Shostakovich vs Prokofiev

[zalmanesd]

Which do you guys like better as a composer?
Not referring to any specific pieces...just wondering.
I think I like Shostakovich more because he is more emotional than Prokofiev.

[steinwayguy]

Prokofiev, easily.

He's as, if not more, emotional than Shostakovich. Listen to sonatas 6-8 or those piano concerti. Not emotional???

[ted]

I don't like either very much but sometimes I stick on Jarrett playing Shostakovitch's preludes and fugues and quite enjoy them - in small doses.

[apion]

Prokofiev, easily.

He's as, if not more, emotional than Shostakovich. Listen to sonatas 6-8 or those piano concerti. Not emotional???

Prokofiev by at least a 3 to 1 margin.

Prokofiev's Piano Concerti 2 and 3 are far beyond anything Shostakovich has composed for piano and orchestra.

[pianonut]

i don't think there should be a 'versus' because there is always uniqueness in every pianist/composer.  prokofiev would be my personal favorite for piano, and shostakovich for symphonic pieces.  prokofiev thought of the piano as a percussive instrument and began putting out very complicated rhythms (very useful for learning rhythm) and percussive sounds from the piano.  he was bold enough to play HIS OWN piano concerto in D flat at the Rubenstein piano competition - even though there was much discussion right before.  it was agreed that it would be all right - if each member of the jury had a copy of the concerto.  he was also bold, in that competition, because when his turn came to play a prelude and fugue he instead playedthe Kunst der Fuge.  Bartok-Prokofiev-Stravinsky all played the 'hammer-clavier' and brought along Poulenc and Milhaud's style.  Avant-garde and anti-romantic.  ( from 'the great pianists' by arnold schoenberg)

[Musicag]

Prokofiev, by a few notches.

[apion]

i don't think there should be a 'versus' because there is always uniqueness in every pianist/composer. 

Yeah, maybe, but it's human nature to have a "versus."  Think of all the lawsuits .... all of the wars ..... all of the sports competitions.

I say, if you don't like competition (i.e. the "versus" element), go become a Tibetan philosopher and drink tea and eat rice with your Llama.

[BoliverAllmon]

I prefer Shostakovich over Prokofiev. Though I don't think it is fair on either end to compare. Fun yes, but fair no. THink about it. Shostakovich was quoted as saying that he wasn't satisfied most of his pieces. He had to curb back on his compositions so as not to get into more trouble and possibly face death. Prokofiev also had his issues. When he lived outside of Russia he was doing fine, but when he moved back to Russia and started composing more Russianesque type music he turned to crap. He was looking for the russian people to accept him and embrace him but it never happened. He had to compose three different versions of his Romeo and Juliet in an attempt to please everyone. (which by the way didn't happen the people still thought it was crap). I really feel bad for both composers. Tough lives.

boliver

[apion]

I prefer Shostakovich over Prokofiev. Though I don't think it is fair on either end to compare. Fun yes, but fair no. THink about it. Shostakovich was quoted as saying that he wasn't satisfied most of his pieces. He had to curb back on his compositions so as not to get into more trouble and possibly face death. Prokofiev also had his issues. When he lived outside of Russia he was doing fine, but when he moved back to Russia and started composing more Russianesque type music he turned to crap. He was looking for the russian people to accept him and embrace him but it never happened. He had to compose three different versions of his Romeo and Juliet in an attempt to please everyone. (which by the way didn't happen the people still thought it was crap). I really feel bad for both composers. Tough lives.

boliver

We're talking about the intrinsic merit of each respective composer.  We shouldn't consider non-musical issues (such as constraints imposed by the Russian regime).  If we considered Beethoven's deafness, for example, he would decisively be deemed the greatest composer, primarily by virtue of his overcoming his handicap.

[pianonut]

dear apion,

i agree with you on prokofiev.  do you still want to make war?  just for the fun of it?

i think you'd actually enjoy tibet.  i don't know if people can breath well up there, tho.  i've heard you have to get used to it (over time).  one time, i actually did climb a mountain and end up above the clouds.  it was kind of a wierd feeling to be above the clouds.  i love animals, too, so llamas would be cool.

[BoliverAllmon]

We're talking about the intrinsic merit of each respective composer.  We shouldn't consider non-musical issues (such as constraints imposed by the Russian regime).  If we considered Beethoven's deafness, for example, he would decisively be deemed the greatest composer, primarily by virtue of his overcoming his handicap.

I see your point, but I think that seeing how a composer overcomes trials with his music adds to the greatness of that composer.

