New riddle thread(1)

[bernhard]

Chh, that comes so *** near the truth that I do not know what to do. I mean, obviously, the Eroica Symphony is no piano piece...
On the other hand, the whole point of "it is more probable", "think theme-wise" etc. is so strongly linked with this symphony that that is nearly the answer . So no strike two for you, but it isn't completely correct either...

15 variations and fugue In Eb on an original theme "eroica" op. 35

[bernhard]

15 variations and fugue In Eb on an original theme "eroica" op. 36

By Beethoven, of course.

[rhapsody in orange]

Haha no more guesses for me since I've made wrong guesses.. check my previous posts =) haha but lol at least I've learnt some stuff and spent time looking up on works/composers haha =)

[TheHammer]

15 variations and fugue In Eb on an original theme "eroica" op. 35

Okay, this is kind of the correct answer , and I said I will accept it (that was the dedication question). But, first of all, I had a different piece in mind, but the Variation (or should I say the theme) come very near it. And I would be interested if anyone has an explanation for the solution... Let's say one hour, from now on, and if someone gives the exact and detailed answer, I am sure Bernhard will be willing to leave his right of the next question.

@rhapsody, as you will notice, your last guess wasn't wrong at all...

[rhapsody in orange]

variations for piano trio op 44 beethoven

[TheHammer]

variations for piano trio op 44 beethoven

Huh, why that? No, not really 
The solution is still very related to Bernhards guess. And the very piece I am looking for is for piano solo. My answer that more instruments could play it referred to the Eroica Symphony, fourth movement (your guess). Here we have the theme again...

But what has that to do with 2.5 times as probable than Brahms sonata??

45 minutes to go...

[rhapsody in orange]

Haha lol actually I still don't understand that bit about the 2.5 times more probable bit. But ah well.. gonna wait till the correct guesser reveals it =)

[TheHammer]

Haha lol actually I still don't understand that bit about the 2.5 times more probable bit. But ah well.. gonna wait till the correct guesser reveals it =)

hmm, now that we said that the theme of the variations is also in the symphony, wouldn't you think that it is "more probable" to hear this theme then?

And for the Brahms.... https://www.henle.de/google/komponisten/Brahms_Johannes_en.htm

[bernhard]

Here is my guess then:

Beethoven composed in 1800 a series of 12 country dances ("Contredanses"), no. 7 in Eb is hte first time the "Eroica Theme" is presented. The original version is for orchestra, but maybe there is a version for piano solo. Could that be the piece you are hinting at?

In 1801 he used the theme in the finale of his ballet "Prometheus".

Then again in the finale of the Eroica.

And finally in his 15 variations op. 35.

So the original theme has been done 5 times.

In contrast Brahms sonata for clarinet and piano op. 120 (there are 2 of them) have versions for viola as well. Hence two versions.

5/2 = 2.5.

[I must say at this point that I am stretching things a bit, for I believe there is also a violin version for the Brahms, but since that is not by him I decided to ignore it].

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[TheHammer]

Here is my guess then:

Beethoven composed in 1800 a series of 12 country dances ("Contredanses"), no. 7 in Eb is hte first time the "Eroica Theme" is presented. The original version is for orchestra, but maybe there is a version for piano solo. Could that be the piece you are hinting at?

In 1801 he used the theme in the finale of his ballet "Prometheus".

Then again in the finale of the Eroica.

And finally in his 15 variations op. 35.

So the original theme has been done 5 times.

In contrast Brahms sonata for clarinet and piano op. 120 (there are 2 of them) have versions for viola as well. Hence two versions.

5/2 = 2.5.

[I must say at this point that I am stretching things a bit, for I believe there is also a violin version for the Brahms, but since that is not by him I decided to ignore it].

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

You are luckily that I could not come here earlier, for the time limit was over.
Beside that... you are completely right . I didn't know the Contredanse was for orchestra, so sorry for that, but that was the piece, exactly, and I ignored the violin version (arggh!). And, okay, I did not meant the variations to be the fifth time (it would have been the Liszt transcription, since it is performed also sometimes, so that it would have been the "exact" theme...). Anyway, I admit the whole statement was confusing, I could simply have written: Which theme is existing five time in the repertoire? or something similar. But then, on the other hand, that would not by far have been so amusing. 

Well, anyway, quite surprisingly, Bernhard did it in the end. It is your turn (again)!

