Can you tell us more about yourself Bernhard?

[Bob]

True, there are teachers out there with similar ideas and knowledge, but I think you've chewed the information up a little more and "lived with it" a little more than many professors I've seen. 

I would like to models some of the things I do in teaching and learning after you Bernhard. 

I'm curious about your background though...

What level of students are you teaching?  More beginner-intermediate?  Any full-on college level students?

What is your educational background in music?  I'm thinking more on the official formal side here, although I don't dismiss stuyding things yourself.  Do you have a music degree?  Education, performance?, etc.   Doctorate?   

... this is not excluding other things you've done.  I'm thinking of areas of study or projects that would influence your music side.  (cough Philosophy! cough)

I'm intrigued...

[bernhard]

I would like to models some of the things I do in teaching and learning after you Bernhard.

I welcome you to do it, and I will do my best to help you (if I can).

I'm curious about your background though...

Curiosity killed the cat…

What level of students are you teaching?  More beginner-intermediate?  Any full-on college level students?

I have taught all levels, except performers (that is professional pianists), which I do not teach – I do not have the necessary experience. At the moment most of my students are in two groups: beginners (mostly children on the 5 – 9 age group) and early advanced (around grade 6- 8 and mostly teenagers/adults). I am a private teacher without any links with any educational institution (in terms of my business).

What is your educational background in music?  I'm thinking more on the official formal side here, although I don't dismiss stuyding things yourself.  Do you have a music degree?  Education, performance?, etc.   Doctorate?   

It does not really matter. Ideas should be able to stand by themselves, whatever their origin. 

... this is not excluding other things you've done.  I'm thinking of areas of study or projects that would influence your music side.  (cough Philosophy! cough)

Ultimately my personal history is of no interest, and I have no importance whatsoever. It is far more fun to concentrate on the ideas. When a finger points to the moon, it is not good to develop a fascination with the finger.

I'm intrigued...

Good!

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[Bob]

Well what path did you take to learn all this?  How did Bernhard become Bernhard?

I know you're going to say, "a lifetime of study," but can you be more specific?  How long did you study piano and what level did you get to?  What would you attribute your knowledge to -- a single book, or many, like "I got a solid base for counterpoint from this book...." 

How would you describe yourself as a pianist?  I think tradiationally most are more performance, but there are some that compose or do mostly accompanying. 

How did you plan things out to get this knowledge and wisedom?

If you weren't going to music school, how did you go about learning music while doing other things, like working?  Where did you get the time to do serious study of all the many topics in music?

What's a typical day like for you?

[tds]

i am only a newcomer here, but have read some of bernhard's contributions and felt very fascinated with what he had written.

When a finger points to the moon, it is not good to develop a fascination with the finger.

this is prolly the finest sentence i have yet read this month. cheers! tds

[bernhard]

Well what path did you take to learn all this?  How did Bernhard become Bernhard?

The path of a lifetime of study.

I know you're going to say, "a lifetime of study," but can you be more specific?

Darn! Am I that predictable?

I had parents, I had teachers, I had friends I tried to emulate, I read books, I went to schools and universities, I watched TV, videos and DVDs, I listened to CDs, I surfed the net, I travelled widely, I made a point of always applying knowledge to practical situations (if something stupid works, it is not stupid), I observed, I listened, I tried it out. I taught (nothing teaches you more than teaching). The usual stuff.

How long did you study piano and what level did you get to?

I started at six. Therefore I was doomed to not amount to too much (I missed the 2 – 4 year old window ). But the first 15 years were mostly wasted doing useless stuff that got me nowhere fast. So I guess I am a false starter, then a late starter.

  What would you attribute your knowledge to -- a single book, or many, like "I got a solid base for counterpoint from this book...." 

The single most important source and contribution to my knowledge is…Pianoforum!

There is no single source. The whole universe.

How would you describe yourself as a pianist?

Exceedingly handsome. Dashing. Irresistible.  (hey, you asked my opinion, right?)

Actually I would not describe myself as a pianist, but as a piano teacher.

  I think traditionally most are more performance, but there are some that compose or do mostly accompanying.

I don’t perform (except informally for friends and family, and I don’t really perform, I play for them).

I feel no urge to compose. 

I do accompany occasionally my recorder students in music festivals and exams.

How did you plan things out to get this knowledge and wisedom?

I didn’t. I just paid attention and tried to learn from my mistakes (you can conclude that I have made them in greater number than most ).

