Thumb under method. The involvement of these extra muscles for the Thumb under motion makes it a more biologically complex operation, thus slowing down the maximum speed attainable. The extra complication and stress at high speeds also causes mistakes. Some teachers claim that for those who use Thumb under exclusively, 90% of their flubs originate with the Thumb under motion.

You can demonstrate the disadvantage of the Thumb under method by observing the loss of thumb mobility in its tucked-in position. First, stretch your fingers out so that all the fingers are in the same plane. You will find that all the fingers, including the thumb, have mobility up and down (the motion needed to play the piano). Now, wiggle the thumb up and down rapidly -- you will see that the thumb can move 4 or 5 cm vertically with ease (without rotating the forearm), quite rapidly. Then, while still wiggling at the same rapid frequency, gradually pull the thumb under the hand -- you will see that as it goes under, it loses vertical mobility until it becomes immobile, almost paralyzed, when it is under the middle finger.

Now stop the wiggling and thrust the thumb down (without moving the wrist) -- it moves down! This is because you are now using a different set of muscles. Then, using these new muscles, try to move the thumb up and down as fast as you can -- you should find that these new muscles are much clumsier and the up and down motion is slower than the wiggle rate of the thumb when it was stretched out. Therefore, in order to be able to move the thumb in its tucked position, you not only need to use a new set of muscles but, in addition, these muscles are much more awkward. It is the introduction of these clumsy muscles that creates mistakes and slows down the play in the Thumb under method. The objective of the Thumb over method is to eliminate these problems. The obvious question is, "what price do you pay for it?"

The Thumb under method works well for slow scales. This is why scales (and arpeggios) are some of the most abused exercises in piano pedagogy -- novice students are taught the Thumb under method and are frequently never taught the Thumb over method, leaving them unable to acquire proper techniques for runs and arpeggios. Not only that, but as the scale is speeded up, stress begins to mysteriously build up. Beginners should be taught the Thumb over method as soon as they are ready. The Thumb over method is no harder to learn than the Thumb under method because it does not require the sideways contortions of the thumb, hand, arm, and elbow. It is not harmful to teach beginners the Thumb under method first and then the Thumb over method when faster scales are needed (within the first two years of lessons) because for a beginner, the Thumb under method is more complex and difficult to learn. Clearly, anyone beyond novice must learn the Thumb over method in order to avoid the trauma and wasted time trying to play fast scales Thumb under. Worse still, the student could end up with a large number of learned music with wrong habits that may need to be laboriously corrected later. For talented students, the Thumb over method must be taught within 6 months of their first lessons, or as soon as they master Thumb under.
Because there are two ways to play the scale, there are two schools of teaching on how to play it. One school is the Thumb under School. In fact, a disproportionately large fraction of students are presently being taught only the Thumb under method because most private teachers (who account for the majority of beginning students) have students that are not that advanced and therefore do not need the Thumb over method. Many private teachers aren't even aware of the Thumb over method. The Thumb under School (Czerny, Leschetizky) claims that Thumb under is the only way that legato scales can be played and that, with sufficient practice, Thumb under can play scales at any speed. The Thumb over school (Whitesides, Sandor) is now taking over and the more insistent adherents forbid the use of Thumb under, under any circumstances. See the Reference section for more discussions on Thumb under vs Thumb over teaching. Both extreme schools are wrong because you need both skills.

The Thumb over teachers claim that the Thumb under method is the cause of a majority of flubs and that if you practiced each method the same amount of time, you will be playing far superior scales with the Thumb over method. They are understandably angered by the fact that advanced students passed to them by private teachers often do not know the Thumb over method and it takes six months or more just to correct hours of repertoire that they had learned the wrong way. One disadvantage of learning both Thumb under and Thumb over is that when sight reading, the thumb might become confused and not know which way to go. This confusion is one reason why some teachers in the Thumb over school actually forbid the use of Thumb under. I recommend that you standardize to the Thumb over method and use the Thumb under as an exception to the rule. Note that Chopin taught both methods (Eigeldinger, P. 37). Thus learning Thumb over is not just a matter of preference; it is a necessity.

So, what exactly is the Thumb over motion? Let us start by analyzing the basic fingering of scales. Consider the RH, C major scale. We begin with the easier part, which is the RH descending scale, played 5432132,1432132,1 etc. Since the thumb is below the hand, the 3 or 4 finger rolls over the thumb easily, the thumb naturally folds under those fingers, and this descending scale fingering works well. This motion is similar to the Thumb under motion; therefore, for the RH descending scale, there is little apparent difference between the Thumb under and Thumb over methods. We will need to make a slight but crucial modification to this below in order to make it into a true Thumb over method, but that subtle modification will be difficult to understand until we master the Thumb over method. We shall postpone the discussion of this modification till later.

Now consider the RH, C major ascending scale. This is played 1231234, etc. In the Thumb over method, the thumb is played just like the 3 and 4 fingers; i.e., it is simply raised and lowered without the sideways Thumb under motion under the palm. Since the thumb is shorter than the other fingers, it can be brought down almost parallel to (and just behind) the passed finger without colliding with it. For scales such as the C major, both the thumb and passed finger are on white keys and will necessarily crowd each other somewhat. In order to avoid any possibility of collision, the 3 or 4 finger must be quickly moved away as the thumb comes down. This is the operation that must be practiced in order to play a smooth Thumb over scale. In the Thumb over method, it is not possible to hold the 3 or 4 finger down until the thumb plays, unlike the Thumb under method, and the thumb cannot pass over these fingers. For these reasons, some people object to the name Thumb over because it is misleading. When you first try the Thumb over method, the scale will be uneven and there may be a “gap” when passing the thumb. The trick in learning the Thumb over method is to reduce the "gap" between playing the 3 or 4 finger and the thumb so that the gap becomes inaudibly small. Therefore, the transition must be very quick even in a scale played slowly. As you improve, you will notice that a quick flick/rotation of the wrist/arm is helpful. It may be easier to learn the Thumb over motion initially by playing staccato. We shall go into much more detail on how to practice Thumb over below.

