What questions to ask to identify a good piano teacher?

[parentofayoungpianist]

Hi,

I've been following this forum for a while and have benefited tremendously from my reading here. I've trusted the contributors here enough to ask this question in here. What questions do you suggest I ask a teacher before signing up for private lessons in order to make sure that he/she is a good teacher?

Specifically, I'm looking for these things in a teacher:
-teaches finger-hand-wrist-arm-shoulder coordination instead of just the fingers regarding piano technique. I know there's a lot of controversy on many of the topics regarding piano playing techniques and I personally spent a lot of time reading and researching although I'm just the parent of the learner. I'd like to avoid teachers that prescribe exercises of isolating fingers to lift up while pressing others down.
-can explain the movements of the shoulder, forearm, elbow, wrist, hand, fingers to a student when the student cannot just "copy" what the teacher does kinesthetically. The teacher can tell how the student's movements are not achieving the musical goals and point out the corrective movements. Better yet, the teacher can provide a few different movements for the student to try and choose whichever one that suits them the best.
-knows how to motivate a young pianist. For example, giving choices on repertoire, or better yet, let the student choose which piece to work on.
-knows how to scaffold (this is an important one), i.e. breaking down a difficult passage, teach a piece from many angles etc., instead of merely asking the student to practice harder. Knows how to provide the student with appropriate challenges so that they both develop a sense of progress (and thus confidence) and avoid being frustrated (and thus feeling unconfident and helpless) with failing to play what is asked of him.
-offers different fingering options for the student to choose instead of prescribing the fingering and then telling the student to memorize them. Explain principles for choreography. Give the tools for the students to become independent musicians. I'm not saying prescribing fingering is wrong. But from our own experience, my kid learns better when he figures it out on his own.

I want to be able to tell whether a teacher is a fit through as few questions as possible, since it saves time on both ends. And be the least offensive, since we may end up working with that teacher. I want to ask questions more specific than "what's your approach to teaching piano", so that they find it easier to answer and I'd probably find their answer more revealing.

I hope I could get a few replies from some of the frequent contributors that I had read so much from in the past. All responses are welcome.

[dizzyfingers]

That is an IN DEPTH understanding of piano practice.
I think you should be a piano teacher!
I'm also wondering if you ARE a piano teacher, or at least an accomplished pianist, and are cloaking your post about "what a good piano teacher is" as a question ... clever, if so. If not .. how do you come by such an in depth knowledge and understanding?  I would think only someone who plays would dive into such questions/answers to such detail and be able to articulate them so well...

[parentofayoungpianist]

That is an IN DEPTH understanding of piano practice.
I think you should be a piano teacher!
I'm also wondering if you ARE a piano teacher, or at least an accomplished pianist, and are cloaking your post about "what a good piano teacher is" as a question ... clever, if so. If not .. how do you come by such an in depth knowledge and understanding?  I would think only someone who plays would dive into such questions/answers to such detail and be able to articulate them so well...

Oh I’m just a very involved parent who happens to know a thing or two about education in general. Things about giving choices, scaffolding, independent thinking are what I know for educating kids in general and I’ve been using these principles for home educating my kids. I’ve also watched my kid learn with quite a few piano teachers, his reactions and teachers’ reactions. What worked and what didn’t. I’ve done so much research on piano playing that I do wish the piano teacher has the same readings and knowledge as I do, and in the meantime can provide more explanation and connect the dots more easily. I could have been a piano teacher, except that I cannot play the piano.

[kosulin]

Not sure Q&A will really help much, but asking what you wrote above would not hurt. Also, where they studied music, who was their teacher(s) - that may help you to understand what school (in general meaning) they belong to, what methodics they prefer or follow, what age and gender they prefer to teach or have more experience with, etc.
Ideally you might want to watch an open lesson and/or recital(s) of their students.
References also matter.
And finally, the teacher-student relationship is very personal matter. Some might be a great teacher for one student and would not make it for another.