If you weren't going to music school, how did you go about learning music while doing other things, like working?  Where did you get the time to do serious study of all the many topics in music?

Working?  :oI have tried all my life not to work (and have succeed admirably). I have never held a job in my whole life (except for a brief period). I just organised my life so that people would pay me to pursue my interests.

Here is a story about time, you might have heard.

A physics professor arrived at his lesson one day carrying a large cylindrical glass bowl and three cloth bags. This immediately arouse the curiosity of the students.

The professor then announced to the class:

“Today we will be examining space and time.”

He put the cylindrical bowl on his desk, and proceeded to fill it with large rocks from one of the cloth bags. When it was filled to the brim, he turned to the class and asked:

“Is the bowl totally full?”

The class agreed that the bowl had been filled to the brim.

The professor then reached for the second cloth back and emptied its contents on the rock-full bowl. It was gravel, which slipped through the spaces in between the rocks and filled it all.

“Is the bowl full now?” He again enquired from the class. Most agreed it was, although a few were not so sure anymore, after all there was still a cloth bag the professor had not used. And right they were, for the professor reached for the third cloth bag, which was full of sand and emptied into the bowl. And again, the dry sand easily slipped in between the rocks and gravel to fill every available space.

“What about now?”

This time – and considering that there were no more bags left, the whole class unanimously agreed the bowl must be full.

The professor then, reached for his briefcase and produced six bottles of beer, which (to some of the students horror) he proceeded to empty on the glass bowl. And of course the beer easily accommodated itself in the spaces amongst the rocks, the gravel, and the sand.

The professor then turned to the class and concluded:

“As you can see, no matter how full your life might be, there is always space for some beer.”

“Ah! Yes, one more thing. Our time in this life is limited, as is the space in this bowl. So make sure you put the rocks first.”

I have four big rocks in my life, and music is one of them.

What's a typical day like for you?

A typical day? That was a long, long time ago.

Finally consider this thought:

By taking piano lessons for the first time we are registering within ourselves a desire to make progress. We must always take responsibility for that progress, for that which we seek lies not in the music school. Nor can it be found in Vienna or Julliard. Your teachers do not own it, nor can they give it to you. You cannot buy it or take it from someone else. What we are searching for when we sit at the piano in the heat of the summer or the frost of the winter is within us all the time. What is missing for most is the ability to appreciate it.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[fred smalls]

Wow, Bernhard, you are definately the most elegant of the members of the piano forum 
I need to ask you for advice more often. 

[lostinidlewonder]

You asking personal stuff about him and he obviously doesn't want to disclose anything. All of what he says is generalisations so it is obvious he doesnt want you to know anything specific about him. But does that change anything? Read the content of what one says, dont give a *** where it comes from. If what is said is good and helpful  then good, if they learn that on the side of the road or from a legendary school, it doesnt matter. Perhaps if you asked him in a private message and didn't make it public he might reveal stuff to you.

[ted]

I do not think Bernhard's background and qualifications are of the least importance. Everything he says is common sense. The main difference between him and us is that he seems capable of taking great pains and spending a lot of time restating this common sense, sometimes for the fifth time, without showing the slightest irritation, in order to help people get more out of playing the piano. It is the patience and unselfishness which is remarkable and which deserves our thanks.

At my age I've probably worked out most of it myself, and that which I can no longer fix I live with. My teachers taught me no technique at all - absolutely none. As role models of creative musicianship I couldn't have wished for better, but access to a Bernhard when I was younger would have made me a much better pianist physically, of that I have no doubt.   

[chopinisque]

Perhaps revelation will spoil the Bernhard mystique?  I have always prefer some mysterious and eccentric teacher/mentor figure than an exposed one.  One with style is even better.

[kilini]

Yep. It's better to think of Bernhard as this mysterious, eccentric, piano-playing & teaching Don Juan than the mundane, middle-aged guy he probably is. DON'T RUIN YOUR IMAGE. 

[torchygirl]

Hey, perhaps we have seen Bernhard more deeply for not having seen him.

Nameste,
Karen

I'm going to go off now and ponder my one hand clapping.
Ouch!  Don't look too deeply into that position!  (I'm just very amusing to myself today...don't mind me.)

[asyncopated]

I do not think Bernhard's background and qualifications are of the least importance.

I agree completely, it's his ideas that matter.  As he says, a stupid idea isn't stupid if it works.