[solo@web]

Continued
The logic behind the Thumb over method is the following. The thumb is used like any other finger; it is not unique. The thumb only moves up and down. This simplifies the finger motions and, in addition, the hand, arms, and elbows do not need to contort to accommodate the thumb movements. Without this simplification, technically difficult passages can become impossible, especially because you still need to add new hand motions to attain such speeds, and most of these motions are incompatible with Thumb under. Thus the hand and arm maintain their optimum angle to the keyboard at all times and simply glide up and down with the scale. Most importantly, the movement of the thumb to its correct location is controlled mostly by the hand whereas in the Thumb under method, it is the compound motion of the thumb and hand that determines the thumb location. Because the hand motion is smooth, the thumb is positioned more accurately than with the Thumb under method, thus reducing missed notes and hitting of wrong notes and at the same time bestowing better tone control to the thumb. Also, the ascending scale becomes similar to the descending scale, because you always roll the fingers over for passing. This also makes it easier to play hands together since al fingers of both hands are always rolling over. Another bonus is that the thumb can now play a black key. It is this large number of simplifications, the elimination of the stress that results from the paralyzed thumb, and certain other advantages discussed below, that reduces the potential for mistakes and enables arbitrarily fast play. There are, of course, exceptions: slow, legato passages, or some scales containing black keys, etc., are executed more comfortably with a Thumb under-like motion. Acquiring the necessary techniques for the Thumb over method is not automatic -- it will need a certain minimum of practice, otherwise it will initially yield only choppy scales. In fact, most students who "grew up" using only Thumb under will initially have a terrible time trying to understand how anyone can play anything Thumb over. This is the clearest indication of the harm done by not learning Thumb over; for these students, the thumb is not "free" as explained below. We shall see that the free thumb is a very versatile finger. But don’t despair, because it turns out that all Thumb under students already know how to play Thumb over -- they just don’t know it.

The LH is the reverse of the RH; the Thumb over method is used for the descending scale. If your RH is more advanced than the LH, perform the explorations to faster Thumb over speeds using the RH until you decide exactly what to do, then pick up that motion with the LH. You can save a lot of time this way. It is a good idea to get into the habit of using the better hand to teach the other one. Naturally, if the LH is weaker than the RH, you will eventually need to practice it more to let it catch up. The LH must be stronger than the RH because the hammers in the bass are larger and the strings are more massive, which makes the action feel heavier at faster speeds.

We now discuss procedures for practicing fast Thumb over scales. The RH C major ascending scale consists of the parallel sets 123 and 1234. Parallel sets are groups of notes that can be played as a "chord" (all at once). First, use the chord attack or the parallel set exercises to attain a fast 123, with 1 on C4. Then practice 1231 with the thumb going up and then coming down behind the 3, quickly moving the 3 out of the way as the thumb comes down. Most of the sideways motion of the thumb is accomplished by moving the hand. The last 1 in the 1231 is the conjunction required by the continuity rule. Repeat with 1234, with 1 on F4, and then 12341, with the last 1 rolling over, just behind the 4, and landing on C5. Make sure that you can play these two combinations very rapidly and smoothly, completely relaxed. Play fingers 234 close to the black keys in order to give the thumb more area to land on. Then connect the two parallel sets to complete the octave. After you can do one octave, do two, etc.

When playing very fast scales, the hand/arm motions are similar to those of a glissando (but not identical). Note that the thumb can be brought very close to the passed finger (3 or 4) if it is kept just behind all the other fingers (almost like Thumb under). The glissando type motion allows you to bring the thumb even closer to the passed fingers because all the fingers 2 to 5 are pointing slightly backwards. You should be able to play one fast octave (about 1 octave/sec.) this way after a few minutes of practice (let's not worry about evenness yet!). Practice relaxing to the point where you can feel the weight of your arm. When you become proficient with Thumb over, you should find that long scales are no more difficult than short ones and that Hands Together is not as difficult as Thumb under. This happens mainly because the contortions of the elbow, etc., for Thumb under become more difficult at the high and low ends of the scales (there are many other reasons). It is important to stress here that there is never any real need to practice scales Hands Together and, until you become quite proficient, Hands Together practice will do more harm than good mainly because you can waste a lot of time practicing Hands Together at this stage. There is so much urgent material we must practice immediately Hands Separate, that there should be little time left for Hands Together practice. In addition, if you ask “What will I gain practicing Hands Together?” the answer is “Almost nothing”. Most advanced teachers (Gieseking) consider practicing fast Hands Together scales to be a waste of time. However, the ability to play great scales Hands Separate is a necessity.

In order to control the phase angle in the parallel set accurately, raise your wrist (ever so slightly) as you play the parallel sets 123 or 1234. Then make the transition to the next parallel set by lowering the wrist to play Thumb over. These wrist motions are extremely small motions, almost imperceptible to the untrained eye, and become even smaller as you speed up. You can accomplish the same thing by rotating the wrist clockwise (cw) to play the parallel sets and cycling back by rotating ccw to lower the thumb. However, the up and down wrist motion is preferred over the rotation because it is simpler, and the rotation can be reserved for other uses (Sandor). If you now try to play several octaves, it may initially come out like a washboard. It might take several weeks to attain fast smooth scales over 5 octaves up and down continuously Hands Separate, depending on your level.