[parentofayoungpianist]

Not sure Q&A will really help much, but asking what you wrote above would not hurt. Also, where they studied music, who was their teacher(s) - that may help you to understand what school (in general meaning) they belong to, what methodics they prefer or follow, what age and gender they prefer to teach or have more experience with, etc.
Ideally you might want to watch an open lesson and/or recital(s) of their students.
References also matter.
And finally, the teacher-student relationship is very personal matter. Some might be a great teacher for one student and would not make it for another.

Thank you for your reply. Your suggestion of looking at which teachers the teacher studied with is a good point. But how do you know which school do the teachers belong to? Does an education in a conservatory in Russia necessarily mean that he/she belongs to the fingers school or the arm-wrist-hand-fingers coordination school? Where might I go about finding out which pedagogues belong to which school (if not much content could be found through a Google search).

I’ve also seen contradicting info through demo lessons, at least to my amateur eyes. For example, a teacher teaches whole-body approach and asks the student to move the arms but also insists on practicing Hanon and Schmitt. How would you decipher this combination?

[parentofayoungpianist]

Meanwhile, I also have a hypothesis (it’s only a hypothesis but a relatively informed hypothesis) that teachers with a Russian school background do better scaffolding because the psychologist who is known for the zone of proximal development (scaffolding) theory, Lev Vygotsky, is a Russian and Soviet psychologist. His work might be more commonly known and practiced in Russia.

Anyone has any comments on this hypothesis?

[lostinidlewonder]

Honestly if a students parent came to me and asked all these questions I'd not answer them in any detail and tell them to see the results of our lessons after a period of time.

I've had "helicopter parents" who hover over every detail of their child's education and it's just absolutely suffocating as a teacher. I'm fairly assertive and would express this, if they don't like it they can find someone else, I'm not desperate to teach a student who's parents are overly controlling and monitoring.

If this question was rephrased as what should I expect to see improve in my child, that's just far to various. Do they enjoy the lesson and do you see overall progress? That is enough. Otherwise why not teach them yourself if you need every detail?

[klavieronin]

I'm with lostinidlewonder on this one. It's fair enough to want a good teacher for your child but you should judge the teacher by their results, not a preconceived notion about how the teacher ought to be teaching. Every student is different and they will have their own strengths and weaknesses. A good teacher will be able to find and help the student address their weak points, whatever they are. Often this means that lessons for one student will look very different to lessons with another student, even when they have the same teacher.
Of course in some sense, a good teacher is simply one that the students stays with. It's no use having your child learn from a the most knowledgable teacher in the world if it means they give up after three months. On the other hand, a decently proficient and well informed teacher who a student is happy to go back to year after year will be far more valuable in the long run.

[pianocavs]

Hi everybody!

I fully agree with what was said here, both by the O/P and in the comments of the other participants.

As a teacher, I would give these interesting reflections a twist to ask myself what characterizes a good teacher.
And also, what it means to be an excellent student.

A good teacher masters his subject, systematizes, organizes and transmits knowledge.
He/She also fulfills the mission of helping the student to see what, at first, the student cannot see.
He/She has positive approaches that keep the student's motivation and commitment high.

An excellent student is one who has a true passion for learning and developing, and transforms that passion into intense and constant work, keeping the focus.

The results will be a consequence of the quality level of the teacher, the quality level of the student, and the level of work of both.

It is also interesting to consider that not all students have the same objectives.
I will tell you an anecdote.
I had a student who studied piano on a doctor's prescription.
The doctor suspected she was developing Alzheimer's, and the doctor told her to find an activity that combined intellectual exercise with mechanical coordination.
The piano was a good choice for her.
This is an example of how we can find different goals in students, and how being a good teacher might require different approaches for each student.

[brogers70]

Honestly if a students parent came to me and asked all these questions I'd not answer them in any detail and tell them to see the results of our lessons after a period of time.