Everything he says is common sense.

Unfortunately, here I disagree with Ted.  Maybe it's a matter of semantics.  What Bernhard says is simply not obvious and probably even unnatural for a beginner to try.

The way I see it, he proposes is a philosophy - way of doing things - which he thinks is best, tries to explain this philosophy in a practical way, and backs it up carefully with experience.

To give you an example, Hanon advocated raising your fingers high and playing every note clearly.  This approach to technique is based on the philosophy that one must gain finger independence which would be ideal for piano playing.  I suppose one can make parallels with playing bells.  If one person were to control but one bell, and play it with the right tone and consistency when s/he is suppose to for a piece, the piece would sound spectacular and that would be the optimal way of playing.  For many decades (perhaps longer) this was thought to be the best possible way of playing.  And one can see the logic in it.

As a beginner, one tends to (as a tested to by history) gravitate towards this technique.  It is the more common sense technique.

The problem with this is that it does not take into account the physiology of the human form.  It is simply impossible to make fingers completely independent.  And perhaps once can say completely unnecessary.

One of the many, very important lessons I've learnt from my teacher, here (perhaps directly from Bernhard) and from reading other sources is that one should aim to play with their whole body.  It's not necessary to use the weakest muscle group i.e. your fingers when you can use your whole arm  to play a notes.  Perhaps I'm mistaken but Bernhard advocates starting with the larger movements and muscle groups,  and adjusting in order - trunk, back, shoulder, arm, forearm and finally fingers.  This is taken form the idea that one does not need and should not to play only with the fingers which are the weakest of all the muscle groups mentioned, and more importantly, the accuracy and clarity that should be acquired for the sound is much more easily attained if one concentrates on dealing with the broader outline first, and concentrating on the details last.

To me the second way of doing things is not at all obvious.
 

The main difference between him and us is that he seems capable of taking great pains and spending a lot of time restating this common sense, sometimes for the fifth time, without showing the slightest irritation, in order to help people get more out of playing the piano. It is the patience and unselfishness which is remarkable and which deserves our thanks.

Yes, thanks for saying everything 5 times, especially the important things. It is simply necessary.   One other unintuitive thing the does say is work only on small sections.  For example a couple of bars. 

Before this I tend to play the piece true many times.  This is simple because I want to know where the piece goes.

The first time he says it,
I ignore it and play the whole piece over and over again. 

The second time he says it,
I guess I get the idea but don't have the discipline to do it.  So I start from a couple of bars before where the problem is and play to the end of the piece

The third time he says it,
I really gets to me now. I start at the correct spot.  I try by best and force myself to stop but find that I cannot because I'm caught up in the music, I play to the end of the section.

The forth time he says it --
Now, I really figure that this is the best way to do things and over by one bar

The fifth time he says it,
I finally get it right I over run by one note, but I think that this is a good thing.

I do listen (or at least try to) but all five times are necessary.

al.

P.S. I can attest to the claim that it was a physics professor that did the experiement on space and time -- its the beer that gave it away.

[asyncopated]

hmmm...

[lostinidlewonder]

The first time he says it,
I ignore it and play the whole piece over and over again. 

The second time he says it,
I guess I get the idea but don't have the discipline to do it.  So I start from a couple of bars before where the problem is and play to the end of the piece

The third time he says it,
I really gets to me now. I start at the correct spot.  I try by best and force myself to stop but find that I cannot because I'm caught up in the music, I play to the end of the section.

The forth time he says it --
Now, I really figure that this is the best way to do things and over by one bar

The fifth time he says it,
I finally get it right I over run by one note, but I think that this is a good thing.

I do listen (or at least try to) but all five times are necessary.

If you are told the first time something you should remember it and test it straight away to see if its worthwhile or crap. Listening to something said to you over and over again makes me think of Bart touching the electrified muffin.... Bzzzz OWWW.... Bzzz lol. Where the electric muffin might be passage in your music which you keep playing incorrect and your teacher keeps saying careful, watch out, here it comes again, arrg. Drives me insane if i have to repeat something over and over and over and over and over.... lol

[asyncopated]

If you are told the first time something you should remember it and test it straight away to see if its worthwhile or crap. Listening to something said to you over and over again makes me think of Bart touching the electrified muffin.... Bzzzz OWWW.... Bzzz lol. Where the electric muffin might be passage in your music which you keep playing incorrect and your teacher keeps saying careful, watch out, here it comes again, arrg. Drives me insane if i have to repeat something over and over and over and over and over.... lol

Hi,

Haha... I like the bart analogy!  In general I agree with you. 

