ok theory experts what is THIS chord change called?

[Derek]

Hey everyone, there is a chord change that I like to employ on occasion. It has, I think, one of the "strongest" sounds I've ever discovered.  (let me qualify that by saying I am well aware it has been used before, such as in the theme of Final Fantasy)

Basically just move through three major chords, each a whole step above the previous. Used on conjunction with a lot of other cool stuff going on, this has a very strikingly bright quality.

Is there a name for it?

[pianonut]

it's called 'modified coltraine riff'  and it's used whenever a person feels happy and just wants to play easy stuff. (ie inbetween lessons, testing out your teacher's piano to see if it is in tune, and to impress people who think you know how to modulate).

[pianonut]

seriously, i don't know.  smile.  i wish i knew the site that i found only hours ago (forgot to copy it) that had a lot of stuff on modern composers techniques.  why didn't i copy it?

[lfischer]

That sounds a bit like parallel harmony. Debussy does a lot of that, just he adds 6ths and 7ths to the chords and then moves them up and down in parallel.

[desahcrup]

That sounds a bit like parallel harmony. Debussy does a lot of that, just he adds 6ths and 7ths to the chords and then moves them up and down in parallel.

I thought it was more like the RH theme in Ginastera's Danza del Gaucho Matrero where you have phrases of major chords in root position moving up/down. I don't know what it's called though. Sorry

[BoliverAllmon]

I am not sure what the specific name is. What you are really doing is prolonging the cadence. say you took C maj, D maj, and E maj. chords. C maj is tonic, D maj is V/V which would normally go to G maj, but instead you produced a secondary deceptive candence and went to E min. which would be vi in the key of G. (the key that was temporarily tonicized). Now when you got to the E instead of being minor, you made it of V/vi chord which should then lead you to a min, then d min, then c maj 6/4, G maj. 7 back to C maj root position.  Try that progression it is a real nice sound. It keep the suspense up and elongates the melodies.

boliver (have I mentioned how much I love theory?)

[bravuraoctaves]

I am not sure what the specific name is. What you are really doing is prolonging the cadence. say you took C maj, D maj, and E maj. chords. C maj is tonic, D maj is V/V which would normally go to G maj, but instead you produced a secondary deceptive candence and went to E min. which would be vi in the key of G. (the key that was temporarily tonicized). Now when you got to the E instead of being minor, you made it of V/vi chord which should then lead you to a min, then d min, then c maj 6/4, G maj. 7 back to C maj root position.  Try that progression it is a real nice sound. It keep the suspense up and elongates the melodies.

boliver (have I mentioned how much I love theory?)

What??!??!?

(did I tell you how I was rubbish at theory?)

[Brian Healey]

I think it's just some type of mode mixture. Or, actually, I would say it just comes out of the whole-tone scale. Sure, not all the tones are part of the same scale, but because the strongest movement is the root, you still get that sound. It's funny, Desahcrup mentioned Ginastera, and when I read the original post I immediately thought of "Suite de danzas Criollas," where he employs similar methods. I guess Ginastera loves that particular chord progression. Or is it simply an Argentinian thing?


Provolone,
Bri

[BoliverAllmon]

What??!??!?

(did I tell you how I was rubbish at theory?)

you did now. HEHEHEHE

[Derek]

I'm really starting to think theory really doesn't lend us with any insight other than a label for something that we react intuitively and naturally to, though admittedly with individual tendencies and tastes.

I could imagine a book being written that used that chord change as "THE" chord change, just as the V-I chord change is almost depicted as "THE" chord change in classical harmony.  Equally strong arguments could be made, I think, for its "strong" sound.

[whynot]

Yeah, a parallel-whole tone thing, I think that's the technical name-- dunno.  Yes, it's strong-- and can be disorienting, at least I've sometimes experienced it that way.  Gesualdo used it a number of times in songs when the text was about being hurt and confused/disoriented, and it sounds just like that in his context.  Like hovering in despair and not seeing the way out (or back to tonic).  He was a bad boy to go outside the scale like that.  Then again, he was a really bad boy...   

[lfischer]

I've changed my mind! It could also be, standing on its own or as a cadential phrase, a nice little cross between a phrygian cadence and a tiers de picardy. I find it works well if you add the 3rd onto the top of the first chord, and then drop by a tone for the second chord (the root of this chord), and then a diatonic 3rd to the dominant of the final chord.

[Derek]

One thing that really mystifies me about talk about theory is this idea of becoming "disoriented"   What do you mean?

[whynot]

Well, conventional part-writing-- the Palestrina-based rules etc-- has all this momentum back to the tonic all the time.  Or, you know, an awful lot of the time.  And maybe this is a different experience if it's on piano only, because you can look at that "one" chord anytime and play it.  When you sing unaccompanied and the harmonies move in that particular way, you can still figure out where the tonic is, but the usual feeling of that tonic "pulling" you back to it is GONE, because now you're surrounded by notes from keys that aren't closely related to where you were just a few chords back (like key of C, after a few of these moves someone is on a G#).  I don't know if I'm saying this very well.  I have perfect pitch, and I still felt in singing those pieces, "whoa, where did everything go?"  Like I walked around a corner and landed in a whole different neighborhood.