I've had "helicopter parents" who hover over every detail of their child's education and it's just absolutely suffocating as a teacher. I'm fairly assertive and would express this, if they don't like it they can find someone else, I'm not desperate to teach a student who's parents are overly controlling and monitoring.

If this question was rephrased as what should I expect to see improve in my child, that's just far to various. Do they enjoy the lesson and do you see overall progress? That is enough. Otherwise why not teach them yourself if you need every detail?

I agree. A parent who has read up on piano pedagogy but does not play the piano could be a recipe for disaster. I'd tell the OP not to overthink everything. There are a couple of ways to evaluate a teacher. First, hire them and see how things are going after a couple of months (during which time the parent does not intervene at all). Second, if the teacher organizes recitals for the students, go watch one of those recitals and see how the students are doing

[parentofayoungpianist]

Honestly if a students parent came to me and asked all these questions I'd not answer them in any detail

That's an interesting reaction. For a teacher that wouldn't answer questions by the parent, I wonder if he/she would answer questions from the student. If not, then I know it's not going to work for my kid. Plus, the points I mentioned in the original post is not my own idea. They are a result of collective problem solving and reflections.

...and tell them to see the results of our lessons after a period of time.

What results should we expect? Is it reasonable to expect a breakthrough, or not? As for the "period of time", how long? After two months? Four months? A year? After a period of time, I may be told by the teacher that the kid has many bad habits, that the kid lacks finger strengths, that the kid is not practicing correctly, that's why we don't see much progress. They are valid reasons, aren't they? Or should I view them as red flags? In a nutshell, I chose the path of "trusting the process", doing due diligence at the beginning and then give the teacher more trust and patience to show results.

Do they enjoy the lesson and do you see overall progress?

Do they enjoy the lesson? If the teacher does not have what we are looking for, most likely my kid won't enjoy the lessons, or won't have the motivation to practice / love music. I'm no expert in piano playing, but I do know my kid better than 99% of the teachers. If I know my kid is not going to like it, why do I still put him/her through the suffering?

Otherwise why not teach them yourself if you need every detail?

I'm really confused why you make this statement (yes a rhetorical question is a statement). You sound offended. I didn't mean to offend anyone. I'm simply stating what I'm looking for in a teacher. Out of the five points I raised in the original post, all are "principles" instead of "details". Four are not "piano" specific, but rather plain educational psychology applied in piano teaching. Ensure that the principles align is exactly for the purpose of not having to micromanage!

Now again, there is no perfect teacher. There used to be a "bernhard" in this forum some twenty years ago. If he's around in my neighborhood, I'd sign up with him. But mostly likely I will need to make tradeoffs between these points, and that's okay. I'm only trying to do the necessary due diligence, which I think is what a responsible parent ought to do, not a helicopter parent.

[parentofayoungpianist]

I'm with lostinidlewonder on this one. It's fair enough to want a good teacher for your child but you should judge the teacher by their results, not a preconceived notion about how the teacher ought to be teaching. Every student is different and they will have their own strengths and weaknesses. A good teacher will be able to find and help the student address their weak points, whatever they are. Often this means that lessons for one student will look very different to lessons with another student, even when they have the same teacher.
Of course in some sense, a good teacher is simply one that the students stays with. It's no use having your child learn from a the most knowledgable teacher in the world if it means they give up after three months. On the other hand, a decently proficient and well informed teacher who a student is happy to go back to year after year will be far more valuable in the long run.

I agree with you 100% that a good teacher is whom a student is happy to go back to year after year. In fact, points 2~5 are related to motivation. The sad reality is that most of the piano teachers out there know a lot about playing piano, but know too little about teaching. Giving choices and scaffolding are common teaching tactics to boost motivation and confidence (and thus more motivation). It would be great to see more teachers in this forum take up the task of learning more on that front.

As you also mentioned that I should see the results instead of insisting on how the teacher should teach, I think maybe I should get more clear about what results are reasonable to expect. Can you share what you think would be considered a reasonable progress after a period of time? And how would you "measure" the progress or make it visible? The student is at the intermediate level.