But I do think there is value in stating something more than once, if each time you say it, you have something slightly different to add.  My piano teacher told me, ‘don’t play the repeat unless you have something new to add’

To make a comparison to a sonata :- For a good sonata, you will probably play the exposition 2 times and the same theme at least once more in the recapitulation.  Particular passages, or patterns you will also probably repeat more than once, in different keys or modes, or in circles of fifths.  There is no harm in saying things more than once, so long as you don't repeat yourself EXACTLY.  For example, if you are playing a sonata with 3 voices, you might choose to bring two of the different voices in the exposition, when repeated once, and choose to use the third but also highlight the melody in all voices for the recapitulation.

The other reason why I think careful repetition can be good is because humans are surprisingly illogical and non-linear beings.   A lot of the time, the best (most logical way) of presenting something is not the best way in terms of pedagogy.  If you've tried reading an advance maths or physics textbook, or a book that teaches magic, you will know what I mean.  I think Fink and Whiteside compares marginally.  They do present things in a lucid and clear way, but to learn from books like that from scratch is a very difficult task -- not unless you are already armed with a certain level of experience and know what they are on about.

I find that when learning something difficult, one of the best ways to go about it is to do it in layers, like with an onion.  Just do a broad out line first, and add on slowly layer by layer.  Hence the necessity of repetition, by adding on one more detail each time you do it.

As you've pointed out, dumb repetition is never good!

al.

[xvimbi]

Unfortunately, here I disagree with Ted.  Maybe it's a matter of semantics.  What Bernhard says is simply not obvious and probably even unnatural for a beginner to try.

The way I see it, he proposes is a philosophy - way of doing things - which he thinks is best, tries to explain this philosophy in a practical way, and backs it up carefully with experience.

To give you an example, Hanon advocated raising your fingers high and playing every note clearly.  This approach to technique is based on the philosophy that one must gain finger independence which would be ideal for piano playing.  I suppose one can make parallels with playing bells.  If one person were to control but one bell, and play it with the right tone and consistency when s/he is suppose to for a piece, the piece would sound spectacular and that would be the optimal way of playing.  For many decades (perhaps longer) this was thought to be the best possible way of playing.  And one can see the logic in it.

As a beginner, one tends to (as a tested to by history) gravitate towards this technique.  It is the more common sense technique.

The problem with this is that it does not take into account the physiology of the human form.  It is simply impossible to make fingers completely independent.  And perhaps once can say completely unnecessary.

One of the many, very important lessons I've learnt from my teacher, here (perhaps directly from Bernhard) and from reading other sources is that one should aim to play with their whole body.  It's not necessary to use the weakest muscle group i.e. your fingers when you can use your whole arm  to play a notes.  Perhaps I'm mistaken but Bernhard advocates starting with the larger movements and muscle groups,  and adjusting in order - trunk, back, shoulder, arm, forearm and finally fingers.  This is taken form the idea that one does not need and should not to play only with the fingers which are the weakest of all the muscle groups mentioned, and more importantly, the accuracy and clarity that should be acquired for the sound is much more easily attained if one concentrates on dealing with the broader outline first, and concentrating on the details last.

To me the second way of doing things is not at all obvious.

Common sense might not be obvious to a beginner, but it should be to a teacher (beginners don't qualify as "common" in this case). Furthermore, being obvious is not required for qualifying as common sense. Common sense is often not obvious. It usually goes along with a "Duh!" It's only afterwards, when one begins to understand why something works, that one realize that it's based on "common sense". In other words, one should never do what's obvious. One should do what common sense would suggest. Those are two different things. Of course, with increasing knowledge, common sense may change, so one should always be careful, open-minded and investigative.

[asyncopated]

Common sense is often not obvious. It usually goes along with a "Duh!" It's only afterwards, when one begins to understand why something works, that one realize that it's based on "common sense".

Hi xvimbi,

Is that the common definition of "common sense"?    The "Duh!" bit certainly helps identify characteristics of what is "common sense".

In other words, one should never do what's obvious. One should do what common sense would suggest. Those are two different things. Of course, with increasing knowledge, common sense may change, so one should always be careful, open-minded and investigative.

