E.T.'s

[mycrabface]

Okay.. so I've seen the many responses on whether God exists or not.... My question as a christian is: why are people so unwilling to believe that there is a God(let alone which god)?

Hey crazy for more ivan moravec.. do you have a religion?

[stealsoul]

Okay.. so I've seen the many responses on whether God exists or not.... My question as a christian is: why are people so unwilling to believe that there is a God(let alone which god)?

Because there must be a motivation as non christian to start believing in a god.
Just because one says god exists is for a non believer not a reason to start believing.
One might just aswell believe in hisself/herself or orsomething else.

[mycrabface]

Because there must be a motivation as non christian to start believing in a god.
Just because one says god exists is for a non believer not a reason to start believing.
One might just aswell believe in hisself/herself or orsomething else.

You know there is solid living proof that the Lord EXISITS?
I know you'd say 'where?'... oops sorry.... i forgot... but its something like some history thing that matches the records in the bible.. and there are miracles which happened.. like the same thing happened to ppl at different ends of the earth..

[stealsoul]

You know there is solid living proof that the Lord EXISITS?
I know you'd say 'where?'... oops sorry.... i forgot... but its something like some history thing that matches the records in the bible.. and there are miracles which happened.. like the same thing happened to ppl at different ends of the earth..

Yes, there are things that match the bible. -- But there are also things that don't match the bible.  There are also things (and things that happend) that match in other religions, for example: many people around the world say they are reincarnated.

Is there scientific proof god exists? no.

When you say the lord, you mean the christian god. It's not completly the same as the Islamic god and different from one of the Norse Gods, the greek gods etc.

The reasons for believing and so are all personal.
Ask yourself why you don't believe in the norse gods?


 

[prometheus]

Islam also worships the God of Abraham. It is the same God. The bible and the quran have the same stories and prophets.

I think mycrabface was being sarcastic about proof for God through bible matching with historic accounts.

[stealsoul]

It's not exactly the same god

In Islam, if God wants to forgive sin, He simply says, "It is forgiven." Christianity recognizes the necessity of the shedding of blood for the forgiveness of sin. (Hebrews 9:22)

from https://www.christiananswers.net/islam.html

I´m sure there are some more differences, but I can´t remember it exactly now.

Altough the bible and quran have many stories alike, there are some different stories aswell.  For example, muslims don´t believe jesus had been crucified.
https://www.christiananswers.net/q-aiia/islam-cross.html

[Jacey1973]

Last time i looked this thread was about E.Ts.........hmmmm

[crazy for ivan moravec]

I'm a member just like anyone else, and I don't see why I can't comment posts. I'm just giving information and thoughts.

yes, you have the right to comment on anything and i also don't see why you can't. but read what i said... i wasn't even close to banning you from posting (i don't have the right). i even said PLEASE.

I'm close minded because I think it's absurd? THINK FOR A SECOND ~!
Yes, ofcourse it isn't absurd for catholics, but should I change my opinion on it because of that? I think not!

nobody's telling you to change ur opinion but your comment on the catholics' act of confession being absurd is really OFF. there are things which are better off to yourself.

believe me, i've met people of different religions, no religions, atheists (most of my social sciences professors were). my favorite hang out/eat place during college was the Atheists' Circle of the university, where they sell food. and i've never encountered such a harsh opening from them. i've even met catholics who would say "i don't believe in confession." but they would never say it's absurd bcoz they know that for some, like me, it is not. unless maybe if i asked them why...

You must be close minded because you don't want to know anything about other beliefs. Luckly for you, I quit church and don't have a religion anymore.

i am, as always, interested to meet people and talk about our beliefs. knowing more about other beliefs makes me appreciate my own religion even more. it is just YOUR belief which i don't wanna ask about. *i wonder why*. sorry bout that.