[parentofayoungpianist]

A parent who has read up on piano pedagogy but does not play the piano could be a recipe for disaster.

I get why you say that. But like I said earlier, in fact, only one of the five points I raised in the original post is specific to piano pedagogy (the first point). Points 2~5 are just educational psychology applied to piano teaching and I wouldn't count them as "piano pedagogy". As to the first point, I am not insisting against Hanon or any technical drills for that matter, I'm only insisting that the teacher teaches finger-hand-wrist-arm-shoulder coordination, which is exactly what we lack right now. Does anyone think even this is too much to ask of a teacher?

[themeandvariation]

"Specifically, I'm looking for these things in a teacher:
-teaches finger-hand-wrist-arm-shoulder coordination instead of just the fingers regarding piano technique. I know there's a lot of controversy on many of the topics regarding piano playing techniques and I personally spent a lot of time reading and researching although I'm just the parent of the learner. I'd like to avoid teachers that prescribe exercises of isolating fingers to lift up while pressing others down.
-can explain the movements of the shoulder, forearm, elbow, wrist, hand, fingers to a student when the student cannot just "copy" what the teacher does kinesthetically. The teacher can tell how the student's movements are not achieving the musical goals and point out the corrective movements. Better yet, the teacher can provide a few different movements for the student to try and choose whichever one that suits them the best."

If this is your primary concern - from the outset of starting lessons, get a teacher who uses the Taubman approach.

Perhaps, many teachers will eventually address the ergonomics ever more specifically, but maybe not so thoroughly in the first lessons.

I think after selecting a teacher to try out, sit in on the lesson(s) and see for yourself.  Many types of learning are happening concurrently in the lesson, making it cumbersome for a teacher to explain everything that is going on. Observing may be your best litmus for understanding what is being conveyed and absorbed as it relates to your child's development. If the child gets enthused, and excited to practice, that would be a sign.

[lostinidlewonder]

That's an interesting reaction. For a teacher that wouldn't answer questions by the parent, I wonder if he/she would answer questions from the student. If not, then I know it's not going to work for my kid. Plus, the points I mentioned in the original post is not my own idea. They are a result of collective problem solving and reflections.

You are mistaken putting an explanation to you as a parent not recieving the education on par with transfer or knowledge to a student. Any teacher can  spew forth theory of pedagogy but can they actually transfer that knowledge to a specific student with individual needs? That requires zero explaination to you as a parent and has everything to do with results of the students progress and their engagement in receiving that. Explaining anything to the parent in detail thus is superfluous and in my mind useless.

What results should we expect? Is it reasonable to expect a breakthrough, or not? As for the "period of time", how long? After two months? Four months? A year? After a period of time, I may be told by the teacher that the kid has many bad habits, that the kid lacks finger strengths, that the kid is not practicing correctly, that's why we don't see much progress. They are valid reasons, aren't they? Or should I view them as red flags? In a nutshell, I chose the path of "trusting the process", doing due diligence at the beginning and then give the teacher more trust and patience to show results.

Again your logic is off. Just because a teacher might be able to impress you with theory of teaching you have zero idea if they can actually transfer that effectively to your child. I could literally lecture you on the theory of teaching piano for a year with weekly lessons but why would I bother? Isn't what is important the results from your child? And you dont wait long, after one lesson your child should say yes they enjoyed that lesson and learned something engaging. If you are caught up over specific technical or mental improvement at a specific level and degree you are being far too controlling over your child's progress and most teachers will not be subjected to this unless they are desperate for students.

Do they enjoy the lesson? If the teacher does not have what we are looking for, most likely my kid won't enjoy the lessons, or won't have the motivation to practice / love music. I'm no expert in piano playing, but I do know my kid better than 99% of the teachers. If I know my kid is not going to like it, why do I still put him/her through the suffering?

