Winter Wind...

[tadhg]

Anywhere online where i may find a copy of Chopin's Winter Wind Etude? ( minus paying) Can't seem to find it. How manageable is it?

[marialice]

www.sheetmusicarchive.net

[tadhg]

thanks, found it.

Now for the help question! It's my first time trying a piece with such cromatic scales throughout so i don't really know how to go about it. Whats the best way to learn the whole right hand (which is basically a whole long scale). Repitition? Bit by bit? Sound?

[tadhg]

just did some searching and basically answered all my  questions except the most obvious one, is this piece managable as a first etude? I've never done any of his others, but i REALLY like this piece when listening to it. I realise that there is an awful lot of work required.

[globetrotter]

I used to work on it a few weeks ago. I can't say I have mastered it but at least I got the meaning of it, the logic behind the fingering. Efford and time is needed it, surely. But it's worthy it. Any help should you need, I'd be happy to help.

[Awakening]

I would avoid it as a first etude.  There's no rush--learn some easier ones first that will help you prepare for Op.25 No.11.  Op.10 No.12 (Revolutionary) is obviously very popular, and significantly shorter (6 pages instead of 10) and more manageable than the Winter Wind.  You could also go for Op.10 No.3 (Tristesse) which is beautiful and has an impressive, fast section in the middle.  You could also try Op.25 No.2 which is short, fast, and technically less demanding than most of the other etudes. 

It's up to you, but I would probably stay away from the Winter Wind until you have a little more experience with Chopin's etudes.  I'm not sure about your exact pianistic abilities, but it could just be frustrating trying to tackle this piece so early in your career, especially because you will be wanting to play it at the speed of all your favorite recordings.  It's probably my favorite etude, but I know I'm going to wait before trying to play it.

[steinwayguy]

I would avoid it as a first etude. There's no rush--learn some easier ones first that will help you prepare for Op.25 No.11. Op.10 No.12 (Revolutionary) is obviously very popular, and significantly shorter (6 pages instead of 10) and more manageable than the Winter Wind. You could also go for Op.10 No.3 (Tristesse) which is beautiful and has an impressive, fast section in the middle. You could also try Op.25 No.2 which is short, fast, and technically less demanding than most of the other etudes.

It's up to you, but I would probably stay away from the Winter Wind until you have a little more experience with Chopin's etudes. I'm not sure about your exact pianistic abilities, but it could just be frustrating trying to tackle this piece so early in your career, especially because you will be wanting to play it at the speed of all your favorite recordings. It's probably my favorite etude, but I know I'm going to wait before trying to play it.

Well uh, the revolutionary etude wouldn't exactly help you too much in playing Winter Wind, and same for 10/3.

Just learn it.

[tadhg]

hmmm. I definitely don't want to ruin it by learning badly the first time around and having to come back an relearn. I gave it a very slow start, and note wise and rythm wise it's grand, obviously the speed being the problem. I'll keep it going. If you were to recommend a more appropriate etude, what would it be? lol revolutionary might be a bit much.

[Awakening]

Well uh, the revolutionary etude wouldn't exactly help you too much in playing Winter Wind, and same for 10/3.

Just learn it.

Well, no, maybe not those etudes specifically, but I was just offering pieces that I personally would choose to learn before Winter Wind.  Not that they're in any specific way "preparation" for 25/11, though I do feel that playing any Chopin etude is going to give you experience with the repertoire and maybe indirectly prepare you for a more challenging one.  Yeah, obviously there are other etudes he could learn first that are more right-handed technical studies which would help with the techniques required in Winter Wind. 

As for a more appropriate etude--excluding revolutionary or something similar, maybe 10/3, 25/2, or 10/5 which I didn't mention before.  10/5 might be a good place to start because it's commonly considered one of the easier ones, and it could also be seen as preparation for Winter Wind because of the fast right hand passages.  Keep in mind that I have not studied any etude at length other than 10/12.  Anything I know about the etudes is from listening to several different recordings of them many times, reading through the scores, and fiddling with the occasional etude myself.  I'm quite familiar with how they appear on the page, and how they sound, but have less of a concept of some of the more technical nuances that can only be discovered through studying them. 

