R.Schumann - interesting facts

[S.Melentieva]

Hello, friends. My favourite composer is Robert Schumann, and I am keen on interesting fact in his biography. I know all  basic things, and it is some interesting events, sayings of his, curious facts that I am really interested in. For instance, we all know about his great love to Clara Vikk, hers to him,and that they had 7 children together, but  I read somewhere that Robert was a severely jelous man, and that he sometimes closed Clara in the room not letting her go out for days in gelousy, and I wonder, if that's true..
 Write me if you know something, please. I'd appreciate a lot!

[asyncopated]

Hi

Here is what I know.  Not sure how accurate it is, but I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong.  Some interesting facts.

He was a budding vituoso pianist.
Met Clara, who was his tutor's daughter.
She too was a virtuoso pianist.
At that time women were not allowed to perform in public. 
Fell in love with Clara who was 9 (?) years younger than he was.
Ran off with her and married her against her father's wishes.
Ruined his solo career by using an apparatus to stretch his hand.
He wanted big hands (haha, so do I but I work with my limitations).
He became editor of a highly acclaimed music journal.
He turned to composing.
A young man named Brahms knocked at his door when he was about 30.
He thought that Brahms was extremely talented and took him on as a protege.
Brahms live with them for a long time (?).
Schumann was very smart, often used cyphers in this work -- he would encrypt messages in his music, just as Bach did. (I don't know any off the top of my head.)
Many assocaite his style with picture music.
He did also praised Chopin several times, for both his piano technique and his compositions.
He contracted some disease at about 35 (?)  Syphillis (?).
He went insane, not sure if it was because of the disease. 
He was suicidal to begin with and did attempt to kill himself several times.
He was depressed for a long time.
He was warded a year or two before he died. 
He did kill himself at age 37(?).

Brahm's frist symphony was written in memory of him/their relationship. 
You can hear the final movement with with all three/four(?) voices depicting Brahm, Schumann and Clara.

He did influence Brahms and the Brahms school immensely.  I'm not sure what he thought about the Wagnerian camp. 

al.

[thracozaag]

  He kept careful track and indicated on which days he had sex with Clara (in his diary), heh.

koji (STSD)

[claudio]

there was a dissertation published recently in germany by Friederike Preiss) "Der Prozess, Robert und Clara Schumanns Kontroverse mit Friedrich Wieck", Pater Lang Verlag). For those who can read german: https://zeus.zeit.de/text/2005/07/R_Schumann)

Apparently mrs. preiss makes a scientifically well founded argument against the historical transfiguration of Robert Schumann as a loving genius.

Schumanns life was tough. he seems to have been an excellent pianist, but destroyed his abilities by overexercising. he also aborted his law studies and had to live from a meager income as a journalist and editor of an unknown music journal
and by publishing his own music (which he financed by himself, most of the time
business failures).

when he met clara, he was basically broke, suffering from syphilis, an alcoholic
and depressed. no wonder he did not leave the best impression on mr. wieck,
claras father...

clara was young, a much better pianist than robert and had already earned
a small fortune by performing. in 19th century germany (as anywhere else in these
times) there was not much room for female intellectual and financial development. For whatever argument there is against mr. wieck, he certainly noticed his daughters extraordinary abilities, cultivated them and invested in her.

he also knew that, by 19th century law, claras fortune would move into the hands of robert after their marriage due to her legal status as a minor. basically, he was right. after their marriage, robert and clara moved to leipzig (a very small and provincial town then), had 8 children. her rare appearances on stage (denmark, russia) were only allowed by a jealous, obsessive and tyrant husband to finance the family.

the article is headed "the ice-cold genius".

sounds different from asycopateds version, eh?  

[S.Melentieva]

Hi

Here is what I know.  Not sure how accurate it is, but I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong.  Some interesting facts.

He was a budding vituoso pianist.
Met Clara, who was his tutor's daughter.
She too was a virtuoso pianist.
At that time women were not allowed to perform in public. 
Fell in love with Clara who was 9 (?) years younger than he was.
Ran off with her and married her against her father's wishes.
Ruined his solo career by using an apparatus to stretch his hand.
He wanted big hands (haha, so do I but I work with my limitations).
He became editor of a highly acclaimed music journal.
He turned to composing.
A young man named Brahms knocked at his door when he was about 30.
He thought that Brahms was extremely talented and took him on as a protege.
Brahms live with them for a long time (?).
Schumann was very smart, often used cyphers in this work -- he would encrypt messages in his music, just as Bach did. (I don't know any off the top of my head.)
Many assocaite his style with picture music.
He did also praised Chopin several times, for both his piano technique and his compositions.
He contracted some disease at about 35 (?)  Syphillis (?).
He went insane, not sure if it was because of the disease.