What makes you think I don't know anything about confession? What makes you think I don't know or don't want to know anything about it?

so why should i THINK FOR A SECOND~! whether you're close minded or not? haha, of course i would assume you don't know anything about it and that you're close minded bcoz you called it absurd and didn't say why.

ok, prove it. why is it absurd?




p.s.

to mycrabface: i am catholic.


but allow me...

struggling to practice, really, but happy to know i am struggling. it has not crossed my mind that God doesn't exist because there is evidence of Him, evidence which are not necessarily based on my five senses alone. my senses are just tools for simple things here on earth, things which it can comprehend.

but it is my soul which tells my mind that God exists. science is not the key to everything. just like the catholic church, science had so many mistakes and we just have to accept that. just like the catholic church, or any other religion, it is a HUMAN organization and is ready to commit a mistake anytime (so, the only thing which i actually have issues with the CC is the Infallibility of the Pope. but yes, i still do struggle to mend that part).

but if scientists are even puzzled with a lot of things there are on this planet, why should i base my evidence of God on science alone? now that would be absurd.

good day.

[prometheus]

It's not exactly the same god

You missed the point. Either the God of Abraham cloned himself or he didn't. He used to be the same God because both worship the God of Abraham.

So they worship the same God but a different prophet, resulting in theological and dogmatic differences. I don't think assuming that, every time a theological disagreement between two persons arises God observes this and duplicates himself, is logical.

it has not crossed my mind that God doesn't exist because there is evidence of Him, evidence which are not necessarily based on my five senses alone.

You should look up the definition of evidence. The fact that you can't recognise the difference between reality and fiction, which would be my interpretation of what you are describing, isn't evidence.

and i've never encountered such a harsh opening from them.

First off, the fact that someone is an atheist doesn't mean this person has the opinion that religion is potentially dangerous or bad. People who don't believe in God don't do so because they don't like religion. They do this because they can't believe in something that has no basis is our reality. Second, this isn't a lunch hangout. This is an internet discussion board. Argument get always very harsh and inflammable because of the nature of the medium.

About confession in christianity. Yes, the theological dogma is absurd. If Hitler confessed and accepted Christ as his savior just before he shot himself he would go to Heaven according to christian dogma. But if someone lives as Christ himself, or better, but also rejects the notion of Christ as his personal savior then that person will go to hell.

So the criteria of going to hell or heaven is if you can accept something for where there are no facts or evidence. But that is not all. Christ was one third God, he was part of the trinity and he was the son and also a human. His mother was a virgin. He is the only human ever that was not sinful. Being a human is sinful. Why, because a woman ate an apple, which God lied about, that gave humans free will and a sense of morality. So all humans are born in sin. And only christ can redeem us. Why? Because he was nailed to the cross. He suffered so much that he can carry all our sins for us. No other human suffered as much as Christ. But the guy did know he was the son of God and that he would save all humans by dieing at the cross. He also knew he would be resurrected and eventually go to Heaven. Considering all the suffering on earth, not a very bad outlook for someone who is supposed to have suffered so much he can carry all human sins.

So I am a sinner. If I go to africa to help sick children as a charity worker docter I am still a sinner. If I rape and kill ten woman I am just as much as a sinner as when I do nothing or the above. Talking about a moral compass...
The only way to redeem myself is to accept the silly story above. I would find it rather amusing if this didn't come from an organisation which such a bloody history and such many followers. Yes, the story itself is not only absurd. The context in which it is told and by who makes it even worse. And if I don't I don't just die and cease to exist. No, I will burn in hell for eternity.

Apart from if there is any evidence or if it is true, apart from if you and I want to believe in something like that, apart from all this, these ideas are absurd.

I remember this story about the afterlife in which God would give every person what they used to believe in. So if they thought out a nice theology they would be rewarded for it. If they made up a cruel one they would suffer from their own strange ideas. That was pretty funny.

My question as a christian is: why are people so unwilling to believe that there is a God(let alone which god)?

This is such an easy question. The existence of God has no influence over our reality, over our life. If God exists we cannot measure the influence she has on our world. So what does it matter if she exists or not? Why would one believe in an entity which exists outside our world. God has nothing to do with our existence, our world, our lives.
Why would we believe in something without any evidence?

