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Richard Clayderman syndrom (Read 41739 times)

Offline BuyBuy

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Richard Clayderman syndrom
« on: June 12, 2003, 03:53:13 PM »
Hey guys !

What do you feel when someone hears that you play the piano and tell you : "Oh I love Richard Clayderman ! Do you play any of his songs ? Do you play Ballade for Adeline? I have his CD, I can make a copy for you..." well, that kind of stuff.

I personnally hate that, simply because I don't like what that guy plays. Easy listening music lacks... well... musicality to me, I think it's superficial. Lots of trills, sweet melodies, glamorous arpeggios... But no deeper emotions, no spiritual dimension, no structure... I don'e know how to put it. I don't like it, I guess, is the best way to say it.

I think he's trying to appeal to the crowds with a lot of showmanship and easy tunes arranged with a lot of garbage decorations, and people prefer listening to that kind of surface music than to deeper works. Of course, look and showmanship are part of any pianist career (after all, a pianist is payed to play for people), but are not supposed to cover and make lower music attractive. And sure, good composers have taken easy tunes and transform them in magnificent works, but not with a process of adding trills and arpeggios only.

Well, I guess I just can't stand the guy. Or his music. What do you guys think ?

Offline Aurelio

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #1 on: June 12, 2003, 07:36:44 PM »
I absolutely agree with you, but for very begginers (playing and LISTENING TO piano music) Clayderman scores could be a start.

But only the very very start of the very very beginners..., so they discover the real music later(Mozart, Chopin, Liszt...) ...

ooopss..., Well..., I don't believe what I have just said, Clayderman is a f*cking sh!t from any point of view!
2 + 2 = 5

Offline BuyBuy

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #2 on: June 12, 2003, 10:49:05 PM »
Vaya... ya sabía por experiencia que los españoles tienen un idioma con un montón de palabrotas. ¡ Pero ahora, te pasas de la raya hasta en inglés ! ja,ja,ja...

Vale pués, hasta la vista... Con un lenguaje más decente. Tal vez.


Offline frederic

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #3 on: June 13, 2003, 10:33:24 AM »
Right....what did you just say BuyBuy? French?
Ok... So what does Clayderman DO? Of course i know who he is but i never knew WHY he is. So whats so special about him? He's lousy at the piano, he's not cool and is still called the piano king or something. Who can't arrange stuff like fur elise or 5th symphony for piano, drum kit and guitar?

I never understood that guy...
"The concert is me" - Franz Liszt

Offline Legatello

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #4 on: June 13, 2003, 06:08:43 PM »
i've never played arranged pieces even if i have been offered a lot of that stuff. I think that, despite your skill, playing arrangement makes the composers feel really bad in their graveyards. I wouldn't like to be buried and to hear something i composed beeing arranged for the little guy next corner cos he likes the melody !hehe

even if i don't know that guy you're talking about i'm with you on this, trills and arpegios cannot make the difference !

Spanish pianoforum-commumity is growing ! :D

Offline BuyBuy

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #5 on: June 16, 2003, 05:14:45 PM »
I wouldn't reject arrangements of compositions in general. It all depends on the value of the arrangement (Liszt made so many arrangements of his own and others pieces...). So it does not necessarily bother me to play an arranged version of anything or to give it to a student (arranged for easy piano and sort of stuff) as long as it has musical value (not just a piece that you pick, taking away the hard stuff and adding trills to sound cute) and technical usefulness.

Offline dinosaurtales

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #6 on: June 21, 2003, 09:00:02 AM »
Who is Richard Clayderman?  I've never heard of him.
So much music, so little time........

Offline 88keys

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #7 on: July 09, 2003, 04:20:04 AM »
There is nothing wrong with "easy listening music", by itself.

The trouble with Clayderman is that what people call "Clayderman's songs" are usually heavily distorted version of real classical pieces.

So I second Buybuy's disgust with those statements glorifying "Clayderman's songs". There are but a few things more irritating than giving the credit to the person who butchered perfectly good works without even mentioning the poor original composer.

Offline 88keys

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #8 on: July 09, 2003, 04:23:26 AM »
By the way, I also agree with BuyBuy that re-arrangements of classical works should not be automatically rejected.

But there needs to be a good reason for doing the re-arranagement, and the transcription itself must excel in quailty.

Unfortunately, Clayderman has niether.

Offline dinosaurtales

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #9 on: July 09, 2003, 06:10:36 AM »
I don't subscribe to People magazine.  WHO is Richard Clayderman??
So much music, so little time........

