tremolos

[LVB op.57]

I've been working on Beethoven's Pathetique, and the only problem I'm having is with the left hand tremolos. I just can't get them fast enough. Any tips?

[thierry13]

Well, try to lower your wrist, and use a small wrist motion, but also a finger motion. And try to get a really really tiny accent at each 2 bass notes. Just to get a relaxation point there. I used to use a TOTAL wrist movement, and no relaxation, so getting the C tremolo was impossible, but when I changed note at each beat, it was okay. This is because I get relaxation when changing note. Well try to do the same as if you would change note, but keep the same. That's how it worked for me anyway.

[SDL]

Tremelos were never my thing and Ive got away with playing this piece in the past but it wasnt comfortable.  Im revisiting Liszt Legend no2 for a concert and there are 3 pages of tremelos that I have to do.  So I have decided to start again with this technique to try and crack it.  So what I am doing is playing the 2 sets of notes that form the 8ve tremelo as a straight 8tave. Bounce up and down.  I got this very comfortable because I kind of did a down fall movement on the first and 4th 8ves which means the 3rd 8ve you bounce up in the air to fall for the 4th (if that makes sence). You have to have a reference point (like a mini-beat) to keep it going as I dont think its possible in one movement.

Hope this helps.  Let me know how it goes.

[SDL]

oops I meant to say after you do the straight 8ves, try a continuous acciacatura type 8ve slowing it down from the 8ve ( Chang's infinite speed).  And work backwards (slowing down gradually).  I found the 8ve thing gives you the feel of relaxation so you know what to aim for;  you tend to naturally accent one of the notes when you do this as well - in my case the bottom.

[musik_man]

Well, try to lower your wrist, and use a small wrist motion, but also a finger motion. And try to get a really really tiny accent at each 2 bass notes. Just to get a relaxation point there. I used to use a TOTAL wrist movement, and no relaxation, so getting the C tremolo was impossible, but when I changed note at each beat, it was okay. This is because I get relaxation when changing note. Well try to do the same as if you would change note, but keep the same. That's how it worked for me anyway.

It's impossible to do tremolos with your wrist.  The wrist can only come up and down like a hinge.  What you want to do is use a slight rotation of your forearm.  Using that movement I can easily do all the tremolos (the main trouble I actually have with Pathetique is keeping the RH clean.)

[SDL]

I spent no more than 2x 20 minute sessions before I became comfortable with the tremelos without aching for a full page (obviously I have 2 more pages of continuous tremelos to go so this will be the test whether I have cracked it forever!). 

I may have just picked it up quickly but I believe that the 8ve bounce I described earlier in the thread helped to get an experience of "relaxation".  In the past I just got through a piece with major tremelo sections on adrenalin!! 

When I did the pathetique years ago I injured my LH (ganglion) because I played the technique wrong.  It stayed away from trememlos as much as I could afterwards.

[SDL]

Incidentally, Chang mentions tremelos like being trills.  Ive been praised by concert pianists as having excellent trills, and I find them extremely easy since I can go fast forever with all fingers (4/5 not so long). But I never had good tremelos (until, hopefully this week I can crack it!).  Anyone have a similar experience?