   - Well, he went insane not because of the disease, but cuz/ he started to hear a permanent tone in his head, and it never went away; music overwhelmed his mind, and he constantly heard it, and could not sleep at night putting it down. In his "Humorisques" in latest opuses he added the 3rd line and noted "inner voive", maening that a musician was supposed to have that melody in his head while playing certaing places..

He was suicidal to begin with and did attempt to kill himself several times.
He was depressed for a long time.
He was warded a year or two before he died. 
He did kill himself at age 37(?).

Brahm's frist symphony was written in memory of him/their relationship. 
You can hear the final movement with with all three/four(?) voices depicting Brahm, Schumann and Clara.

- That's really interesting! never came across.

He did influence Brahms and the Brahms school immensely.  I'm not sure what he thought about the Wagnerian camp. 
- me neither:(
al.
Thanx a lot! You have quite a good bunch of knowlegde!

[S.Melentieva]

  He kept careful track and indicated on which days he had sex with Clara (in his diary), heh.

koji (STSD)

Really?  :)Did you happen to read how often they had sex?

[S.Melentieva]

there was a dissertation published recently in germany by Friederike Preiss) "Der Prozess, Robert und Clara Schumanns Kontroverse mit Friedrich Wieck", Pater Lang Verlag). For those who can read german: https://zeus.zeit.de/text/2005/07/R_Schumann)

Apparently mrs. preiss makes a scientifically well founded argument against the historical transfiguration of Robert Schumann as a loving genius.

Schumanns life was tough. he seems to have been an excellent pianist, but destroyed his abilities by overexercising. he also aborted his law studies and had to live from a meager income as a journalist and editor of an unknown music journal
and by publishing his own music (which he financed by himself, most of the time
business failures).

when he met clara, he was basically broke, suffering from syphilis, an alcoholic
and depressed. no wonder he did not leave the best impression on mr. wieck,
claras father...

clara was young, a much better pianist than robert and had already earned
a small fortune by performing. in 19th century germany (as anywhere else in these
times) there was not much room for female intellectual and financial development. For whatever argument there is against mr. wieck, he certainly noticed his daughters extraordinary abilities, cultivated them and invested in her.

he also knew that, by 19th century law, claras fortune would move into the hands of robert after their marriage due to her legal status as a minor. basically, he was right. after their marriage, robert and clara moved to leipzig (a very small and provincial town then), had 8 children. her rare appearances on stage (denmark, russia) were only allowed by a jealous, obsessive and tyrant husband to finance the family.

the article is headed "the ice-cold genius".

sounds different from asycopateds version, eh?  

[color=Red]THat's really is an interesting point of view. But I think that when one has a vulnerable soul and unstable emotional inner workings, like Shuman did, the ice-cold air is sort of defence, it's how one tryis to keep oneself safe in this life..sometimes overdoing and hurting oneself and people loving, like it turned out with Robert Shuman. Ohh..  [/color]

[rhapsody in orange]

Hmm here's some information I obtained from the Oxford Concise Dictionary of Music:

1. Studied Law at Liepzig and Heidelberg University but main interest were music and Romantic literature.
2. In 1828, met Clara, to whose father Friedrich he went for piano lessons in 1829, lodging with him and beginning to compose.
3. In 1832, Permanently injured hand by device he had invented to keep the 4th finger immobile while practising.
4. Contributed music criticism to German papers and in 1831 called attention to Chopin's genius.
5. Depressed by music situation in Germany, founded David Club in 1834 to fight artistic philistines, and periodical Neue Zeitschrift fur Musik, which he edited for 10 yrs.
6. In writings and compositions gave himself dual personality; Florestan for his impetuous self and Eusebius for his contemplative side.
7. Married Clara Wieck 1840 after long opposition from her father, this being followed by outpouring of songs and song-cycles.
8. Taught composition at Leipzig Conservatory. Toured Russia with Clara, 1844.
9. On return had sever attack of depression. Moved to Dresden in search of quiet, living there until 1850.
10. In 1846, Clara gave first performance of his piano concerto and Mendelssohn conducted first performance of his 2nd Symphony.
11. In 1850 moved to Dusseldorf in hope of earning more by conducting but was not a success.
12. Met 20 yr old Brahms in 1853, acclaiming him in article 'New Paths'
13. The next year his mental health failed and he threw himself into Rhine, but was saved and taken to private asylum where he lived another 2 yrs.

That's about all I could find in the dictionary.

[rafant]

I like this anecdote: Schumann was traveling and arrived to a city; he felt like playing piano and so decided to go to a piano dealer. With the pretext that he had to purchase one for an important person, and had to test them first, he sat and played for 3 hours, to his joy and his fortunate listeners'.

Kreisleriana, one of his greatest piano works, was inspired by his love for Clara, and it's full of remembrances about their relationship. He wrote to her: "You will smile when you play my Kreisleriana, you will recognize yourself in it". Movements 2 and 3 are sublime music.