Here you are suggesting that your desires and your child's are identical, I think that reveals that you lklely are quite a controlling parent who does not allow for your child to have their own mind and desires. My statement was simple, does the student enjoy the lessons and the learning experience. That is very simple, it does not require any question answering to you beforehand. Have the lesson, ask was it good or not, very simple and avoids you hovering over any potential teacher thus making the initial relationship more relaxed. You have a better teacher who is relaxed not feeling like they have to answer every little detail to you or work from your timetable of your child's progress or hit all your targets.

I'm really confused why you make this statement (yes a rhetorical question is a statement). You sound offended. I didn't mean to offend anyone. I'm simply stating what I'm looking for in a teacher. Out of the five points I raised in the original post, all are "principles" instead of "details". Four are not "piano" specific, but rather plain educational psychology applied in piano teaching. Ensure that the principles align is exactly for the purpose of not having to micromanage!

Why should I be offended? If you think you know the pedagogy and teaching methods that the teacher should go through so sufficiently then why don't you indeed apply that and teach your own child? Are not open to a teachers individualistic approach to teaching music to various individual students of varying strengths and weaknesses? You need to be open to the fact that "you dont know that you don't know" the many ways to approach music education, you might be surprised with the many methods that might teach muic to your child effectively that are off your radar.

Now again, there is no perfect teacher. There used to be a "bernhard" in this forum some twenty years ago. If he's around in my neighborhood, I'd sign up with him. But mostly likely I will need to make tradeoffs between these points, and that's okay. I'm only trying to do the necessary due diligence, which I think is what a responsible parent ought to do, not a helicopter parent.

I've taught a large amount of students over 30 years and only have come across one family where the parents were constantly questioning and helicoptering. Your monitoring and questionings will not limit themselves to the initiation of your child's lessons.

There are no perfect student either, so the short comings of your child may not resonate at all with any of the teaching ideologies you presented on your opening post, but likely you will blame the teacher for that rather than your child's individualistic needs and ability. You can't just blanket apply teaching theories to students when learning the arts, you'll either learn that quick smart or forever be stuck in a cycle of confusion why your child is not progressing under your prescribed methodology.

Ultimately asking some preliminary questions to ensure general alignment is fine, but overly prescriptive questions as you are generating before the teaching relationship begins comes across as controlling.

[lostinidlewonder]

Many types of learning are happening concurrently in the lesson, making it cumbersome for a teacher to explain everything that is going on.

Exactly and there are a number of pathways to take based on the students individual needs. It would rather useless for some to explain how to move their arms, elbows, joints etc other than the very basics of it all and sometimes that even takes time! Many students indeed work better playing naturally and then slowly forming their mechanique over time which to the op might seem like there is no teaching going on, the same applies for how they mentally process music. I was a talented pianist as a child yet I found it absolutely useless that one of my teachers tried to show me exactly how my arms fingers etc should move, a copy paste ideology, remove this add this.

So trying to explain whats going on to a parent when the teacher themselves are investigating and getting to understand the students strengths and weaknesses is just tiresome and even guesswork to outline it all before even getting to know the student!

[parentofayoungpianist]

"Specifically, I'm looking for these things in a teacher:
-teaches finger-hand-wrist-arm-shoulder coordination instead of just the fingers regarding piano technique. I know there's a lot of controversy on many of the topics regarding piano playing techniques and I personally spent a lot of time reading and researching although I'm just the parent of the learner. I'd like to avoid teachers that prescribe exercises of isolating fingers to lift up while pressing others down.
-can explain the movements of the shoulder, forearm, elbow, wrist, hand, fingers to a student when the student cannot just "copy" what the teacher does kinesthetically. The teacher can tell how the student's movements are not achieving the musical goals and point out the corrective movements. Better yet, the teacher can provide a few different movements for the student to try and choose whichever one that suits them the best."

If this is your primary concern - from the outset of starting lessons, get a teacher who uses the Taubman approach.

Perhaps, many teachers will eventually address the ergonomics ever more specifically, but maybe not so thoroughly in the first lessons.