Offline Johnnylightning

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #10 on: July 10, 2003, 06:15:18 AM »
HAHA, You guys are, HA, Oh my God, HAHAHA
OPEN YOUR MIND!...but not too much, your brain might fall out.

Offline BuyBuy

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #11 on: July 10, 2003, 05:33:22 PM »
Johnylighting, next time you laugh, would you mind sharing the reason for it ? Cause it's makes you sound kind of silly... Just an advice.

For the ones who haven't heard about him, Clayderman is a pianist that plays easy listening music. Tall, slim, long blond hair, you see the style. And what he plays is usually popular songs or popular arrangements of classical, jazz, anything tunes. I would say he does for piano what André Rieu does for violin...

Offline Johnnylightning

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #12 on: July 11, 2003, 02:57:23 AM »
BuyBuy, the next time you spell my name, would you mind spelling it correctly,it makes you look kinda' silly.
OPEN YOUR MIND!...but not too much, your brain might fall out.

Offline dinosaurtales

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #13 on: July 11, 2003, 03:57:27 AM »
Now BOYZ!  I suspect Johnnylightning tends to laugh because I ask silly questions.  As an adult, I am not always (actually rarely) familar with modern pop artists, like this RC guy.  I take it the *syndrome* applies to pianists who like to embellish the music with flowery stuff?  Or is it something else?  In MY day, we had Lawrence Welk, with Bob (Ralston) and the boys.  He was the flowery one then that we all made fun of.
 Great pianist, by the way.  Just a weird style/
So much music, so little time........

Offline 88keys

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #14 on: July 11, 2003, 03:57:50 AM »
[sarcasm]
Ooooooooh.... You really won BuyBuy in a battle of wits. Where do you come up with those incredible ingenious answers?
[/sarcasm]

Now, JohnLight-N-ing, how about telling us what is it that you find so funny?

Don't tell me that you are a *gasp* Calyderman fan?

Offline 88keys

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #15 on: July 11, 2003, 04:03:29 AM »
Dinosaur Tales, I think what "BuyBuy" call "The Syndrome" has to do with music fans, not pianists.

You know, those who think "Fur Elise" is Calyderman rather than Beethoven, and that the 2nd movement of the "Pathetique Sonata" really does end in B major (Listen to Clayderman play it, and you'll understand what I'm talking about).




Offline Johnnylightning

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #16 on: July 11, 2003, 05:23:43 AM »
Yes DinosaurTales, I did actually laugh, but not because your reply was silly, but because it was funny, witty and I can fully relate to it.  You see, I too have the slightest idea as to who the HELL Richard Clayderman may be. And the actual fact is that I really don't even care.  But what's amusing me, even more than what you posted, is participating in a forum, who's members argue most any subject that is posted.  Am I instigating anything yet?  I mean it seems to be the trend on this forum.  So, I find it funny and you don't.  Where's the arguement?  Some like Clayderman, some don't and others just don't care.  87keys and BestBuy, instigate this; HAHAHA, If you can't spell, simply copy/paste; too dificult?  Try this J-O-H-N-N-Y-L-I-G-H-T-N-I-N-G...Just an advice.
OPEN YOUR MIND!...but not too much, your brain might fall out.

Offline dinosaurtales

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #17 on: July 11, 2003, 07:03:46 AM »
Johnnylightfoot:  I am going to guess that you are an actual adult.  Am I right?  Don't ask how I *think* I can tell!
So much music, so little time........

Offline RiskyP

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #18 on: July 11, 2003, 07:39:19 AM »
Most of the population, especially the youth has trouble finding the meaning in "more complex" classical pieces. They are used to 3 minute, abrupt, overly repetetive and narrowly focused music. It literally takes willpower to overcome the initial difficulties of even being able to sit still for 20 minutes and listen to the same piece. It did for me.

Of course, once you are capable of doing this at will, not to mention actually finding meaning in the music, it is the most culturally rewarding experience. Suddenly your eyes and heart are open to the recreation of a time that has passed, emotions that have vanished, landscapes that have changed.

I think that it is important to advocate classical music among the youth. Therefore I will be making a website with this aim (first have to learn web programming).

You'd be surprised how many people are out there who would actually like to "get into" classical music. Even people I have met at the gym told me to give them some CDs after they heard I listen to a lot of classical.

Hopefully, at some point in the future the majority of the population will realize where music with rich content lies, and will embrace the classics once again.      

EDIT: Sorry, jumped the gun and made it sound like and advertisement!

Offline Irock1ce

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #19 on: July 23, 2003, 09:19:51 AM »
oh god i hate dick eaterman.... i had to play 3 of his fuckin pieces 3 years ago.. it was so easy and retarded.... im glad im playin beethoven and chopin now.... *hugs chopin and beethoven score*
Member of Young Musicians program at University of California, Berkeley.

