Ravel's Sonatine, 3rd mvmt - some detailed questions

[cognoscentus]

Hi folks -

For the Ravel aficionados out there - I'm working on the 3rd movement of the Sonatine right now, and want to get some advice.

1. Tempo. My edition marks it 152-160, and a lot of recordings have it around 160+. Yet Perlemuter plays it about 140, and he's the one who sat at the piano with Ravel. (put aside for now the fact that I can handle 140 and can't get to 160 yet)

2. Fingering measures 1-3. I do LH 5-4-3-1-3, RH 3-2-3-2-1, LH 1-3 which differs from Ravels indication as well as my editor (Hinson). I'd love to hear what others do.

3. Fingering measures 12-16, quarter notes in bass. I do 1-3-2-1-2-3 to keep it legato, although it seems a bit unnatural and differs from how I do 26-30 (which is 1-2-1-2-1-2). Again I'd love to hear what other do.

4. Measures 16-17, melody line. I'm trying to figure out whether this should be 5-3-5-5-3-5 or 5-3-4-5-3-5. The former is consistent with how I do measures 12 and 14, so its easier, yet the latter can sound choppy if im not careful. Any ideas?


Thanks in advance.

-Jon.

btw- for those of you on PW, you may notice I repeated this post there.  Sorry for that.

[lostinidlewonder]

For measure 1-3 I would use this sharing of hands;

LH32 RH12 LH(3or2)  RH43432 LH12

when the Lh plays alone the similar form, in bars 4-9 then id use: LH: 4321 3232 3123

This provides an easier opportunity to strike the accented notes which should be especially evident when the LH(3or2) plays + you can generate incredible speed with this without effort.

measure 12-16
RH: 521, 421, 531  |  431, 531, 5 (12) 4 | 5 ... so on
LH: I would use 2 1 1 | 1 2 3 for the passage of the upper voice, of course just use 5 for the minims.

for measure 17:
RH: 521, 421, 521.  this tests the flexibility of the 4 and 5.

[cognoscentus]

For measure 1-3 I would use this sharing of hands;
LH32 RH12 LH(3or2)  RH43432 LH12

Interesting, that is close to what Ravel indicated.  I've found Ravel's indicated hand sharing to be awkward, but I have big hands.  I'll give your variant a try though.  Thanks.

measure 12-16
LH: I would use 2 1 1 | 1 2 3 for the passage of the upper voice.

How do you achieve legato?  Do you help out with a bit of pedal?


Thanks.  Also, what are your thoughts about tempo?

[lostinidlewonder]

12-16. I hold the sustain as the LH melody increases in volume then pedal off each note as you come down and decres. Alternatively you probably could get away with pedaling each LH minum although i find it distorts a little as you come down the keyboard for my liking.

The tempo fluxuates through the entire piece, i wouldn't start it faster than 140ish beats per min. To me it sounds too fast otherwise. I personally think when its played at 160ish you miss a lot of the sound, the group of 3 notes, how Ravel utilises it throughout the peice can be distored at too fast a tempo. It should sound aminated not lighting fast.