[bernhard]

You are luckily that I could not come here earlier, for the time limit was over.
Beside that... you are completely right . I dind't know the Contredanse was for orchestra, so sorry for that, but that was the piece, exactly. Well, okay, I did not meant the variations to be the fifth time (it would have been the Liszt transcription, since it is performed also sometimes...). Anyway, I admit the whole statement was confusing, I could simply have written: Which theme is existing five time in the repertoire? or something similar. But then, on the other hand, that would not by far have been so amusing. 

Well, anyway, quite surprisingly, Bernhard did it in the end. It is your turn (again)!

I agree with you, this way is vastly more amusing, since one does need to dig the information and comes across all sorts of arcane knowledge.

"This is a most beautiful piece, and the composer is probaly only known because of it. Funnily enough he did not compose it".

[TheHammer]

When this composition was published, was it commonly known that the composer did not compose this work?

[anda]

is it a work based on a folks' or anonymous theme?

[bernhard]

When this composition was published, was it commonly known that the composer did not compose this work?

Yes. The composer made no secret of it, and even acknowledged the real composer.

[bernhard]

is it a work based on a folks' or anonymous theme?

No. It is based on a famous work.

[rhapsody in orange]

Does the composer produce any other kinds of works?

[anda]

is the composer better known for works of different genre (not piano works, i mean), or as pianist?

[chopinisque]

Is he the great Lizst?

I take that back!

Was it a transcription?

[bernhard]

Does the composer produce any other kinds of works?

Most definitely yes.

[bernhard]

is the composer better known for works of different genre (not piano works, i mean), or as pianist?

Nowadays, he is mostly known by this piece that was not actually composed by him. But in his day he was well known for all his works (whcich includes a substatntial number of piano pieces).

[bernhard]

Is he the great Lizst?

I take that back!

Was it a transcription?

No, he is not the great liszt (nor the small one )

Yes, you could say it was a transcription (although I like to think of it as a "version").

[Toivot]

Is he german?

[bernhard]

Is he german?

No.

[anda]

i'll risk a strike:  (bach) busoni d chaconne?

[bernhard]

i'll risk a strike:  (bach) busoni d chaconne?

No. 

(However there were five pieces of information in your answer. You got one right. )

[xvimbi]

Did the composer once win the Prix de Rome?

[Vinteuil]

Is it a solo piano work ?

[rhapsody in orange]

Is the composer born after 1800?

[bernhard]

Did the composer once win the Prix de Rome?

No (at least I am not aware of it). However, Rome is in the right direction.

[bernhard]

Is it a solo piano work ?

Yes.

[bernhard]

Is the composer born after 1800?

Yes.

[Floristan]

Is Horowitz known for playing this piece?

[xvimbi]

Does the piece have something to do with horses?

[xvimbi]

Sorry. I am retracting my question about the horses.

Does the work have anything to do with courtesy towards women?

(Which one doesn't, really)

[rhapsody in orange]

Is the composer born before 1900?

[bernhard]

Is Horowitz known for playing this piece?

I don't think so, at least not particularly. However another popular Russian pianist often palys it as an encore. It was a favourite encore of the late Brazilian pianist Guiomar Novaes, as it is of Nelson Freire.

[bernhard]

Sorry. I am retracting my question about the horses.

Does the work have anything to do with courtesy towards women?

(Which one doesn't, really)

Horses? Nah.

Courtesy towards women? Not in any obvious way that I can think of.

[bernhard]

Is the composer born before 1900?

Yes.

[rhapsody in orange]

Did the composer die at an age of 68?

[chopinisque]

Is the composer from the land of the consuls and curriate assemblies?

[anda]

did this composer run away from the nazis during ww2?

[bernhard]

Did the composer die at an age of 68?

No. 73.

[bernhard]

Is the composer from the land of the consuls and curriate assemblies?

Indeed.

[bernhard]

did this composer run away from the nazis during ww2?

Er... I don't think he would be in a condition to run anywhere by the time of WW2. Nor would he be in a condition to care.

[rhapsody in orange]

Did the composer die after 1900?

[bernhard]

Did the composer die after 1900?

Yes, he did.

[Skeptopotamus]

are the composer's initials LJ?

[bernhard]

are the composer's initials LJ?

No.

[Floristan]

Is the composer from the land of the consuls and curriate assemblies?

I get that this is a reference to the Holy Roman Empire, but it covered a lot of territory, so...

...is the composer Italian?

[chopinisque]

Is it Scenes From Childhood by Pinto?  It is a bit of a stretch...