I do put Beethoven very high on the list of great composers not only because of his beautiful music, but also because he was deaf.

All of that aside though if you want my opinion on strictly music here goes.

Shostakovich spanks prokofiev when coming to symphonic works. I believe Shosty's 15 symphonies can compare in greatness to Beethoven's (doesn't beat Beethoven but worthy of mention in the same sentence)

I think Prokofiev beats Shostakovich when it comes to PC's. Though I think that Shosty's 2nd mvt to his 2nd concerto is one of the most beautiful movements it isn't enough in itself to beat Prokofiev.

On the solo piano part, I am torn. Not since Bach has someone written such a great collection of works as Shosty's P&F. That are absolutely phenomenal. Prokofiev on the other hand wrote great sonatas and the such. So I won't pick who is better.

Opera and ballet is another place that I am torn with. I love the operas from both men.

That is my opinion for now, but I reserve the right to change it if I so please down the road. LOL

[Sketchee]

I like Shostakovich for his chamber music and Prokofiev for his orchestral work.  For solo piano, I'm not that -excited- by either.  I'd have to favor Prokofiev overall though.

Btw, Prokofiev wrote five versions of his Romeo and Juliet: Ballet, the Ten Piano Pieces, and three Orchestral Suites.  While during the initial conception of the original ballet it was thought to be "undancable", it was reworked and once it was public it was instantly loved.  The excerpted versions are today more popular than the ballet
(It was Tchaikovsky's Romeo and Juliet that was critically disliked upon it's debut except for the love theme. "After the concert we dined.... No one said a single word to me about the overture the whole evening. And yet I yearned so for appreciation and kindness."  Tchaikovsky reworked it twice around the love theme and suggestions and that's the second version is what's most known today.)

[BoliverAllmon]

I like Shostakovich for his chamber music and Prokofiev for his orchestral work.  For solo piano, I'm not that -excited- by either.  I'd have to favor Prokofiev overall though.

Btw, Prokofiev wrote five versions of his Romeo and Juliet: Ballet, the Ten Piano Pieces, and three Orchestral Suites.  While during the initial conception of the original ballet it was thought to be "undancable", it was reworked and once it was public it was instantly loved.  The excerpted versions are today more popular than the ballet
(It was Tchaikovsky's Romeo and Juliet that was critically disliked upon it's debut except for the love theme. "After the concert we dined.... No one said a single word to me about the overture the whole evening. And yet I yearned so for appreciation and kindness."  Tchaikovsky reworked it twice around the love theme and suggestions and that's the second version is what's most known today.)

I knew prokofiev revamped it, but it looks like I got some info mixed up. Thanks for the correction.

[pianonut]

dear boliverallimon and all,

interesting things you write.  i guess i haven't listened to all of shostakovich (haven't listened to preludes and fugues)so maybe i can't compare, yet.  will go and listen. glad that some agree about his orchestration - though i am starting to see that it is really unfair to compare since they were attempting to create different ideas from each other (and were both original).

[BoliverAllmon]

dear boliverallimon and all,

interesting things you write.  i guess i haven't listened to all of shostakovich (haven't listened to preludes and fugues)so maybe i can't compare, yet.  will go and listen. glad that some agree about his orchestration - though i am starting to see that it is really unfair to compare since they were attempting to create different ideas from each other (and were both original).

if you listen to the P&F do not listen to keith jarret's recordings. I despise them. Listen to Ashkenazy's recordings of them. Also there is a recording of a lady named Nina something (at least I think that was her name). The pieces were written specifically for her and she recorded them after working with Shostakovich himself for several months. I think she rerecorded them, but you should really try to get the '62 version it is great.

boliver

[pianonut]

ok.  thank you!  i will look up nina.

[apion]

dear apion,

i agree with you on prokofiev.  do you still want to make war?  just for the fun of it?

i think you'd actually enjoy tibet.  i don't know if people can breath well up there, tho.  i've heard you have to get used to it (over time).  one time, i actually did climb a mountain and end up above the clouds.  it was kind of a wierd feeling to be above the clouds.  i love animals, too, so llamas would be cool.

Well, my comment about war is that it seems to be a part of man's nature -- whether we like it or not.  So this whole x vs. y theme is also, by analogy, part of man's nature. 

Yeah, Tibet could be pretty rad, actually. 

[apion]

I see your point, but I think that seeing how a composer overcomes trials with his music adds to the greatness of that composer.

I do put Beethoven very high on the list of great composers not only because of his beautiful music, but also because he was deaf.

