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revolutionary etude tempo (Read 4380 times)

Offline zalmanesd

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revolutionary etude tempo
« on: April 02, 2005, 01:16:06 AM »
What tempo does your edition give?
Today, I decided to check using the metronome to check my tempos.
Boy, did I get a surprise.
I have a Quarter Note=112 , which seems slow.  For some reasons, (probably the influence of recordings), I had been playing at around quarter=150-170.
Is it really that easy?

piano sheet music of Etude


Offline thierry13

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #1 on: April 02, 2005, 01:34:08 AM »
Mine says a 160 quarter note. It's pretty much the good tempo to play it. I'm playing it at the end of the year. If you master the piece, playing at 160 is easy yes. You can get it up to 170 but not more.



Making tests..... I just discovered I played it at around 176-184, on my digital piano wich as hard keys. Oh my god... I will really have to watch my speed  ;D I think I got up there because before I learnt it, 160 looked like much faster than what I could play it... so I got it up "to speed"... As I can see it is more than speed lol. Thanks for making this thread, now I'll probably be able to correct myself!!  ;D If you really want to be sure to master the piece, play it at 208 ( the faster my metronome can go). See if you can do it with flawless technique at this speed, and keep dynamics, musicality and all. It's ABSOLUTELY SURE it will sound REALLY BAD. But this is an exercise. After take it at 160, and it will be easy. I actually can play the whole piece without wrong notes at 208... but it's hard to keep all the dynamics and the music right  :-\ Anyway, try for yourself!


By the way, 112 is WAY too slow :o It's about the speed I take when I SLOWLY analise the piece and make sure the passages I look at are really clear. Don't ever perform this piece at this speed, It will ruin the piece and whole effect of it!

Offline steinwayguy

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #2 on: April 02, 2005, 05:26:52 AM »
76 to the half is the way to go.

Offline pseudopianist

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #3 on: April 02, 2005, 12:33:37 PM »
halft notes 76 bpm according to UrText

Seems like the perfect tempo IMO
Whisky and Messiaen

Offline thierry13

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #4 on: April 02, 2005, 06:10:16 PM »
I have the Cortot student edition... 160 quarter is 80 half.... so it's close to your 76. It looks like a good performance speed.

Offline anda

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #5 on: April 02, 2005, 09:27:42 PM »
chopin's tempo mark: AFAYC (as fast as you can)

best luck  8)

Offline BoliverAllmon

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #6 on: April 03, 2005, 10:51:52 AM »
chopin's tempo mark: AFAYC (as fast as you can)

best luck  8)

maybe for technique, but not for musicality.

Offline brewtality

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #7 on: April 03, 2005, 12:02:01 PM »
indeed, slowness equals profundity

Offline chromatickler

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #8 on: April 03, 2005, 12:28:52 PM »
I actually can play the whole piece without wrong notes at 208... but it's hard to keep all the dynamics and the music right
your SDC timing is 1'37 with perfect accuracy. please attempt to grow a brain

Offline anda

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #9 on: April 03, 2005, 06:20:02 PM »


maybe for technique, but not for musicality.

when i said AFAYC, i said it for both technique and musicality as well! (i thought that goes without saying...)

Offline thierry13

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #10 on: April 03, 2005, 07:49:33 PM »


when i said AFAYC, i said it for both technique and musicality as well! (i thought that goes without saying...)
Hahaha... listen to a Chopin etude played at 200 quarter notes... there is no music in that.


your SDC timing is 1'37 with perfect accuracy. please attempt to grow a brain

accuracy on the notes, only the notes. And played at this speed it really sounds bad, and I can't keep the dynamics at this speed. But hey... it's damn hard.

Offline Sasha42196

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #11 on: April 09, 2005, 07:13:29 AM »
At 200, even if you hit all the notes right, it's still going to be a blurr.  Somehow, some people think that the faster they play, the more effect it has on the listener.  I for once think that it is more difficult to play this, or any piece slower because the ear can catch the wrong notes in a slower tempo.  Besides, I do not think that Chopin was preoccupied with speed in this etude.

Offline BoliverAllmon

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #12 on: April 09, 2005, 01:17:37 PM »
At 200, even if you hit all the notes right, it's still going to be a blurr.  Somehow, some people think that the faster they play, the more effect it has on the listener.  I for once think that it is more difficult to play this, or any piece slower because the ear can catch the wrong notes in a slower tempo.  Besides, I do not think that Chopin was preoccupied with speed in this etude.