The fastest way to speed up scale playing is to practice only one octave. One you are up to the faster speeds, cycle 2 octaves up and down continually. At high speeds, these shorter octaves are more useful because it is easier to learn the runs but it is more difficult to reverse direction at the top and bottom as the speed is increased. With longer runs, you don't get to practice the ends as often, and the added stretch of the arm to reach the higher/lower octaves is just an unnecessary distraction from concentrating on the thumb. The way to play fast reverses at the top and bottom is to play them with a single downward pressure of the hand. For example, to reverse at the top, play the last parallel set, the conjunction, and the first parallel set coming down, all in one downward motion. In this scheme, the conjunction is effectively eliminated by incorporating it into one of the parallel sets. This is one of the most effective ways of playing a fast conjunction -- by making it disappear!

Remember the glissando type of motion mentioned above. In the glissando, the hands are supinated or pronated in such a way that the fingers point away from the direction of motion of the hand. In these hand positions, the keydrop motions of the fingers are not straight down, but have a horizontal backward component that enables the fingertips to linger a little longer on the keys as the hand moves along the keyboard. This is especially helpful for playing legato. In other words, if the fingers were coming straight down (relative to the hand) and the hand is moving, the fingers would not come straight down onto the keys. By rotating the hand slightly in the glissando direction, this error can be compensated. Thus the glissando motion allows the hand to glide smoothly instead of moving up in jerks. You can practice this motion by cycling one octave up and down; the hand should resemble the motion of a skater, with alternate feet kicking sideways and the body alternately tilting while s/he skates forward. The hand should pronate or supinate with each change of direction of the octave. As in skating, where you must lean in the opposite direction before you can change the direction of motion, the rotation of the hand (reversal of glissando hand position) must precede the change in direction of the scale.

Do not take the glissando analogy too literally, because there are differences. For playing scales, the fingers are doing the work; therefore, it is important to keep the fingers parallel to the arm so as not to strain the tendons and cause injury or create stress.

For the RH descending Thumb over scale, practice the parallel set 54321, and the other relevant parallel sets, with and without their conjunctions. You just need to make a small modification to avoid letting the thumb fold completely under the hand while the next parallel set is rolling over the thumb. Lift the thumb as early as possible while keeping the scale smooth, by raising and/or rotating the wrist to pull the thumb up -- almost the reverse of what you did for the ascending scale. If you fold the thumb completely under the palm, it will become paralyzed and difficult to move to the next position. This is the "slight modification" referred to above and is very similar to the thumb motion for the ascending scale. For Thumb under play, the thumb can be allowed to fold completely under the palm. Because this motion is somewhat similar in Thumb over and Thumb under, and differ only in degree, it can be easily played incorrectly. The difference becomes important in technically difficult passages.

For ultra-fast scales (over one octave per second), think not in terms of individual notes, but in units of parallel sets. For the RH, naming 123=A, 1234=B, play AB instead of 1231234, i.e., two things instead of seven. For even faster play, think in units of pairs of parallel sets AB,AB, etc. As you progress in speed and start thinking in terms of larger units, the continuity rule should be changed from A1 to AB1 to ABA (where the final member is the conjunction). It is a bad idea to over-practice fast, at speeds you can not comfortably manage. The forays into very fast play are useful only for making it easier to practice accurately at a slightly slower speed. Therefore practice most of the time at slightly slower than maximum speed; you will gain speed faster that way. Do not practice for long periods at maximum speed because that will condition the hands to play the wrong way. And don't forget to play slowly at least once before you change hands or quit.

Try the following experiment in order to get the feel of truly fast scales. Cycle the 5 finger parallel set 54321 for the RH descending scale, according to the scheme described in the parallel set exercises. Note that, as you increase the repetition speed, you will need to orient the hand and use a certain amount of thrust or rotation in order to attain the fastest, smooth, and even parallel play. You may need to study the arpeggio section below on "thrust" and "pull" before you can do this correctly. An intermediate level student should be able to get up to faster than 2 cycles per second. Once you can do this rapidly, comfortably, and relaxed, simply continue it down one octave at the same fast speed, making sure to play it Thumb over. You have just discovered how to play a very fast run! How fast you can play depends on your technical level, and as you improve, this method will allow you to play even faster scales. Do not over practice these fast runs if they start to become uneven because you can end up with uneven playing habits. These experiments are valuable mainly for discovering the motions needed at such speeds.

It is best not to start playing scales Hands Together until you are very comfortable Hands Separate. The maximum Hands Together speed is always slower than the maximum Hands Separate speed of the slower hand. Start Hands Together practice with one octave, or part of one, such as one parallel set. For practicing by parallel sets, the C major scale is not ideal because the thumbs are not synchronized -- see below for a better scale to use (B major). Cultivate the habit of transitioning to Hands Together at a fast speed (although it may seem much easier to start at slow speed and then gradually ramp up). To do this, play one octave LH at a comfortable fast speed several times, repeat the RH at the same speed several times, and then combine them at the same speed. Don't worry if at first the fingers don't match absolutely perfectly. First match the starting notes; then match both the start and final notes; then cycle the octave continually; then work on matching every note.

Suppose that you can play at speed 10 with your RH and 9 with the LH. Then your maximum speed Hands Together may be 7. If you want to increase this Hands Together speed to 9, don't do it Hands Together. Do it by increasing the RH speed to 12, then the LH speed to 11. Now you can increase the Hands Together speed to 9. In this way, you save a lot of time and will avoid picking up bad habits and developing stress. That is, practically all technique acquisition should be conducted Hands Separate because that is the fastest, most error-free way. Many students will need to practice the LH more than the RH, which is another reason for practicing Hands Separate.