[C-A]

Even though I'm a newbie here, and only 15 years old, I played a lot of difficult pieces like Chopin's Etude 25/1 and Mozart's 18min-long K.570 Sonata.
I think don't make the "Winter Wind" as your 1st Chopin Etude. The right hand is hell fast and almost non-stop for 3 1/2 mins, and you need a hell lot of stamena and endurance to play it.
I have 3 suggestions as a 1st etude(The difficulty depends on the color. Red is the hardest, blue is the easiest).
1. 10/5. Most pianists I think start in this etude. Its tiring for the right hand, but can improve endurance and hand manuverability in the Black Keys. This can help a lot in playing the winter wind.
2. 25/2. Its just like the winter wind, the RH has the same speed, but less taxing and half its length.
3. 25/1. The tempo is almost the same as Winter Wind. Both hands are as fast as the Winter Wind, but less taxing, and can help a lot in endurance.
But if you want to play Winter Wind right now, start learning each 4-bar phrase slowly at 1st, seperate hands at half the speed, w/o dynamics. Play all the notes on the right hand not softly, just plain forte, or as loud as you can. Then the left hand. Then play both hands, but w/o the dynamics. If your satisfied, add the dynamics and gradually increase the tempo. If your done, continue to the next phrase and so on. Then try playing it at full speed, I swear it will take a lot of physical stamena, especially because the fingering of the RH is VERY uncomfortable!

[delpetrarca]

is it normal if i think Op 10 No.3 is a lot harder than Op10 No.2?

[Chrysalis]

no ?

[tadhg]

well, too late.Started it. It's not so bad. Once you get the general idea, it's all jus repeated ideas. Will take a while to get up to speed.Some of the thumb over parts are pretty get

Too anyone who plays it: should the left hand rythm be accented in the right hand scale passages? or should the right play each not the same. Or should the outter notes (the cromatic part) be accented?

[delpetrarca]

well, how come I do find No.3 harder than No.2 

For me, 2 is just about the weird fingering thing, so I feel as long as keeping a flexible wrist and having strong "weak fingers", it'd be fine...

But for 3, there're more voice lines, harder to sightread from the beginning. Once that is handled, I guess the only challenging area is the later part of the middle section. It also has sometihng to do with wrist, but it's also dealing with cords instead of single notes...  Me pretty bad at cords + I have small hands... so...

Am I the only one who thinks 3 is harder???

[Dazzer]

and whatever happened to blue?

[fiveangles]

I realize that my this reply is tardy but I just registered today & I figured that I'd respond to Tad's last question, as I happen to have finally broken down and decided to stop 'futzing' around with the composition and study it so I can play it the way it should be played.  This was the question pertaining to the proper accent in the right hand: w/the melody vs on the cromatic scale at the center.  Now btw, I am by no means any type of authority, professional, or what have you, but Chopin is one if a few composers who's music speaks very clearly to me.....it's just my opinion (and Itubi's as well, seeing as his opening is definately IT

To me, the key to the whole peice is the accent of the certral cromatic scale right from the onset of the right hand: Accented clearly, without slur, especially in the section(s) immediately following the third chord in the melody as well as those sections where the right hand is playing alone.  It is in these parts, if accented as such, that an incredible 'whipping' effect or turbluence is created, that might have inspired it's common name.  I've heard other artists play this more leggatto, and to me some of the effect of the peice is surpressed.  Now this is just my music sense/taste at work, and it is not derived from anything definitive; however, one might make a case that this may not be to far from the composers intentions by noting that the pedal markings are consistent with the above, promoting the same affect, but that means little to me as it just feels right...for me.

I realize that you have probably already finished the peice by now, and are playing it the way you hear it, but I love the peice and had fun writing this all the same.

5A

PS  I know this probably will not make sense to anybody, but I hope this time I learn the entire peice instead of moving on to the A flat Ballade after the first two pages!