Thanks for your reply. Yes I've heard about Taubman. In fact, I know many non-Taubman teachers also teach that way although they are not labeled Taubman teachers. I guess I am content to land with a teacher that teaches similar principles of motions, not necessarily a Taubman teacher. And it doesn't have to be in the first lessons.

I think after selecting a teacher to try out, sit in on the lesson(s) and see for yourself.  Many types of learning are happening concurrently in the lesson, making it cumbersome for a teacher to explain everything that is going on. Observing may be your best litmus for understanding what is being conveyed and absorbed as it relates to your child's development. If the child gets enthused, and excited to practice, that would be a sign.

I agree that observing tells a ton. But usually you can only observe so much from one lesson, which is the number of lessons you try out before deciding which teacher to go with. I was thinking if there are other ways to make the decision making more informed.

I think kosulin suggested a very good point that you can tell which school the teacher belongs to from which teachers they studied with, which I really hope for an elaboration. Can kosulin or someone explain the differences between different schools and the "signs" that a teacher belong to a certain school?

And yes, I do look up the teacher's student recitals online if they are available, but most often they are not, and only their best students' performance videos are available.

And by the way I think I also need to clarify, that I didn't mean to have the teacher explain to ME what's going on. I'm not interested in knowing exactly how each part moves. I only want to make sure that the teacher can explain to my kid what's going on. Because many teachers actually cannot explain it, other than just asking the student to copy. And my kid is NOT the kind of kid that can naturally copy what is done kinesthetically.

[lostinidlewonder]

I agree that observing tells a ton. ....I was thinking if there are other ways to make the decision making more informed.

Here it feels like you are contradicting yourself, you say observing tells a ton yet you still want other ways to make the decision making more informed. So a ton of information is still not enough to make an informed decision?

And by the way I think I also need to clarify, that I didn't mean to have the teacher explain to ME what's going on. I'm not interested in knowing exactly how each part moves. I only want to make sure that the teacher can explain to my kid what's going on.

And thus seeing your childs progress and whether they are enjoying and engaging with the lesson is the litmus paper, what else do you need? If you are still unsatisfied despite your child's enjoyment and progress, you might need to consider that you are overthinking it all.

Because many teachers actually cannot explain it, other than just asking the student to copy. And my kid is NOT the kind of kid that can naturally copy what is done kinesthetically.

Do you think that a teacher can verbally describe exactly what the student should do technically? So you believe that piano technique can be described in words? Technique is not acquired just by words and physical direction, it is formed over time studying many pieces and technical studies and depends on the students ability level allowing an amount of intrinsic improvement and comparing improvements to previous lesser playing. I teach technique different to each and every student depending on their capabilities, how could i explain to you how I would do it with your child without even knowing their strengths and weaknesses, am I supposed to outline all the ways in which technique is taught? That is teaching you a lot of pedagogy and a waste of time.


Regarding "piano schools" it is not so distinct these days with the internet and freedom of knowledge. Go back to the early 20th century then you could say there are certain schools which keep their secrets tightly within their circles. Today nothing is secretive and found only within certain circles for all pedagogy can be studied and put under the microscope, modern teachers today can borrow from many sources and modern pedagogy really has derived from a melting pot of knowledge.

[brogers70]

I get why you say that. But like I said earlier, in fact, only one of the five points I raised in the original post is specific to piano pedagogy (the first point). Points 2~5 are just educational psychology applied to piano teaching and I wouldn't count them as "piano pedagogy". As to the first point, I am not insisting against Hanon or any technical drills for that matter, I'm only insisting that the teacher teaches finger-hand-wrist-arm-shoulder coordination, which is exactly what we lack right now. Does anyone think even this is too much to ask of a teacher?