[solo@web]

Continued
Before going too far with the C major scale, consider practicing the B major scale. See table below for scale fingerings. In this scale, only the thumb and pinky play the white keys, except for the bottom finger (4) of the LH. All other fingers play the black keys. This scale has the following advantages:
(1) It is easier to play initially, especially for those with large hands or long fingers. Each key falls naturally under every finger, the fingers never crowd each other, and there is plenty of room for every finger. For this reason, Chopin taught this scale to beginners before teaching the C major scale.
(2) It allows you to practice playing the black keys. The black keys are more difficult to play (easier to miss) because they are narrower, and require greater accuracy.
(3) It allows play with flatter fingers (less curled), which may be better for practicing legato and for tonal control.
(4) Thumb over play is much easier with this scale. This is the reason why I used the C major scale to illustrate the Thumb over method. With the B major, it is more difficult to see the difference between the Thumb under and Thumb over motions. However, for purposes of practicing the proper motions, B major may be superior, if you already understand the difference between Thumb under and Thumb over because it is easier to get to the faster speeds without acquiring bad habits.
(5) The thumbs are synchronized in this scale, making it possible to practice Hands Together, parallel set by parallel set. Thus Hands Together play is easier than for the C major scale. Once you become proficient with this scale Hands Together, learning C major Hands Together becomes simpler, thus saving you lots of time. You will also understand exactly why the C major is more difficult.

This paragraph is for those who grew up learning Thumb under only and must now learn Thumb over. At first, you might feel as if the fingers get all tangled up and it is difficult to get a clear idea of what Thumb over is. The main cause of this difficulty is the habit you have acquired playing Thumb under which must be unlearned. The first obvious point is that you must not try to learn Thumb over Hands Together; practice Hands Separate. It is a new skill you need to learn and is no harder to learn than a Bach Invention. But the best news of all is that you probably already know how to play Thumb over! Try playing a very fast chromatic scale. Starting with C, play 13131231313 . . . . . The flat finger position may be useful here. If you can play a very fast chromatic scale, the thumb motion is exactly the same as for Thumb over because it is impossible to play a fast chromatic scale Thumb under. Now transfer this motion to the B major scale; think of this scale as a chromatic scale in which only a few white keys are played. Once you can play the B major Thumb over, transfer this motion to C major. This scale is more difficult because the fingers are more crowded, you need more curl, and you cannot freely use the flat finger positions. It might help to turn the hand/arm inwards slightly so that the thumb is already positioned slightly ahead of where it would be if the arm were strictly perpendicular to the keyboard.

The emphasis in this section has been on speed because that is where the technical difficulties lie and where Thumb over becomes a necessity. It should be re-emphasized here that practicing fast all the time and pushing your fingers to go faster is precisely the wrong way. Wait for the fingers to eagerly accelerate on their own instead of pushing them. High speed practice is necessary in the sense that you must constantly vary the speed. The tendency is to practice too long with one hand before switching. The resting hand must not be allowed to cool off; otherwise, its eagerness will dissipate. If you are practicing 5 repetitions and then switching hands, it is usually best to play fastest the first time, then gradually slow down, or play fast 4 times, and slower the final time.

Of course, learning scales and arpeggios (below) Thumb over is only the beginning. The same principles apply to any situation involving the thumb, in any piece of music, anywhere that is reasonably fast. Once the scale and arpeggios are mastered, these other Thumb over situations should come almost as second nature. For this to develop naturally, you must use a consistent and optimized scale fingering; these are listed in the tables below.

Those who are new to the Thumb over method and have learned many pieces using the Thumb under method will need to go back and fix all the old pieces that contain fast runs and broken chords. Ideally, all the old pieces that were learned using Thumb under should be redone so as to completely get away from the Thumb under habit. It is a bad idea to play some pieces Thumb under and others Thumb over for similar fingerings. One way to accomplish the switch to Thumb over is to practice scales and arpeggios first so that you become comfortable with Thumb over. Then learn a few new compositions using Thumb over. After about 6 months or so, when you have become comfortable with Thumb over, you can start converting all your old pieces.

It is obvious that we need both Thumb over and Thumb under. They should be considered as the extremes of two different ways to use the thumb. That is, there are many other motions in between, half of them would be more Thumb over and the other half would be more Thumb under. One unexpected benefit of learning Thumb over is that you become much better at playing Thumb under. This happens because your thumb becomes technically more capable: it becomes free. And you gain the ability to use all those in-between motions (between extreme Thumb over and Thumb under) that may be required depending on what other notes are being played or what type of expression you want to create. The thumb is now free to use all of its available motions and for controlling tone. This freedom, plus the ability to now play much more technically difficult material correctly, is what transforms the thumb into a very versatile finger.

Repeating scales and exercises mindlessly is discouraged in this text. However, it is critically important to develop the skill to play exquisite scales and arpeggios, in order to acquire some very basic technique and standard fingerings for routine playing and sight reading. Scales and arpeggios in all the major and minor keys should be practiced until you are very familiar with them. The standard fingerings should be practiced until they are like second nature. They should sound crisp and authoritative, not loud but confident; just listening to them should lift up one's spirits.

The standard major scale ascending fingerings are 12312341 (RH), 54321321(LH) for C,G,D,A,E major scales (with 0,1,2,3,4 sharps, respectively); these fingerings will be abbreviated as S1 and S2, where S stands for "standard". The sharps increase in the order F,C,G,D,A, (G-major has F#, D-major has F# and C#, A-major has F#, C#, and G#, etc.) and for the F,Bb,Eb,Ab,Db,Gb, major scales, the flats increase in the order B,E,A,D,G,C; every interval between adjacent letters is a fifth. They are therefore easy to remember, especially if you are a violinist. Look at B or Gb major scales in a music book and you will see how the 5 sharps or 6 flats line up. Thus 2 sharps will have sharps at F, C, three sharps will be F, C, G, and so on. The flats increase in reverse order compared to the sharps. See table below for the remaining ascending major scales (reverse the fingerings for descending scales):