I think factoring in (or considering) the adversities that a composer overcomes adds to our depth of appreciation of the composer's greatness ...... but it doesn't add to his intrinsic greatness.  Splitting hairs, perhaps.

[BoliverAllmon]

I think factoring in (or considering) the adversities that a composer overcomes adds to our depth of appreciation of the composer's greatness ...... but it doesn't add to his intrinsic greatness.  Splitting hairs, perhaps.

perhaps indeed. I can see your point though.

[zalmanesd]

Prokofiev, easily.

He's as, if not more, emotional than Shostakovich. Listen to sonatas 6-8 or those piano concerti. Not emotional???

well those are pretty emotional but not in the Shostakovich sense.
Like its like emotions within kinda thing...still powerful..but Shostakovich bursts out.

[dinosaurtales]

Well, after all the fuss, the choice is really simple for me - Prokofiev is my guy.  I just LOVE the way he makes you constantly think he's going to tip over the edge and go completely dissonant - but he doesn't really do it.  He makes you constantly think the next little set of chords will be the resolution to all the stuff you've been hearing - but it isn't.  He's just always on that cusp - ahhhhhhhh!

[BoliverAllmon]

Well, after all the fuss, the choice is really simple for me - Prokofiev is my guy.  I just LOVE the way he makes you constantly think he's going to tip over the edge and go completely dissonant - but he doesn't really do it.  He makes you constantly think the next little set of chords will be the resolution to all the stuff you've been hearing - but it isn't.  He's just always on that cusp - ahhhhhhhh!

Sounds like Shosty. I love how he will have a 12 tone row playing say in the lower violins while the solo instrument will play something completely tonal and make the 12 tone row work magnificently. it is atonal, but yet it isn't.

boliver

[zemos]

How can you make this kind of comparison?? A better composer, it's absurd!
Each one of them has his own specialties and the unique style of writing. Anyhow, it's a matter of a personalized opinion, so the question should be phrased: "Who do you like more?", not "Who is a best composer?"....

WELL!
Although shostakovich was born some years after prokofiev, he's much more temperate, less modern (I think) and more understandable. Prokofiev broke the rules, created something new. Shostakovich used what already was, fitting himself to the period's spirit.
They both has wonderful symphonies (I like shostakovich's more though), beautiful piano music and piano concertos (I like Prokofiev's more though), two violin concertos each.
They're both wonderful composers which I love anyhow.

[Skeptopotamus]

i like prokofiev more,  but i think he is much much less emotional.  try his sonata no 1.  very emotional tho i guess.

[dbrainiak914]

I love Shostakovich's Symphonies... whenever I hear them, I think "if I were to write a symphony, I'd probably like to write something like this."  You know, nothing too great and magnificent, just equally cunning.

But Prokofiev PC and PS rule.  They own Shostakovich's soul.   

[apion]

I love Shostakovich's Symphonies... whenever I hear them, I think "if I were to write a symphony, I'd probably like to write something like this."  You know, nothing too great and magnificent, just equally cunning.

But Prokofiev PC and PS rule.  They own Shostakovich's soul.   

I agree that Shostakovich's symphonies run circles around Prokofiev's (although P's 5th and 6th symphonies are amazing, as is P's 1st Symphony .........).  I'd be interested in knowing what Shostakovich Symphonies are everyone's favorites?  My faves are 5 and 10.

[BoliverAllmon]

I agree that Shostakovich's symphonies run circles around Prokofiev's (although P's 5th and 6th symphonies are amazing, as is P's 1st Symphony .........).  I'd be interested in knowing what Shostakovich Symphonies are everyone's favorites?  My faves are 5 and 10.

his first is also good

[Skeptopotamus]

5 and 10 for me too ^^

[musik_man]

5 and 9

Five is so full of emotion.  Particularly the Moderato and Largo.

The 9th is so concise and witty.  It's a real joy to listen to.

[Etude]

Which do you guys like better as a composer?
Not referring to any specific pieces...just wondering.
I think I like Shostakovich more because he is more emotional than Prokofiev.

Definately Prokofiev.   

[transitional]

Prokofiev - this may seem like a huge stretch, but Shostakovich just created "epic" music (analogous to what's used for video games today) while I think of Prokofiev as the contemporary continuation off the Beethoven line. The Op. 103 piano sonata is simply transcendental.

[kosulin]

Babe Ruth or LeBron?
How can two greats be compared?
Said that, IMO:
Prokofiev is bigger at piano.
Shostakovich is bigger at symphonies and strings.

[lelle]

Personality wise they are very different. So it's a little bit like choosing dessert. It depends on what I'm in the mood for.