Offline ml104

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #20 on: February 04, 2013, 04:51:05 PM »
Hey guys !

What do you feel when someone hears that you play the piano and tell you : "Oh I love Richard Clayderman ! Do you play any of his songs ? Do you play Ballade for Adeline? I have his CD, I can make a copy for you..." well, that kind of stuff.

I personnally hate that, simply because I don't like what that guy plays. Easy listening music lacks... well... musicality to me, I think it's superficial. Lots of trills, sweet melodies, glamorous arpeggios... But no deeper emotions, no spiritual dimension, no structure... I don'e know how to put it. I don't like it, I guess, is the best way to say it.

I think he's trying to appeal to the crowds with a lot of showmanship and easy tunes arranged with a lot of garbage decorations, and people prefer listening to that kind of surface music than to deeper works. Of course, look and showmanship are part of any pianist career (after all, a pianist is payed to play for people), but are not supposed to cover and make lower music attractive. And sure, good composers have taken easy tunes and transform them in magnificent works, but not with a process of adding trills and arpeggios only.

Well, I guess I just can't stand the guy. Or his music. What do you guys think ?

****

Its not actually about what you know how to play or how complex you play it.
When it comes down to a commercial pianist, you know, the type the gets "paid" to perform, its about what people want to hear or buy. 
Im not going to disagree with you that Clayderman plays very simple music, but he is a commercial success and record companies don't care whether he plays
simple music or "complex classical" or whatever, the guy is making the money for them.  You'll agree that this guy is making a very good living doing it too.
So next time you sit down and perform a kick ass "complex" piano piece for your family and/or friends, just remember Richard Clayderman travels the world, sits down in front of large audiences and gets paid lots of money to perform the "simple" piano melodies you abhor.
Its about what pays the bills.  And yes, even you will perform "Mary had a little lamb" with some orchestral arrangements if you were a working pianist and depended on income from your performances.  Don't say you wont because you would be a liar.
And no, I'm not a Clayderman fan.  But a real musician will play anything that is asked of him.  So next time someone asks you to play a Clayderman theme, be professional..don't snarl or complain about it, just play it...and play it right.  In the eye or ear of the person that is listening to you play, that person can care less whether you play Chopin or Coldplay.

Offline lostinidlewonder

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #21 on: February 04, 2013, 05:05:00 PM »
Richard is considered the most successful pianist of all time, in terms of his record sales he puts classical pianists and jazz pianists to shame. Tall poppy syndrome tries to pull him down but it is undeniable he created a musical niche and has dominated from there. He is a shining star, blazing in the sky brilliantly, how the lesser mortals try to fizzle it out but in such vain! He is actually a formidable pianist with great skill, but he has no need to dazzle, aspiring musicians can learn a huge amount from his example.
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Offline thalbergmad

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #22 on: February 04, 2013, 07:24:51 PM »
It never ceases to amaze me when people respond to 9 1/2 year old posts.

Thal
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Concerto Preservation Society

Offline perfect_pitch

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #23 on: February 04, 2013, 11:27:50 PM »
He is a shining star, blazing in the sky brilliantly, how the lesser mortals try to fizzle it out but in such vain!

I'm just off to the bathroom to throw up after reading that...

(excuse me...)



Don't get me started on frickin' Andre Rieu...

Offline lostinidlewonder

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #24 on: February 05, 2013, 02:22:29 AM »
It never ceases to amaze me when people respond to 9 1/2 year old posts.
Well I think it is better to respond to old posts than to create a duplicate new one which happens all the time.


I'm just off to the bathroom to throw up after reading that...

(excuse me...)
Well his music might not be what we consider the pinnacle of piano playing but we cannot deny that it is extremely popular among people who don't play piano whom constitutes the vast majority of our paying audience. The "elevator" music might leave a bad taste in professional pianists mouth but I am not going to put him down one bit, it is foolish since he is one of the most successful pianists to have lived and we could learn a great deal from him. The world generally isn't interested in complex music, they just want music which they can relate to and Richards music is easily understandable to pianist and non pianists alike.

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Offline kujiraya

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #25 on: February 06, 2013, 04:00:09 PM »
I have "The Piano Solos Of Richard Clayderman Anthology" right here in front of me. It is 144 pages long, a treasure trove of wonderful 5 star hotel lobby ivory-tinkling music. People, don't be snobbish! If Satie can rule elevator music, then Clayderman can rule hotel lobbies!