I personally believe the brain can only compute so many notes at a time. if you begin to play above that level (wherever that may be) you simply become noise.

Offline thierry13

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #13 on: April 09, 2005, 03:16:24 PM »
At 200, even if you hit all the notes right, it's still going to be a blurr. Somehow, some people think that the faster they play, the more effect it has on the listener. I for once think that it is more difficult to play this, or any piece slower because the ear can catch the wrong notes in a slower tempo. Besides, I do not think that Chopin was preoccupied with speed in this etude.

I don't think you understood me. NEVER would I play that fast for an audience :o. Yeah it sounds bad. But yes at 200, i can still hear any wrong notes. And I know when I do. Your brain can hear as many notes as their can be. It is a skill to develop. Try to remember when you just began piano. You now begin to hear different things, you can analise different types of chord progression etc. After listening to Horowitz's version of rach 3, whenever I hear another version, I can same hear the smallest interpretation change. If I can do so for Rach 3, you can do so for revolutionary. It is only a question of training. There are no limits to the human brain.

Offline BoliverAllmon

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #14 on: April 09, 2005, 03:22:52 PM »
I don't think you understood me. NEVER would I play that fast for an audience :o. Yeah it sounds bad. But yes at 200, i can still hear any wrong notes. And I know when I do. Your brain can hear as many notes as their can be. It is a skill to develop. Try to remember when you just began piano. You now begin to hear different things, you can analise different types of chord progression etc. After listening to Horowitz's version of rach 3, whenever I hear another version, I can same hear the smallest interpretation change. If I can do so for Rach 3, you can do so for revolutionary. It is only a question of training. There are no limits to the human brain.

you may be able to grasp thenotes, but the audience is a different thing. Remember you are playing for them.

Offline thierry13

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #15 on: April 09, 2005, 05:13:10 PM »
That's WHAT I SAID! I would NEVER play it for an audience at 208. I would take it at about 160. But it is possible to hear every note clearly same at 208.

Offline BoliverAllmon

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #16 on: April 09, 2005, 07:08:20 PM »
no duh. I was just talking about some fanatics that say that the faster the better. it wasnt directed at you particularly.

Offline pianomann1984

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #17 on: April 09, 2005, 09:01:16 PM »
Besides, I do not think that Chopin was preoccupied with speed in this etude.

What an incredibly profound thing to say.  Too bad I think it went unnoticed.  I think you hit the nail on the head though.  After all -  in practice we should be striving to meet the composers intentions - not our own egos.  What do you hope to acheive at this speed, other than blab about it on a web forum?!  It is impressive, granted, but all you do at this speed is deny yourself the oppertunity to concentrate devotedly on everything in the score, and increase the likelyhood of developing tension, as well as just plain hitting wrong notes - no good thing! (Have you considered the meaning of his phrasing in bar 76, for example?)  Here's a helpful way to practice it - finger the RH silently on the keys whilst playing the LH firmly at reasonable tempo, and reverse it when you can do that.  I can assure you this will show up any problems far quicker than playing at any tempo over that suggested by Chopin (which I believe is halfnote = 76).

Happy practicing  :)
"What would you do if you weren't afraid?"

Offline sevencircles

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #18 on: June 30, 2005, 08:55:11 PM »
This is propably the only of the popular virtuosoworks out there where you "as an amateur"  can expect to do the best interpretation ever.

I have heard lot´s of recordings of this piece but none of the famous virtuosos  have done the ultimate perfomance (Gould´s Goldberg variations quality).

The best I have heard is by Marian Pivka.

I usually don´t like any pedal at all in fast pieces but it suits this work very well. A very explosive lefthand in combination with pedal creates a thundering sound.

Lot´s of dynamics and tempochanges is usefull as well.

I would recomend that you start at 200 go down to 180 dyring the lyrical parts and up to 210 during the speedy parts later on.





Offline JPRitchie

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Re: revolutionary etude tempo
«Reply #19 on: July 02, 2005, 06:02:55 PM »
Chopin was pretty specific. The Wessel Complete Works of Chopin (dedicated to Liszt) displayed here and published ca. 1849 shows a tempo of 160 in common time. Half-way through measure 26, it's marked "stretto.".
Regards,
Jim