Yes, largely I agree with you.  Although, I would say one should only do what's obvious when it's the correct thing to do.   

The other thing is that I'm not an omniscient being.  I wish I were.  I don't have the experience of 30 years of performing with the piano, although I wish i did.  So, apart from getting a teacher, I do experiment with playing styles and technique at the piano.  I also read quite a bit -- this forum for example.  I do think a teacher is essential, but for personal development as a pianist so is experimenting (as you've pointed out).  Every pianist plays slightly differently and produces a different sound.  A technique that works very well for one person might not work so well for another.  The question is that without hind sight how does one know, in a common sense fashion, what the correct thing is to do.  I know when something is downright wrong.  I.e. hand hurting - BAD! Don't do that!

But of all the possible ways to play a passage, which is the common sense best approach (for me)?  Why don't I have that much common sense and how do I get some?

al.

   

[m1469]

Finally consider this thought:

By taking piano lessons for the first time we are registering within ourselves a desire to make progress. We must always take responsibility for that progress, for that which we seek lies not in the music school. Nor can it be found in Vienna or Julliard. Your teachers do not own it, nor can they give it to you. You cannot buy it or take it from someone else. What we are searching for when we sit at the piano in the heat of the summer or the frost of the winter is within us all the time. What is missing for most is the ability to appreciate it.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

I really appreciate these words and the thoughts behind them.  I would like to pass them along to some of my students, he he (psst... *whispering*...  already have... wink, wink.. )  Is that okay with you ?  Does the name "Bernhard" satisfy you as getting the credit ?

Thanks,

m1469

[dk]

I can only second the generally stated opinion... among many people that only read this forum (by now), I'm one of them. *this* time I've had to register and express my big thanks to Bernhard for all explanations, especially the long list of links with practice tips and techniques. It's my current firefox home page and I'm on my way with reading trough all them (Actually I wanted to go to bed almost three hours ago but the forum kept me awake..)

Good night from Switzerland!

i am only a newcomer here, but have read some of bernhard's contributions and felt very fascinated with what he had written.

this is prolly the finest sentence i have yet read this month. cheers! tds

PS: agree on the sentence.. it's typical for idealistic and eccentric guys like you to make only diffuse statements about oneselves. I'm always look up to those guys 

[bernhard]

I really appreciate these words and the thoughts behind them.  I would like to pass them along to some of my students, he he (psst... *whispering*...  already have... wink, wink.. )  Is that okay with you ?  Does the name "Bernhard" satisfy you as getting the credit ?

Thanks,

m1469

Er.. these days, I doubt if I should be given any credit . Any time I think I am being original I find out someone else has already done the deed. I am sure this quote has already been uttered by someone else. So feel free.

There is a scene in the movie "Il postino" (which concerns the meeting and developing friendship of a local mailman with the famous Chilean poet Pablo Neruda at a time when he was a political exile in Italy), where the mail man in order to woo a local girl gives her some of Neruda's poems as his own. The mother of the girl finds out about the poems (this is Italy in 1930/40) and goes to complain to Neruda that he is a bad influence on the mailman: he now writes obscene poetry to her daughter, and throws the poem in Neruda's lap. Neruda reads the poem and when he realises it is his poem, he angrily calls the mailman to task: "You plagiarised my poem". The answer of the mailman is of course priceless:

"Poems do not belong to those who write them. Poems belong to those who need them!"

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[tds]

I do listen (or at least try to) but all five times are necessary.

i don't mind when people repeats something five or more times. however, i personally find it hard to repeat myself for the second times. i'd rather be somewhere else or sleeping ( the latter is more preferrable), than having to repeat myself more than two times.

as for teaching, i try to be more tolerent with my students, specially with the very young ones. otherwise, this tolerence stays with me only for so long and students of mine know this well. they get their butts back to work and do what i tell them, before i have to show where the door is. best, tds

[asyncopated]

as for teaching, i try to be more tolerent with my students, specially with the very young ones. otherwise, this tolerence stays with me only for so long and students of mine know this well. they get their butts back to work and do what i tell them, before i have to show where the door is.

You are a harsh teacher! But I'm sure you're a very good teacher as well.

al.

[kilini]

Sigh. I wish Bernhard were my teacher. 

[abell88]

Anybody know where Bernhard is? Is it common for him to be away for a week?

[00range]

Anybody know where Bernhard is? Is it common for him to be away for a week?

Someone send out a search team! 