If you tried playing Stravinsky's Petrouchka in a hotel lobby, or even Beethoven's Waldstein, it won't be long before someone will quietly approach you to tell you that your playing is disturbing some of the hotel guests, but if you're playing Clayderman, you'll get tips and adoring women swooning all over the piano.
Piano: Yamaha C7 (at home)
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Currently working on: Chopin Polonaise Op. 53

Offline perfect_pitch

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #26 on: February 06, 2013, 11:22:18 PM »
but if you're playing Clayderman, you'll get tips and adoring women swooning all over the piano.

...yeah, but I'd feel a little dead inside as I was playing it.

Offline soitainly

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #27 on: February 07, 2013, 06:08:40 AM »
 I had never heard of Richard Clayderman so I checked him out on YouTube. For the first few moments I was thinking 'this sounds pretty good, whats the beef". Then it started getting a little repetitive and a little boring, then it started getting really boring and repetitive. Writing and playing good music isn't easy, not only do you have to have that initial spark or hook, you have to develop that spark and keep it moving.

 In the end, I wouldn't put to much hate on Clayderman's music or his playing. It fills a need for lots of people that just want some sugar coated music. If I could chicks and money playing like that I would be tempted. Lots of people really can't tell the difference between this and classical music.

Offline lostinidlewonder

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #28 on: February 07, 2013, 04:57:08 PM »
In the end, I wouldn't put to much hate on Clayderman's music or his playing. It fills a need for lots of people that just want some sugar coated music. If I could chicks and money playing like that I would be tempted. Lots of people really can't tell the difference between this and classical music.
It must make a lot of recording pianists sick that Clayderman can make so much money out of music that is so simple by comparison. I think those pianists should look at his example and play music which is more popular for the general audience not musicians. I heard on the radio that in the UK one of the top selling CDs is Orchestra playing video game music. lol :) www.lpo.org.uk/heroes/  They got it right!

Tracklist:
1. Advent Rising: Muse
2. Legend of Zelda: Suite
3. Call of Duty - Modern Warfare 2: Theme
4. Angry Birds: Main Theme
5. Final Fantasy VIII: Liberi Fatali
6. Super Mario Bros: Themes
7. Uncharted - Drake s Fortune: Nate's Theme
8. Grand Theft Auto IV: Soviet Connection
9. World of Warcraft: Seasons of War
10. Metal Gear Solid: Sons of Liberty Theme
11. Tetris Theme
12. Battlefield 2: Theme
13. Elder Scrolls: Oblivion
14. Call of Duty 4 - Modern Warfare: Main Menu Theme
15. Mass Effect: Suicide Mission
16. Splinter Cell: Conviction
17. Final Fantasy: Main Theme
18. Bioshock: The Ocean on his Shoulders
19. Halo 3: One Final Effort
20. Fallout 3: Theme
21. Super Mario Galaxy: Gusty Garden Galaxy

Now that is an orchestra in touch with todays trends !

If Satie can rule elevator music, then Clayderman can rule hotel lobbies!
I always thought Satie was considered "Furniture" music and Clayderman was "Elevator". eheh they are peculiar ways of describing music but it works I guess :)
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Offline davesx196x

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #29 on: February 08, 2013, 08:25:23 PM »
Nothing wrong with Richard Clayderman -- I'll bet even Rubinstein couldn't get turtles to mate!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/video/2013/feb/08/tortoise-sex-piano-richard-clayderman-video

Offline hfmadopter

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrome
«Reply #30 on: February 17, 2013, 10:32:58 AM »
Quote from: dave sx196v link=topic=950.msg 544519#msg 544519 date=1360355123
Nothing wrong with Richard Clayderman -- I'll bet even Rubinstein couldn't get turtles to mate!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/video/2013/feb/08/tortoise-sex-piano-richard-clayderman-video

Interesting.

 But the thing about Clayderman is he has got it right. Listen to all the sappy music they play with movies these day, the fake ethereal or surreal glowing moments. I have daughters, adult daughters and grand daughters who just love to sit with wet eyes over some sappy movie that's on. If I play my keyboard with string background the same thing happens to my wife, so ya Clayderman is cashing in , good for him ! Simplify, make it beautiful sounding, at least I can attest that the women love that stuff.

I love my grand piano and classical music but the digital with some stringed orchestral background gets a real stur. And it's pure fun to do ( Kawai MP6) ! Clayderman is living a fun life I bet.
Depressing the pedal on an out of tune acoustic piano and playing does not result in tonal color control or add interest, it's called obnoxious.

Offline ranniks

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Re: Richard Clayderman syndrom
«Reply #31 on: February 17, 2013, 10:44:15 AM »


So nice. :)

Music tastes differ though.