I think you are way too invested in this and that you will end up interfering in a way that will prevent your child from developing as a musician (if that's what s/he wants to do).  You can get recommendations of who is a good teacher, you can go to their student recitals, you can even chat with them a bit about how they like to teach,  but in the end you need to back way off, let the teacher teach, and see how it goes. After a while, say a few months, you can observe whether your child enjoys practicing, has to be forced, whether he seems to be progressing musically, etc. In the end, it's the kid's thing, not yours; if you turn it into your project and an avenue for you to make use of your knowledge of educational psychology, you'll just mess things up. The best thing a parent can do to foster love of music in kids is just to have a lot of good music playing in the house. That and stand back and watch quietly what your kid does.

[dizzyfingers]

I think you are way too invested in this and that you will end up interfering in a way that will prevent your child from developing as a musician (if that's what s/he wants to do).  You can get recommendations of who is a good teacher, you can go to their student recitals, you can even chat with them a bit about how they like to teach,  but in the end you need to back way off, let the teacher teach, and see how it goes. After a while, say a few months, you can observe whether your child enjoys practicing, has to be forced, whether he seems to be progressing musically, etc. In the end, it's the kid's thing, not yours; if you turn it into your project and an avenue for you to make use of your knowledge of educational psychology, you'll just mess things up. The best thing a parent can do to foster love of music in kids is just to have a lot of good music playing in the house. That and stand back and watch quietly what your kid does.

I agree. 

If the kid is as astute as the parent implies, let the kid decide if lessons continue or stop (at period check points).  I started lessons at 10.  After 6 months, I didn't know why, I asked my parents if I could stop.  In hindsight, it was the teacher.  My next teacher, a year later, was squarely trained in the classical tradition - this worked out well, I've never stopped playing and loving music.

[parentofayoungpianist]

I think you are way too invested in this and that you will end up interfering in a way that will prevent your child from developing as a musician (if that's what s/he wants to do).  You can get recommendations of who is a good teacher, you can go to their student recitals, you can even chat with them a bit about how they like to teach,  but in the end you need to back way off, let the teacher teach, and see how it goes. After a while, say a few months, you can observe whether your child enjoys practicing, has to be forced, whether he seems to be progressing musically, etc. In the end, it's the kid's thing, not yours; if you turn it into your project and an avenue for you to make use of your knowledge of educational psychology, you'll just mess things up. The best thing a parent can do to foster love of music in kids is just to have a lot of good music playing in the house. That and stand back and watch quietly what your kid does.

I'm not intervening and will not intervene the teacher's teaching. I just want to do my due diligence at the beginning. An analogy would be as a manager in a company when you are hiring. You have an interview process that a candidate needs to go through, the reference checks, background checks, personality test, rounds and rounds of interview... precisely because you want to be able to "back away" once you hire someone.

[parentofayoungpianist]

Do you think that a teacher can verbally describe exactly what the student should do technically? So you believe that piano technique can be described in words?

Yes and yes. I've seen many great piano teachers post videos on youtube, that explain things in a more clear way than I have ever heard from teachers in real life.
Thinking something is impossible just because you cannot do it puts quite a constraint to your own learning capacity.

[parentofayoungpianist]

I wish Bernhard, Chang and xvimbi were still around. No they are not.
In memory of Bernhard, I'd put a link of his opinion as a parent here:
https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php?topic=19310.msg209948#msg209948

He has articulated it so well that I don't need to add one word.

[lostinidlewonder]

Yes and yes. I've seen many great piano teachers post videos on youtube, that explain things in a more clear way than I have ever heard from teachers in real life.
Thinking something is impossible just because you cannot do it puts quite a constraint to your own learning capacity.

You are severely misinformed if you think technique can be explained in words and isn't experience based. Why not just find these youtube tutorials and have your child learn that instead of wasting thousands of dollars on a teacher?

Based on your logic people can become masters of sports by reading it too, or great artists of any discipline, just read about it. You need to realise from doing something not as correct more correct methods will replace it, there is no mere copy pasting of mastery by conscious thought.

I wish Bernhard, Chang and xvimbi were still around. No they are not.
In memory of Bernhard, I'd put a link of his opinion as a parent here:
https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php?topic=19310.msg209948#msg209948

He has articulated it so well that I don't need to add one word.

