Excentric teacher?

[lagin]

What's the most excentric thing your teacher ever did to get you to understand her meaning or the mood of the piece?  When my teacher is trying to get me to "feel" a piece she moves every thing out of her way and thinks up a senario capturing the mood and then acts it out for me.  Last one was pushing an imaginary car up an imaginary hill, and then having it start to gain momentum as it went back down the imaginary hill.  I think we were studying a Bach fugue

[m1469]

Well, these things are what he would do to get me to feel music on a broader basis, not necessarily just one piece... at least this is how I am choosing to explain it to myself anyway. 

He would drive wedges between my friends and me.  Any time I made a new friend, it was not long before they were distanced from me, by him.

He wove a lie about me regarding one piece in particular, to my best friend at the time, striving to get her angry at me and whatever else he had up his sleeve.


hmm, there are more, but heh...

m1469

[pianowelsh]

I think im destined to be an eccentric teacher - i get the car image in rel to Bach Fg - it works for me! I think possibly the most insane thing  a teacher ever did to me was make me play the whole of the Chopin Scherzo no 1 without pedal (on a poor quality piano) - when my hands where less able to cope with stretches, an actually pressing down on my wrists as i played and he was strong (a pretty muscular 23 year old) - i think i got the point in retrospect but it seemed crazy at the time.

[lostinidlewonder]

Well this wasnt to teach me anything, but one of my teachrs hung garlic around a piano because they thought it was posessed. spooky.

[davefriends04]

@m1469 Fox:
I'm not sure I got that right. I'm sorry if I gotya completely wrong, I'm not English, but did you say your piano teacher drove your friends away from you to get to know music better??? *confused*

[m1469]

@m1469 Fox:
I'm not sure I got that right. I'm sorry if I gotya completely wrong, I'm not English, but did you say your piano teacher drove your friends away from you to get to know music better??? *confused*

Well, yes.  At least this is how I explain it to myself.  He once told me early on in our time together that if I gave it (the piano) everything, it would give everything back to me, and I whole heartedly believed him.  I think he wanted me to focus on my practicing, not socializing.  He wanted me to turn to the instrument and music, not my friends. 

So, often he would drive a wedge, as I explained before, between my friends and me.  So yes, I turned to the piano and to music alright.  It is survival for me. 

Here is an example :  I became friendly with somebody that my teacher was/is friends with, but who is my age.  It was very sudden that this fellow and I became friends, and we met up each day for 3 days in a row.  He was very kind to me, very fun to be with... then on that third day, as he and I talked together, here comes my teacher.  My teacher dominated the situation, had our mutual friend follow him away, and that was it.  This fellow was never the same with me again.  He was suddenly a different person and that pretty much put the friendly and genuine part of our friendship to rest. 

I think people still need people friends 


m1469 Fox

[steinwayguy]

First off, it's spelled "eccentric"

Secondly, there are too many to list, but here is one of my favorites:

During a Scriabin sonata, right before one of the climaxes, he starts breathing deeply and groaning (yes) in "delight". He starts clapping with me and stomping his feet, and then, come the climax, he yells "orgasm!!!"

[puma]

   I love eccentric teachers!  They always have some cool practice technique to show you, or some way of thinking musically that you may not have thought of before.  I've really had only one "eccentric" teacher, and he really wasn't eccentric - he just liked to focus on the history and emotion behind a piece, which is what I like to focus on as well.  Sometimes he would act out things for me, or get me to think in a certain way, feel a certain mood ... good laughs and good times.  I might try that later this week with this older woman (80, actually) who wants to learn the piano.  She seems engaged with life and wants to practice a lot.  It's just that I usually don't get the chance to try out my more advanced concepts for my students because the majority of them are kids, not adults.  But I won't press my luck TOO far...I'll just have to see what the chemistry works out to be.

[davefriends04]

Oh, man ... yeah it's good if a teacher knows how to make you get to know the music better, but what m1469y Fox's teacher did is just crazy and goes too far! im surprised no one else here is shocked about that

[m1469]

I am sure that there are a lot worse things that go on for many students around the world.  I am guessing that my teacher himself had very extreme experiences as a student of his teachers.

(My teacher was also capable of deep compassion and the most tender regards.  He was also capable of great humor.)

[lagin]

Yes, spelling was my mistake.  What's ORGASM suppost to mean?

[whynot]

Good topic.  I'm not going anywhere near the orgasm question.   

I would be shocked by m1469's experience, except I know that people in authority sometimes do terrible things.  Still, yes, it is actually shocking.  What does "give everything to the piano" mean?  Turn to the piano instead of to other human beings?  He wanted you to tell your problems to it, have lunch with it?  It's ridiculous.  Either he himself has such poor relationships that he thinks people don't need them (relationships), or he had other reasons for isolating you-- hmm.  I'm so upset reading about it, because from your posts you are clearly a deep thinker and geniune lover of music, and any teacher should be thrilled with that.         

SteinwayGuy, I think I know your teacher!  I've had similar experiences with someone.  He also danced with me once-- not a come-on, it really was a demo of the music.  Helpful, too.     

[thierry13]

Yes, spelling was my mistake. What's ORGASM suppost to mean?