RH

LH

Scale

Sharps/Flats

S1=12312341

S2=54321321

C,G,D,A,E

0,1,2,3,4 Sharps

S1

43214321321

B

5 Sharps

12341231

S2

F

1 Flat

41231234

32143213

Bb

2 Flats

31234123

32143213

Eb

3 Flats

34123123

32143213

Ab

4 Flats

23123412

32143213

Db

5 Flats

23412312

43213214

Gb

6 Flats


For the minor scales: (the last column designates the modified note for the minor scale)

S1

S2

A

0 Sharp

G sharp

S1

S2

E

1 Sharp

D Sharp

S1

43214321

B

2 Sharps

A Sharp

34123123

43213214

F#

3 Sharps

E Sharp

34123123

32143213

C#

4 Sharps

B Sharp

34123123

32143213

G#

5 Sharps

F dSharp

S1

S2

D

1 Flat

C Sharp

S1

S2

G

2 Flats

F Sharp

S1

S2

C

3 Flats

B Nat.

12341231

S2

F

4 Flats

E Nat.

21231234

21321432

Bb

5 Flats

A Nat.

31234123

21432132

Eb

6 Flats

D Nat.


It is easy to get addicted to playing scales and arpeggios. Once you can play scales as fast as you want (which will take many years), it is best not to use scales for warm-ups because of the addiction. We are all lazy to a certain extent and playing scales endlessly requires relatively little mental effort once you become proficient - a classic trap for the lazy brain.

On the other hand, we can never play the scale too well. When practicing scales, always try to accomplish something -- smoother, softer, clearer, faster. Make the hands glide, the scale sing; add color, authority or an air of excitement. Quit as soon as you start to lose concentration. There is no such thing as a maximum speed in parallel playing. Therefore, in principle, you can keep increasing the speed and accuracy all your life -- which can be quite a bit of fun, and is certainly addicting. If you want to demonstrate your speed to an audience, you can probably do that using scales and arpeggios at least as well as with any piece of music.
Arpeggios

Playing arpeggios correctly is technically very complex. This makes arpeggios particularly suitable for learning some important hand motions, such as thrust, pull, and the "cartwheel motion". "Arpeggio", as used here, includes broken chords and combinations of short arpeggic passages. We shall illustrate these concepts here using Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata (3rd Movement) for the thrust and pull, and Chopin's Fantaisie Impromptu for the cartwheel motion. Recall that suppleness of the hands, especially at the wrist, is critical for playing arpeggios. The technical complexity of arpeggios arises from the fact that in most cases, this suppleness must be combined with everything else: thrust, pull, cartwheel motion, and Thumb under or Thumb over. One note of caution: the Moonlight is difficult because of the required speed. Many Beethoven compositions cannot be slowed down because they are so intimately tied to rhythm. In addition, this movement requires a minimum reach of a 9th, comfortably. Those with smaller hands will have much more difficulty learning this piece than those with adequate reach.

The Cartwheel motion Method Fantaisie Impromptu by Chopin. In order to understand this motion, place your left palm flat on the piano keys, with the fingers spread out as far as you can like the spokes of a wheel. Note that the fingertips from pinky to thumb fall on an approximate semi-circle. Now place the pinky above C3 and parallel to it; you will have to rotate the hand so that the thumb is closer to you. Then move the hand towards the fallboard so that the pinky touches the fallboard; make sure that the hand is rigidly spread out at all times. If the 4th finger is too long and touches the fallboard first, rotate the hand sufficiently so that the pinky touches the fallboard, but keep the pinky as parallel to C3 as possible. Now rotate the hand like a wheel counter clockwise (as viewed from above) so that each successive finger touches the fallboard (without slipping) until you reach the thumb. This is the cartwheeling motion in the horizontal plane. If your normal reach is one octave with your fingers spread out, you will find that the cartwheeling motion will cover almost two octaves! You gain extra reach because this motion makes use of the fact that the center three fingers are longer than the pinky or thumb. Now repeat the same motion with the hand vertical (palm parallel to fallboard), so the fingers point downwards. Start with the pinky vertical and lower the hand to play C3. Now if you roll the hand up towards C4, (don't worry if it feels very awkward), each finger will "play" the note that it touches. When you reach the thumb, you will again find that you have covered a distance almost twice your normal reach. In this paragraph, we learned three things: (1) how to "cartwheel" the hand, (2) this motion expands your effective reach without making any jumps, and (3) the motion can be used to "play" the keys without moving the fingers relative to the hand.

In actual practice, cartwheeling is used with the hand somewhere between vertical and horizontal, and the fingers will be slightly curved. Although this cartwheeling motion will add some keydrop motion, you will also move the fingers in order to play. We apply this method to the LH broken chords of Fantaisie Impromptu by Chopin.we discussed the use of cycling to practice the LH. We will now add the cartwheel motion to the cycling. Cycle the first 6 (or 12) LH notes of bar 5 (where the RH first joins in). Instead of just translating the hand sideways to play each note, add the cartwheeling motion. If you position the hand almost horizontally, then practically all the keydrop must be accomplished by finger motion. However, if you raise the hand more and more towards the vertical, the cartwheeling motion will contribute more keydrop and you will need less finger motion to play. The cartwheeling motion is especially useful for those with small hands because it automatically expands the reach. Cartwheeling also makes it easier to relax because there is less need to keep the fingers spread widely apart in order to reach all the notes. This motion also releases the tension in the wrist because you can't cartwheel with wrist tension. These reductions in stress make the hand more supple. You will also find that your control increases because the motions are now partly governed by the large motions of the hand which makes the playing less dependent on the motion of each finger and gives more uniform, even results.