Hopefully he's taking a well deserved vacation in the Bahamas.

[tds]

You are a harsh teacher! But I'm sure you're a very good teacher as well.

al.

those who know me will be able to testify that i am not a harsh teacher. i empathize so much with those who try hard to be better. i do all i can to help these people (still, if possible, unwilling to repeat exact same things more than twice--word rephrasing technique, and other approaches get me to where i want without *ehem*.. repeating). yes, my time gets incredibly too precious for the unreceptive kind. i have been teaching since i was 14 and pretty much know a student's work ethic, general intelligence required for piano, attitude after few lessons. best, tds

[sleepingcats]

Perhaps Bernhard can hold a 1 or 2 week long piano camp for those of of here who could use it. We could meet at his home for all the classes/practicing/meal/fun, or if space is limited, rent out a music dept. of a university. Wouldn't that be fun?

He could fly to the U.S. to hold the piano camp as well. What do you say, Bernard? With all your fans, you'd have to rent a huge hall and hundreds of pianos!

[ShiroKuro]

Bernhard, if you come back and check this thread, could you indulge one more question:

Do you have many/any adult students who started as adults? (especially 30 or older, I started when I was 30, so there's my bias)

[bernhard]

Bernhard, if you come back and check this thread, could you indulge one more question:

Do you have many/any adult students who started as adults? (especially 30 or older, I started when I was 30, so there's my bias)

Yes, my students are split in three age-groups of more or less the same size (numbers):

1.   Adults -  above 40 (my oldest is 65). Most started from scratch. A few had lessons when they were children but forgot everything. A few played another instruments but never the piano.

2.   Teenagers – 12 – 17 year olds. This is the most varied group. Some started from scratch, others came to me having already done their grade 7 – 8 exams.

3.   Children: 4 – 7 year olds – they all started from scratch.

Personally I find teaching adults the most rewarding simply on account of motivation: an adult knows what s/he wants and has the personal resources to go after it. It is really easy teaching adults. Children are the most difficult - and the ones requiring the most work/preparation. An adult has a clear taste and direction in musical studies, a child has none, so that responsibility (and it is a huge responsibility) falls to the teacher.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[ShiroKuro]

Personally I find teaching adults the most rewarding simply on account of motivation: an adult knows what s/he wants and has the personal resources to go after it. It is really easy teaching adults. Children are the most difficult - and the ones requiring the most work/preparation. An adult has a clear taste and direction in musical studies, a child has none, so that responsibility (and it is a huge responsibility) falls to the teacher.

Thank you for saying that Bernhard!  On a different piano site, there was discussion about teaching adults, and some teachers were extremely negative about it, with a few people actually refsuing adult students. As someone who started piano as an adult, that made me rather sad. So it's wonderful to hear a vote of confidence for adult pianists from you!

[nicko124]

Thank you for saying that Bernhard!  On a different piano site, there was discussion about teaching adults, and some teachers were extremely negative about it, with a few people actually refsuing adult students. As someone who started piano as an adult, that made me rather sad. So it's wonderful to hear a vote of confidence for adult pianists from you!

I read in a book once (which has tips on everything) under the heading Piano it said "If you are over the age of 16 do not try and take up the piano as it is too demanding. Go for an easier instrument".

Now i know that some of you will think this is true in terms of concert pianist level but it didn't even say that. I think this advice from the book is absolutely shocking and to think that people who might read it could be demorilised.

I started playing at 11 but i know people who start very late and this advice is crap basically.

[allthumbs]

Greetings Bernhard

Your posts are as eloquent and insightful as always.

The path of a lifetime of study.


Here is a story about time, you might have heard.

A physics professor arrived at his lesson one day carrying a large cylindrical glass bowl and three cloth bags. This immediately arouse the curiosity of the students.

The professor then announced to the class:

“Today we will be examining space and time.”

He put the cylindrical bowl on his desk, and proceeded to fill it with large rocks from one of the cloth bags. When it was filled to the brim, he turned to the class and asked:

“Is the bowl totally full?”

The class agreed that the bowl had been filled to the brim.

The professor then reached for the second cloth back and emptied its contents on the rock-full bowl. It was gravel, which slipped through the spaces in between the rocks and filled it all.

“Is the bowl full now?” He again enquired from the class. Most agreed it was, although a few were not so sure anymore, after all there was still a cloth bag the professor had not used. And right they were, for the professor reached for the third cloth bag, which was full of sand and emptied into the bowl. And again, the dry sand easily slipped in between the rocks and gravel to fill every available space.

