Comments Invited on Larry Fine

[Glyptodont]

This may be very old stuff on this board, and if so, I apologize.

I have been reading Larry Fine's "The Piano Book" since I purchased our piano in 1990. 

I found the first edition of Fine's book at the library -- the one with the Baldwin evaluations, which were later removed from the book.

What is the current thought on his critiques from savvy piano owners on this board?

I am sure the book has some educative value, but some of the reviews are thin-- based on fairly few reports.  Also, if Fine omits reviews of Baldwin, Wurlitzer, and other widely owned brands in the more recent editions, how valuable is it?

I'm curious . . . . . .

[Michele Felice]

Larry Fine's book is full of good information. It teaches people who don't know anything about pianos a little about how they are built and how they work. It gives some guidelines regarding prices and how to get professional help in assessing the quality of a piano, especially a used one (where the real bargains are).

Unfortunately, your expectation that it might be a comprehensive guide to the quality of most pianos cannot be met. Pianos, as Fine says, are very individual products and, with the exception of a very few brands, vary considerably in quality of tone and touch from individual piano to individual piano of the same model. This variation is even more significant as pianos age, because maintenance, and especially environmental control, are critical to a piano's quality and longevity. A very good piano kept in a poor environment can be ruined as a musical instrument in a few years.

The piano industry has also been much in flux for many years. So many brand names have even less meaning than would be the case if pianos were as predictable in quality as are, for example, automobiles.

With pianos, there is little you can really depend upon, outside your own sense of tone quality and character of touch. Brand names are not very meaningful, because pianos of different sizes will not perform in the same way, just to mention again the problems of individuality and maintenance. This may be a hard fact for people in the U.S. to accept, who have been so well-trained by the advertising business (in which I worked for many years) to be exceedingly brand-name conscious.

The good side to this is that you can learn how to judge the qualities of pianos in a very pleasant way, by listening to them and by playing them. You just can't learn to do this only by reading a book.

I would add that no one ever learned to cook by simply reading a book, either.

[dinosaurtales]

I read his book when I started shopping for pianos, so I had an idea of what to look for besides just playing them, and also to establish a "short list" of brands to consider.  I found his book to be an excellent source of information, and combined with the pricing guide, gave me some information to use in establishing my budget and how to make offers.

He has added considerable information to individual brands and models since the initial versions.  It won't be a comprehensive guide, but it's pragmatic, and provides a common sense approach to buying a piano.  He leaves the "uncontrollable emotional attachment" to us!

When I had established a short short list of 3 brands I used his web service to get the most recent prices, and I called him on the phone to gather some additional info.  It was well worth it considering the investment I was making!  He's very informative and really nice fellow to talk to!  I recommend him highly.

[CJ Quinn]

It's definitely a great book to read.  But in recent months I began to wonder about who exactly make up the rankings.  I've had run-ins with technician/dealers whose opinions I thought could not possibly be trusted because they are so full of spin for their own brands, even though they are respected as techs.  Are technicians like that used to come up with the rankings?  OR are all the techs independent, non-sellers of pianos?

[Michele Felice]

I think the problem has to do with the notion of overall rankings, which I think is over-used. Unfortunately, people like to compare consumer products in some simple way to find "the best." With pianos, and probably many other sorts of things, this kind of thinking may not be appropriate.

It might be possible to come up with a ranking hierarchy for pianos regarding quality control and uniformity of performance among the same model of piano within a given manufacturer's line. In this kind of ranking, Yamaha might well be at the top for many models, and also Kawai, along with some of the German and other European pianos. I would include some small piano builders and rebuilders in this category, such as Charles Walter and Fandrich and Sons, whose pianos are much more difficult to find and try out than the major brands.

This quality-control ranking might be useful for shoppers who need help buying a reliable new piano in a relatively short period of time, without having to depend upon professional advice from a technician, piano teacher or other consultant. You could no doubt use Larry Fine's quality control rankings by themselves in this way.

In terms of tone and touch, the qualities of pianos are very difficult to describe. These characteristics of pianos need to be experienced and compared. They can't be ranked because the qualities involved in the rankings are matters of individual perception. Perception, in turn, depends on the musical experience of the player/listener.

For those who are starting out to buy a good piano, who don't have a well-developed taste for touch and tone, perhaps the best way to proceed is to buy a "good-enough" piano. Say a 6 foot Yamaha or Kawai, or a big upright. Many people would consider such instruments quite splendid, and for most purposes they are. They are well-built, uniform in quality, and easy to tune and work on. After a few years of playing, one's understanding of touch and tone will develop and evolve. Then it might be time to move to the "best" piano one can afford, because by that time one will know what is best for his musical purposes.

[donjuan]

Cheers Larry Fine! He saved me $2000!  His tips on how to deal with piano dealerships are very VERY helpful.  Let me just say this: if your city's Yamaha dealer has a monopoly, phone the dealer in the next city over.  You will be very surprised indeed.
donjuan

[andyaeola]

I just spent some considerable time in February and March looking at numerous uprights in and around London. 
Having bought a piano, I was given Larry Fines's book as a gift by the dealer who initially thought I'd used it to help me decide - because my amateurish handwritten spreadsheet of uprights had comments on their sound, touch etc that were very similar to the comments & ratings in the book. 

Certainly regarding the top and middle range pianos, I'd say his descriptions, advice,and ratings are excellent; I've spent the last four weeks dipping into the book. 


Great forum by the way.



Andy