[solo@web]

Continued
Thrust and Pull: the two principal ways to play the arpeggio. For those who learn Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata for the first time, one of the most commonly encountered difficulties is the two-hand arpeggic ending of the 3rd movement (bars 196-198; this movement has 200 bars). By illustrating how to practice this difficult passage, we can demonstrate how arpeggios should be played. Let's try the RH first. In order to simplify the practice, we skip the first note of bar 196 and practice only the following 4 ascending notes (E, G#, C#, E), which we will cycle. As you cycle, make an elliptical, clockwise motion (as seen from above) of the hand. We divide this ellipse into two parts: the upper part is the half towards the piano and the lower part is the half towards your body. When playing the upper half, you are "thrusting" your hand towards the piano, and when playing the lower half, you are "pulling" the hand away from it. First, play the 4 notes during the upper half and return the hand to its original position using the lower half. This is the thrust motion for playing these 4 notes. Your fingers tend to slide towards the piano as you play each note. Now make a counter clockwise motion of the hand and play the same 4 ascending notes during the lower half of the ellipse. Each finger tends to slide away from the piano as it plays each note. Those who have not practiced both motions may find one much more awkward than the other. Advanced players should find both motions equally comfortable.

The above was for the RH ascending arp. For the RH descending arp, let's use the first 4 notes of the next bar (same notes as in preceding paragraph, an octave higher, and in reverse order). Here, the pull motion is needed for the lower half of the clockwise motion, and the thrust is used for the upper half of the counter clockwise rotation. For both ascending and descending arpeggios, practice both thrust and pull until you are comfortable with them. Now see if you can figure out the corresponding exercises for the LH. Notice that these cycles are all parallel sets and therefore can eventually be played extremely fast. Clearly, this is the most efficient way to get up to speed quickly; we will discuss more details below.

Having learned what the thrust and pull motions are, you might reasonably ask, "why do you need them?" First, it should be pointed out that the thrust and pull motions use entirely different sets of muscles. Therefore, given a specific application, one motion has to be better than the other. We will learn below that one motion is stronger than the other. Students who are not familiar with these motions may randomly pick one or switch from one to the other without even knowing what they did. This can result in unexpected flubs, unnecessary stress, or speed walls. The existence of the thrust and pull is analogous to the situation with Thumb under and Thumb over. Recall that by learning both Thumb under and Thumb over, you get to fully utilize all the capabilities of the thumb. In particular, at high speed, the thumb is used in a way which is very close to midway between Thumb under and Thumb over; however, the important thing to keep in mind is that the thumb motion must be on the Thumb over side of dead center. If you are even slightly on the Thumb under side, you hit a speed wall. Just as with thrust and pull, Thumb under and Thumb over use two very different sets of muscles.

The analogy of thrust and pull to Thumb under and Thumb over go even further, because thrust and pull also have a neutral motion, just as Thumb under and Thumb over have a range of motions in between. You get the neutral motion by reducing the minor axis of the ellipse to zero; i.e., you simply translate the hand right and left without any elliptical motion. But here again, it makes a big different whether you approach the neutral position from the thrust side or the pull side, because the seemingly similar neutral motions (approached from thrust or pull side) are actually being played using a different set of muscles. Let me illustrate this with a mathematical example. Mathematicians will be horrified if you tell them that 0 = 0, which at first glance seems to be correct. Reality, however, dictates that we must be very careful. This is because we must know the true meaning of zero; i.e., we need a mathematical definition of zero. It is defined as the number 1/N, when N is allowed to go to infinity. You get to the "same" number zero, whether N is positive or negative. Unfortunately, if you try to divide by zero: 1/0, you get a different answer depending on whether N is positive or negative. 1/0 = +infinity when N is positive, and 1/0 = -infinity when N is negative! If you had assumed the two zeros to be the same, your error after the division could have been as big as two infinities depending on which zero you used! In a similar way, the "same" neutral position achieved by starting with Thumb under or Thumb over are fundamentally different, and similarly with thrust and pull. That is, under certain circumstances, a neutral position approached from either thrust or pull is better. This is why you need to learn both.

OK, so we have established that thrust and pull are both needed, but how do we know when to use which? In the case for Thumb under and Thumb over, the rules were clear; for slow passages you can use either one, and for certain legato situations, you need Thumb under; for all others you should use Thumb over. For arpeggios, the rule is to use the strong motions as a first choice and the weak motions as a secondary choice. Strong and weak are defined as follows:

Strong: for RH ascending, use pull; for RH descending use thrust, and
for LH ascending, use thrust; for LH descending use pull.

Weak: for RH ascending, use thrust; for RH descending, use pull, and
For LH ascending, use pull; for LH descending, use thrust.

Some students may initially find it difficult to follow this rule because of the way they had practiced previously. For example, they may have learned a piece using one motion and changing it at a later time may not be worthwhile. And there are situations under which these rules should be ignored. For instance, with the Moonlight Sonata example here, with both hands ascending or descending together, some may find it easier to play both hands thrust or both hands pull, instead of playing one thrust and the other pull. For advanced players, the difference between strong and weak motions may be very small. For very fast play, the strong motions tend to produce better results and the weak motions are more prone to the "collapsing pinky" syndrome.

Finally, one can ask the question, "why not always play neutral - neither thrust nor pull?" Or just learn one (say thrust only), and simply become very good at it? Here again, we are reminded of the fact that there are two ways to play neutral depending on whether you approach it from the thrust side or pull side, and for a particular application, one is usually better than the other. As for the second question, note that the strong motions require both thrust and pull. Not only that, but in order to play the strong motions well, you must know how to play the weak motions. Therefore, whether you decide to use thrust or pull for a particular passage, you should always practice the other one also. That is the only way that you will know which motion is best for you. For example, as you practice this ending of Beethoven's sonata, you should find that you make faster technical progress by practicing every cycle using both thrust and pull. In the end, most students should end up playing very close to neutral, although a few may decide to use exaggerated thrust or pull motions. Practice this ending of the sonata by first practicing each cycle Hands Separate until you can play it comfortably and relaxed at final speed (or faster!). Remember, these are parallel sets and therefore, speed is usually not a limiting factor. Then connect two cycles, then three, etc., to gradually build up the whole ending, first Hands Separate only, and then Hands Together.