“What about now?”

This time – and considering that there were no more bags left, the whole class unanimously agreed the bowl must be full.

The professor then, reached for his briefcase and produced six bottles of beer, which (to some of the students horror) he proceeded to empty on the glass bowl. And of course the beer easily accommodated itself in the spaces amongst the rocks, the gravel, and the sand.

The professor then turned to the class and concluded:

“As you can see, no matter how full your life might be, there is always space for some beer.”

“Ah! Yes, one more thing. Our time in this life is limited, as is the space in this bowl. So make sure you put the rocks first.”

I have four big rocks in my life, and music is one of them.

I did hear the same story that you just posted but it was trying to make a point about "not sweating the small stuff".

You see in the story I heard, it was about setting priorities in your life and making sure you put them in the correct order of importance.

The rocks in the story represented family and friends; the gravel represented work and other societal responsibilities and gravel represented everything else (the small stuff).

The lesson for the students was that if you filled the jar first with sand (the small stuff), you would have no room for the other two. The same goes if you started out by filling the jar up with gravel (work), you would still have room for the sand (small stuff) but not rocks (family).

As far as the beer analogy, what can I say... it's self-explanatory!

As the popular pub song says, "In heaven there is no beer, that's why we drink it here!

Cheers
 

[m1469]

It does not really matter. Ideas should be able to stand by themselves, whatever their origin. 

Ultimately my personal history is of no interest, and I have no importance whatsoever. It is far more fun to concentrate on the ideas. When a finger points to the moon, it is not good to develop a fascination with the finger.

Partly because the finger might not actually be pointing to the moon even if/when it says it is.  I guess it depends a bit on whose finger it is and whether or not it is pointing in the right direction.

[Bob]

Right!  It could be a thumb.  Or a toe.

[m1469]

And anyway, it also depends upon the significance of the moon :-.  It might be one of those things where

somebody asks "what do time signatures really mean?" ...

other person:  "er ... uhhhh ... hey, look!  The moon!"  

[Bob]

And Mars, Venus, and Jupiter.  Don't forget those.

[m1469]

Finally consider this thought:

By taking piano lessons for the first time we are registering within ourselves a desire to make progress. We must always take responsibility for that progress, for that which we seek lies not in the music school. Nor can it be found in Vienna or Julliard. Your teachers do not own it, nor can they give it to you. You cannot buy it or take it from someone else. What we are searching for when we sit at the piano in the heat of the summer or the frost of the winter is within us all the time. What is missing for most is the ability to appreciate it.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

Except, I did find it a little bit in Vienna, actually  :-.

[goldentone]

Except, I did find it a little bit in Vienna, actually  .

 

[evitaevita]

nothing teaches you more than teaching

  +1

[Bob]

*Bob wonders if Bernhard ran out of ideas....*

[lostinidlewonder]

He's still got gold membership and last logged in Nov 2012, so at least he's not dead!

I have to admit that back in the day when it was pianoforum and the early days of pianostreet the posts where generally much more thought provoking and interesting. Now we have dry periods where not much is being discussed that is interesting or new (for me at least).

[Bob]

True.  Maybe Bernhard needed a little more m1469.

[m1469]

True.  Maybe Bernhard needed a little more m1469.

Does anybody here speak the Bobanese language of intentions?  I wouldn't mind a translation.  Thanks in advance  .

[Bob]

Some m1469 is ok, but you don't want too much.  Otherwise you'll end up lost or going in circles.

[timothy42b]

True.  Maybe Bernhard needed a little more m1469.

Nah.  I think he misses piannissimo.  (sp) 

[pts1]

m1469

I hope you have started the sensuality exercise I gave you.

This will progress you given what you have said.

[Bob]

*raises eyebrow*

[jogoeshome]

Ultimately my personal history is of no interest, and I have no importance whatsoever.

Are you an ex convict?

[keypeg]

Are you an ex convict?

In what way does personal history help us to understand anyone's ideas about music or playing?  The answer was appropriate (and given 8 years ago) 

[Bob]

To steal ideas from his life and use them in our own.  I'm guessing that's what I was going for with this thread.  Or to put things more into context.  He had daily lessons going, but that's not going to work for everyone.  Is it ideal?  Is it realistic?  ... What's the context?  How's it working in real life?   That type of thing.