2 questions on piano and the brain

[yamagal]

I did a search but didn't find these exact topics.  Hopefully this isn't a repeat of earlier threads - apologies if so.

1.  I suspect that when I am learning a new piece, my brain keeps working on it even when I am not actually sitting at the piano.  At a conscious level, the music runs thru my head over and over (mostly the section I am currently working on).  Usually I don't pay much attention to the "playback" because I am busy doing other things.  So the conscious effect, I suppose, is little more than it would be if I were just passively listening to the piece on the radio.  But at a subconscious level, it seems to me my brain is incorporating what I have been studying, because that the next time I sit down at the piano, I can generally play the section more easily than I could previously (this is only if I have been practicing consistently, however!)

Has anyone else experienced this, and is this something that has been studied/written about?

Btw, this does not happen w/ pieces from long ago that I am relearning and can pick up fairly easily.  It only happens with new material.


2.  I have read here and elsewhere numerous admonitions to really pay attention when you play, or at least when you are learning a piece or technique.  ITA with this, but what about once you have memorized a piece and are working on polishing it (expression, nuance, etc.)  At that point I find that consciously thinking about the piece as I play usually messes me up.  By consciously thinking about it I mean asking myself stuff like, "Ok, what comes next?" or "I'd better not mess up that hard section!" etc.  But if I just mentally surf on top of the music, I can automatically play the piece and infuse it with expression.  The closest thing I can think of wrt this is when competitive figure skaters mess up and they say afterward, "I was thinking too hard about what to do next instead of just letting go and skating".

What I wonder is what underlies this phenomenon.  Is this a right brain/left brain thing or a conscious/subconscious thing, or a little of both?

[ryan2189]

I think I can answer your questions yamagal

1. There is such a thing known as PPI (Post Practice Improvement). This theory states that although we might not always be sitting down at the piano we are still improving without even knowing it. You were very observant in noticing that these small changes are seen when you sit down at the piano the next day. To make the most improvement while you are not actually practicing, it has been suggested that any new pieces should be played extremely slow, so that you have the accuracy and correct fingering. PPI will eventually take over once you are done for the day and you will start to see gradual improvement. (That last sentence or two was just some extra info) If you would like to learn more copy this link

https://members.aol.com/chang8828/contents.htm

scroll down and click on the link called "Third Section) and scroll down to #15
Mr. Chang describes it in a little more detail than I did.

2. I understand that it is important to play properly and follow all marks, but then again it wouldn't be your own music if you followed all of the rules. You need to make sure that you are also adding some of your character to it as well. If you don't agree with that suggestion then I would say make sure that you are playing all of the notes accurately and correctly, and then take things like your tone, accents, speed, etc. one step at a time. If you try to learn it all at once then your are sure to make mistakes. But remember, you will always play better if you just let the music "flow" I think that your skating analogy already said that for me.

Hope I was of help

[bernhard]

Have a look at these threads:

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,3625.msg32673.html#msg32673
(PPI –  comparison with body building – brief mention of movement and intellectual centre – comparison with babies walking and coma patients- muscle tension and nerve inhibition – how to investigate and test practice ideas – How to teach by using progressively difficult repertory)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,4059.msg37072.html#msg37072
(Does there come a time when piano learning will not be so difficult – The problem: a good teacher, enough practice and yet very slow progress –  approach maybe everything: practice to make it easy. Guardian link to Alan Rustrbridge article – summary of PPI - alternate hands)

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[yamagal]

Thank you both, the links are very helpful - I have bookmarked them.   

[i_m_robot]

I did a search but didn't find these exact topics.  Hopefully this isn't a repeat of earlier threads - apologies if so.

1.  I suspect that when I am learning a new piece, my brain keeps working on it even when I am not actually sitting at the piano.  At a conscious level, the music runs thru my head over and over (mostly the section I am currently working on).  Usually I don't pay much attention to the "playback" because I am busy doing other things.  So the conscious effect, I suppose, is little more than it would be if I were just passively listening to the piece on the radio.  But at a subconscious level, it seems to me my brain is incorporating what I have been studying, because that the next time I sit down at the piano, I can generally play the section more easily than I could previously (this is only if I have been practicing consistently, however!)

Has anyone else experienced this, and is this something that has been studied/written about?

Btw, this does not happen w/ pieces from long ago that I am relearning and can pick up fairly easily.  It only happens with new material.


2.  I have read here and elsewhere numerous admonitions to really pay attention when you play, or at least when you are learning a piece or technique.  ITA with this, but what about once you have memorized a piece and are working on polishing it (expression, nuance, etc.)  At that point I find that consciously thinking about the piece as I play usually messes me up.  By consciously thinking about it I mean asking myself stuff like, "Ok, what comes next?" or "I'd better not mess up that hard section!" etc.  But if I just mentally surf on top of the music, I can automatically play the piece and infuse it with expression.  The closest thing I can think of wrt this is when competitive figure skaters mess up and they say afterward, "I was thinking too hard about what to do next instead of just letting go and skating".

What I wonder is what underlies this phenomenon.  Is this a right brain/left brain thing or a conscious/subconscious thing, or a little of both?

practice one section during commercial breaks of your favorite show

each time you sit back at the piano it will become easier

[bernhard]

practice one section during commercial breaks of your favorite show

each time you sit back at the piano it will become easier

This is a most excellent suggestion (especially if you do it not only on the commercial breaks but during the TV program as well )