[solo@web]

Continued
There is much more new material to practice in this 3rd movement before we should be playing Hands Together, so at this stage, you probably do not need to practice anything Hands Together, except as experimentation to see what you can or cannot do. In particular, trying Hands Together at the highest speeds will be counter productive and is not recommended. However, cycling a single cycle Hands Together can be quite beneficial, but this also should not be over-practiced if you still cannot play it satisfactorily Hands Separate. The main difficulties in this movement are concentrated in the arpeggios and Alberti accompaniments ("do-so-mi-so" type); once these are mastered, you have conquered 90% of this piece. For those without sufficient technical skill, you should be satisfied with getting up to vivace speed. Once you can play the entire movement comfortably at vivace, you might try to mount an effort towards presto. It is probably not a coincidence that with the 4/4 signature, presto corresponds to the rapid heart beat rate of a very excited person. Note how the LH accompaniment of bar 1 actually sounds like a beating heart.

It should be clear by now that playing arpeggios is technically very complex. Thrust and pull also apply to scales, and the rules for scales are the same as for the arpeggios (the strong motion is the first choice but both strong and weak should be practiced). However, with scales, the difference between thrust and pull is more difficult to illustrate for novice players; this is why we demonstrated them using arpeggios above. Note that both thrust and pull become awkward when playing Thumb under. This is another reason for avoiding Thumb under. In fact, thrust and pull are very basic motions and apply to practically anything you play, including parallel sets. Therefore, it pays to practice them well, and to think about which one you are using whenever you play anything. The complexity of arpeggios results from the fact that you can combine thrust, pull, the cartwheel motion, Thumb under, Thumb over, pronation, and supination in any permutation. This is a mind boggling array of combinations. If you did not know the various components and simply let your hand pick its own movement, the chances of hitting the optimum combination is practically zero. The result is often a speed wall.

We shall now outline our plan of attack for learning this movement. We started with the most difficult part, the two-hand arp at the end. Most students will have more difficulty with the LH than the RH; therefore, once the RH is fairly comfortable, start practicing the RH arp of the first two bars of this movement, while still practicing the LH part of the ending. One important rule for playing arpeggios rapidly is to keep the fingers near the keys as much as possible, almost touching them. Do not lift the fingers off the keys. Note that we are looking for short practice segments for both hands so that we can alternate rapidly between the two hands. Do not cycle one hand for too long because of the danger of injury. After some practice, you will be able to cycle one hand for long periods of time; however, the effects of the injury are sometimes not felt until several days later, so it is a good insurance policy to develop the habit of changing hands frequently even if you feel no fatigue or pain.

The pedal is used in only two situations in this piece: (1) at the end of bar 2, at the double staccato chord and all following similar situations, and (2) bars 165-166. The next segment to practice is the tremolo type RH section starting at bar 9. Make sure that you understand the fingering of this RH section. Then comes the LH Alberti accompaniment starting at bar 21, and similar RH parts that appear later. The Alberti accompaniment can be practiced using parallel sets. The next difficult segment is the RH trill of bar 30. This first trill is best performed using 3,5 fingering and the second one requires 4,5. For those with small hands, these trills are just as difficult as the ending, so they should be practiced from the very beginning, when you first start learning this movement. These are the basic technical requirements of this piece. If you can learn these skills, you can play the entire movement.

Start Hands Together practice after all these technical problems are solved Hands Separate. There is no need to practice using the pedal until you start Hands Together. Note that bars 163, 164, are played without pedal. Then application of the pedal to bars 165, 166, gives meaning to these last 2 bars. Because of the fast pace, there is a tendency to practice too loud. This is not only musically incorrect, but technically damaging. Practicing too loud can lead to fatigue and speed walls; the key to speed is relaxation. It is the P sections that create most of the excitement. For example, the FF of bar 33 is just a preparation for the following P, and in fact, there are very few FF's in the entire movement. The whole section from bar 43 to 48 is played P, leading to just one bar, #50, played F. Whereas the objective during Hands Separate practice was to get up to speed (or faster) quickly, slow practice becomes paramount during Hands Together play. Except when cycling Hands Together, always practice Hands Together slightly slower than your maximum speed. You will make faster progress by practicing at a speed at which your fingers want to go faster, than to force the fingers to play faster than they can. Thus the choice of practice speed for Hands Separate and Hands Together practice is diametrically opposite: the objective is speed for Hands Separate and accuracy for Hands Together. There is no need to push for speed Hands Together because (if you had practiced correctly), that was already achieved Hands Separate, so that Hands Together speed will automatically come as soon as the two hands become coordinated. In Hands Together practice, you are working for coordination, not speed.

Finally, if you have practiced correctly, you should find certain speeds at which it is easier to play faster than slower. This is completely natural in the beginning, and is one of the best signs that you have learned the lessons well. Of course, once you have become technically proficient, you should be able to play at any speed with equal ease.

Thumb: the most versatile finger, and Example of Scale/Arpeggio Practice Routine

The thumb is the most versatile finger; it lets us play scales, arpeggios, and wide chords (if you don't believe it, try playing a scale without the thumb!). Most students do not learn how to use the thumb correctly until they practice scales. Therefore it is important to practice scales as soon as possible. Repeating the C major scale over and over, or even including the B major, is not the way to practice scales. It is important to practice all the major and minor scales and arpeggios; therefore we will examine an example of a scale practice routine and point out what needs to be done and what the benefits are.