Well... there was a section that isn't intense too play, that slowly build up to a more intense section, and when that part come, well he yelled orgasm  lol

[lagin]

Gee thanks thierry13!  I meant what is the definition of the word, or is this something that I don't want to know.  If it is then don't tell me!!   My mind is corrupted enough from the short time I did spent in public school.

[pizno]

Sounds like the teacher above has his ego a bit too involved in the process.  I'd go for the orgasm guy.  (Sexual climax, a commonly used metaphor for musical climax).

My teacher massages my shoulders while I'm playing to get me to loosen up.  And he talks a lot about touching the keys as if they are a lover.  Hmmmmm. 

[m1469]

whynot wrote:

What does "give everything to the piano" mean?  Turn to the piano instead of to other human beings?  He wanted you to tell your problems to it, have lunch with it?

Well, yes.  Literally, I think.  Yes, it  became my most trusted friend (in a way it always has been).  Is this not how it is supposed to be?  I feel a little shy now... 

I'm so upset reading about it, because from your posts you are clearly a deep thinker and geniune lover of music, and any teacher should be thrilled with that.

Thank you so much 



m1469

[ahmedito]

My chamber music teacher (she is quite well known today, but I wont say names on the internet). Is absolutely crazy, and she is a genius... and she has quite a reputation of being a pervert.

No matter WHAT you play, its all about sex. Arensky trio, Beethoven trio, Martinu quartet, anything. Its all sex. Orgasms, virgins, harassment. Those classes get so hot sometimes, because she just has some really perverted thoughts, especially with the late romantics (though she tends to find Mozart quite perverted as well).

[BoliverAllmon]

My chamber music teacher (she is quite well known today, but I wont say names on the internet). Is absolutely crazy, and she is a genius... and she has quite a reputation of being a pervert.

No matter WHAT you play, its all about sex. Arensky trio, Beethoven trio, Martinu quartet, anything. Its all sex. Orgasms, virgins, harassment. Those classes get so hot sometimes, because she just has some really perverted thoughts, especially with the late romantics (though she tends to find Mozart quite perverted as well).

that is messed up man.

my current teacher is just a dip. her interpretations are boring and I despise going to class.

boliver

[whynot]

m1469, I didn't mean to make you feel shy!  Whatever relationship you have with your music is surely right for you, and special, and you inspire other people in this way.  I just get het up by a teacher trying to dictate what that relationship should be.

All the naughty talk reminds me of a voice teacher I know (female).  I was there to play for the singer, a rather naive and sweet college girl.  She was singing a romantic (but not sexy) aria, and the teacher kept urging her, "Make love to him, make love to him!"  The singer blushed till she was purple while the teacher got more and more passionate, and finally the young girl burst out, "But I've never even kissed a boy!"  Yeah, that sex-based coaching isn't always the most helpful, and I think some teachers are trying to vent their urges through their students. 

Those of us who teach, I wonder what our students would say about us on this thread...       

[m1469]

m1469, I didn't mean to make you feel shy!  Whatever relationship you have with your music is surely right for you, and special, and you inspire other people in this way.  I just get het up by a teacher trying to dictate what that relationship should be.  

Okay.  I actually really appreciate your comments.  They make me think about what I feel is right and wrong for a teacher to do.  It almost seems like there are no boundaries sometimes... is this the way it must be?  I really don't know.  Anyway, thanks.  I feel like I hijacked this thread a little, but there was so much other talk going on, I don't think this topic hurt too much.

m1469

[whynot]

m1469, since this thread is kind of about you now-- and why shouldn't it be??? (hehe) yes, there are boundaries between teacher and student.  When you think about your own students, the respect you have for who they are as people, their overall human potential as far as you can see it, and how much thought you put into those very things before you try to teach them anything at all... you would NOT talk about them to their friends.   You would not tell them to drop those friends because the piano should be their only friend if they're really serious about music.  I promise, this is not a criticism of your own relationship with your instrument, because people respect what you choose for yourself.  But you would not choose those things for your students. 

Where is the boundary?  I think it's the line at which the relationship stops being healthy for the student.  When students are made to feel uncomfortable by the conversation (unless it's regarding a failure to practice, then they get to feel uncomfortable).  When students start to talk about themselves and go too far, and no one steps in to put them at ease.  Touching their hand without permission, especially if they're shy.  Reaching in front of them to demonstrate without excusing oneself/apologizing.  Whatever!  The teacher bears the responsibility for this, not the student.  If the student is very assertive or the same age as the teacher, it helps the balance, but the burden is still on the teacher to behave respectfully and make the student comfortable enough to be free to concentrate on the work.  We should act as teacher and, if they wish, respectful friend, and that is IT.  No screaming, no guilt (except about not practicing, as mentioned), no imposing of ideals-- sharing of them, yes; manipulating life events to enforce them, uh, not so much.         

Just to throw a glance at where this thread started out, might your screaming teacher be the same one as the guy announcing his orgasms to another poster? 

[m1469]

Just to throw a glance at where this thread started out, might your screaming teacher be the same one as the guy announcing his orgasms to another poster?

Heh... no no.  Though I certainly wouldn't put it past the screaming man.

Thank you very much whynot.  Actually, I started a thread a long time ago that was related to this.  A friend of mine even posted in during that time to try to get me to understand some of the things you are talking to me about.  I was not receptive then.  But, you make sense to me and I very much appreciate your perspective.  Thanks 

m1469