Bernhard wasn't the all knowing guru of piano education, plenty of opinions I debated him in which had him with no response and so too I would debate him if he agreed your overly questioning nature to a teacher is helpful. Be as questioning as you like in private all you need to know is that your child is enjoying the lessons and progressing with engagement, nothing else matters. If you are actively involved in your child's education then you will support and amplify the teachers advice not enforce that they teach through a certain bottleneck.

[parentofayoungpianist]

You are severely misinformed if you think technique can be explained in words and isn't experience based. Why not just find these youtube tutorials and have your child learn that instead of wasting thousands of dollars on a teacher?

I'm not saying technique is not experience based. I'm saying a good teacher should be able to BOTH kinesthetically demonstrate technique, AND be able to explain it when the student cannot just kinesthetically copy.

[lostinidlewonder]

I'm not saying technique is not experience based. I'm saying a good teacher should be able to BOTH kinesthetically demonstrate technique, AND be able to explain it when the student cannot just kinesthetically copy.

Then read what i responded with carefully and not just blatantly say yes.

You have talked past my concept of how technique is taught,  until you do so your stance is unsubstantiated. I put it to you again that talking and demonstrating are not enough and it is multiple iterations of technical development through intrinsic understanding of improvements replacing old methods with better ones through experience base that is key, not just talking and demonstrating. What words do you want to hear beforehand before you trust a teacher will teach your child how to technically improve?

The proof is in the results and do you know your child's capabilities, do you believe they are a prodigy at piano or a struggling untalented student or what shade in-between? Would you blame the teacher for your child's slow progress if it is your child that is severely untalented? Thus knowing if your child enjoys the lessons and is engaged really in the best indicator of successful lessons because their rate of progress doesn't lie solely on the teachers shoulders.

[brogers70]

Yes and yes. I've seen many great piano teachers post videos on youtube, that explain things in a more clear way than I have ever heard from teachers in real life.
Thinking something is impossible just because you cannot do it puts quite a constraint to your own learning capacity.

There are definitely limits to verbal explanation. It's not useless, certainly, and some people are better at using it than others. But how do you evaluate the explanations if you don't play the piano and cannot do what you think they are telling you to do? There's a lot of fussing about words in different strands of piano pedagogy; there are some real differences between methods, but there are many more differences in how things that are essentially the same are described. I don't think there is a real "fingers only" school out there. Exercises that may seem very "fingers only" to you from the outside, can have important uses in real playing. For example, those exercises about playing some notes while keeping other fingers depressed in different combinations are not finger exercises as much as brain exercises. They are not aiming to change strength or looseness of the fingers but to strengthen pathways from the motor cortex to individual fingers (which in daily life often work together and so don't develop independent neural control pathways). That sort of training is very helpful for playing contrapuntal music like Bach. Pretty much any school of piano teaching that is active now recognizes the importance of trunk-shoulder-arm-wrist-finger coordination, though they may describe things in different ways.

One thing I learned as a student is that you cannot be too attached to specific words. I remember one teacher trying to correct my wrist position in a particular scalar passage. She told me what to do. I did what she said. She told me it was still wrong and I should sit in a low chair with a good view of her wrist and watch her demonstrate. I copied what she had done and she said "Yes, that's exactly right, much better." Then I described the sort of motion I was doing and she said "No, that's totally wrong," even though when I hadn't put it in words, she thought I was doing it correctly. She was a pianist, I was a doctor - we described anatomic motions differently. Sometimes words help, sometimes they don't. Sometimes someone can show you an exercise and explain how it works and the rationale behind it. The words can be wrong, but the exercise helpful, or vice versa.

You don't want to reject a good teacher because they use a different vocabulary than you expect to describe what they do. Nor do you want to accept a bad teacher just because their answers to your questions use the right phrases. In the end you just have to give it a trial, and in any case a whole lot of the success or failure of the teaching will depend on the personal relations between the teacher and the student.