For simplicity, we will consider only the major scales here, but you should devise similar exercises for the minor scales and corresponding exercises with the arpeggios.

First, a reminder of fundamentals. Play with the tip of the thumb, not the first joint. This makes the thumb effectively as long as possible, which is needed because it is the shortest finger from the wrist joint. In order to produce a smooth scale, all the fingers need to be as similar as possible. In order to play with the tip, you may have to raise the wrist slightly. You will find the tip helpful at high speeds and for better control. Playing with the tip is absolutely necessary when playing arpeggios and chords. It is also important to cultivate the "glissando motion" in which the fingers point away from the direction of motion of the hand. Do not exaggerate the glissando motion, you only need a small amount. Play all scales Thumb over; there is little need to practice Thumb under. Playing with the tip also facilitates Thumb over. Three octaves is probably an optimum span to practice, and the RH span should be one or two octaves above the LH span; in other words, choose a comfortable span for each hand. The optimum arm position is probably not perfectly perpendicular to the keyboard, but pointed slightly inwards to compensate for the fact that the pinky is short and to also help out with the Thumb over motion. Practically all of your work will be done Hands Separate; Hands Together is not necessary, and can waste a lot of time; Hands Together should be considered just an interesting option to try once in a while. Those who practice scales Hands Together all the time will develop a strong/weak hand syndrome; usually, the RH becomes stronger. The objective of these exercises is to build these motions and hand positions into your playing so that they become a permanent part of how you play anything. It is that basic. Thus these are some of the few exercises that must be repeated many times, every day, until the motions and positions are habituated so that you don't have to think about them.

There are many ways to generate all the scales, but the simplest and one of the most interesting is to use the circle of fifths. Start with C major, practice it a few times, then go up a fifth and practice G major. You will notice that it has one sharp. If you go up another fifth, you will need two sharps, etc.; with every move up a fifth, you add a sharp. Obviously, if moving up in fifths brings the span too high in the treble for comfort, go down one octave. What is interesting is that when you add a sharp, you keep all the previously used sharps; not only that, but the order in which they appear is the same as the order in which they are written on the music staff! The maximum number of sharps comes at B major (5 sharps), and the next one is 6 flats at G-flat major. These flats decrease with successive fifths, again in the same orderly manner, until you return to C major. Thus the circle of fifths takes you to every scale once and only once, in an orderly way, which is what you want.

Note that the black keys provide some special benefits. They allow play with flatter fingers. You may notice a difference in the degree of control depending on whether the fingers are curled or flat. Flat fingers can provide more control because you simply lower the finger to play; with a curled finger, you have to lower the finger and uncurl it slightly, which is a more complex motion. Because the thumb never plays black keys, Thumb over becomes particularly easy when black keys are involved. They are also narrower, requiring higher accuracy. Practice keeping the fingers on the keys; this is particularly easy when there are lots of black keys. Practice relaxation, especially with the fingers resting comfortably on the keys. With electronic pianos, it is difficult to keep the fingers on the keys without inadvertently depressing them; this is one of the advantages of acoustic pianos. Needless to say, correct technique is essential at all times; for example, pay attention to when you lift the fingers as much as when you press down on the keys, and experiment with tone, color, and any other attributes of musical play. Do not play loud; softer play requires greater control and is more beneficial. Speed is not as much an issue as whether you can produce an authoritative scale that marches along with purpose and vigor, with attention to tone, color, and musicality. When you can satisfactorily control the musicality, you will find that the speed is already there because the accuracy required for speed is less than the control required for musicality. Working for speed without musicality is a good way to start erecting speed walls because of stress build-up. However, it can be very useful to use parallel sets to double the speed once in a while to see what type of motions are needed at the next higher level of speed. It is also helpful to use your imagination to produce musical scales. For very slow scales, they might sound like a marching army. For the fastest scales, they sound like the doppler-shifted whistle of a fast train going by.

Now you can devise similar practice routines for the arpeggios.

In summary, although most exercises are not worth using, scales and arpeggios have a special place in piano technique acquisition. Because you can use them to learn so many fundamental technical skills, they must be part of a pianist’s learning program. This section has provided a fairly complete compilation of the necessary skills.


 

[jazzyprof]

solo:
1.  Your use of flaming orange text in your posts is annoying.

2.  It was inappropriate for you to post huge sections of C. C. Chang's online book here without attribution.  It smacks of plagiarism.

3.  As a new member of the forum it might be wise to first get a sense of the community before you take it upon yourself to teach us things.  I dare say that quite a few people here are aware of what's in C. C. Chang's book since it's been discussed many times, often with the participation of Chang himself.

4.  Now go to your room.   

[Egghead]

solo:
1.  Your use of flaming orange text in your posts is annoying.

2.  It was inappropriate for you to post huge sections of C. C. Chang's online book here without attribution.  It smacks of plagiarism.

3.  As a new member of the forum it might be wise to first get a sense of the community before you take it upon yourself to teach us things.  I dare say that quite a few people here are aware of what's in C. C. Chang's book since it's been discussed many times, often with the participation of Chang himself.

4.  Now go to your room.   

Solo: I initially felt the same way as jazzyprof (points 1 to 3). Please just think and search a bit next time, before posting. I have the impression you genuinely want to learn and share knowledge. People here are very helpful.

Jazzyprof: irritating as an unreferenced multi-post of publicly available text is - Solo DID mention that he does not know the source of the text. Whoever sent him the email containing it - while helpful - apparently forgot to give the source.

I would guess that most people here recognise the text instantly. And maybe the NEXT person searching for "thumb over" will find this thread rather useful. 
Egghead

[jazzyprof]

Egghead: I probably overreacted...must be the flaming orange getting to me.  But, Solo, next time someone emails you a large chunk of unattributed text, just ask them "hey buddy, where is that from?"