Lets turn the whole thing around? Why would one believe in one thing for which there is no evidence and not in something else for which there is no evidence? Why believe in God but not believe in fairies? Why not believe in homeopathy. Or in ghosts? Or in animals that can read our minds? There are tons of things we cannot disprove. Why not believe in all of those things? If your mind is so flexible and so indulgent why only believe in one of those ideas? And why this particular one?

[crazy for ivan moravec]

that was really nice, prometheus. thank u for sharing.

[mycrabface]

You missed the point. Either the God of Abraham cloned himself or he didn't. He used to be the same God because both worship the God of Abraham.

oh yeah? are you sure about that? dosen't mean that god of abraham in the bible IS god of abraham in the kur-an. for instance: you see a 'crab face' logged on somewhere. you go to another website and see another 'crab face'. it dosen't have to be the same one(this has actually happened before).

I think mycrabface was being sarcastic about proof for God through bible matching with historic accounts.

Yes, there are things that match the bible. -- But there are also things that don't match the bible. There are also things (and things that happend) that match in other religions, for example: many people around the world say they are reincarnated.

Is there scientific proof god exists? no.

When you say the lord, you mean the christian god. It's not completly the same as the Islamic god and different from one of the Norse Gods, the greek gods etc.

The reasons for believing and so are all personal.
Ask yourself why you don't believe in the norse gods?


 

Ask yourself why you don't believe in the norse gods?


 

Faith.


and of course lord means my god. not buddha or confucius or allah or tian shen..

p.s.

to mycrabface: i am catholic.

umm.. half a high five..

[crazy for ivan moravec]

umm.. half a high five..

hi mycrabface.
hmmm, sorry im not really sure what you meant by this..?

[mycrabface]

hi mycrabface.
hmmm, sorry im not really sure what you meant by this..?

same god right?
may i ask.. why do catholics worship mary too?

[crazy for ivan moravec]

haha. that' a misconception. we don't worship her, nor the saints. we venerate Mary because she was chosen by God to be the mother, thus the repetitive recitation of the Rosary. it's great respect for her. on the other hand, the saints are our models of christian living. we have these statues and pictures of these cool guys coz it's like having pictures and monuments of our idols (say, mine is Ivan Moravec) and we'd like to be like them too, ever so faithful.

the only thing which is lacking is education from our church. we catholics aren't so well-informed of our own practices, so, you might see some of us worship wooden idols, as in touching it and stuff like that. but that is not exactly what the church wants.

actually, there are a lot of weird things which catholics do, but is not exactly what the CC wants.

[prometheus]

oh yeah? are you sure about that? dosen't mean that god of abraham in the bible IS god of abraham in the kur-an.

Two Abrahams and two Gods? But the same story? Do you believe that?

What about the God of the Torah? Is that God of Abraham also a different one from the CC one?

And what about those of the reformed christians? The Jehova's christians? The east orthodox christians? All different Gods? All different Abraham's, Moseses and Jesus Christ's?

Faith.

Why does it exist, this faith of yours? And why does it take the shape it does and manifest it the way it does? Can you even answer the question?

and of course lord means my god. not buddha or confucius or allah or tian shen..

Allah is arabic for 'the one' or 'the one god', just like Lord is when applied to God, just as JHWH is.

I don't really get the point. Lord means God. But 'Gott', 'Heer', 'Dios' and 'Dieu' don't? So they are different entities or false entities? What is the difference between Allah and those other words used to denote God? Only english people can worship the same God as you do? What about latin? What about Adonai, El, Elohim, Elyon, Shaddai and Shekinah. Those are some of the words in the original texts of the bible.

Confucius(K'ung Fu Tzu) is a philosopher. It means nothing. It is just a name. Well, the name may mean something since all our names mean something.
Buddha is a title meaning someone who is enlightened. It means something like 'awakened one'.
I never heard of Tian Shen.

I don't really see the point at all of this.

[stealsoul]

we are all wasting time that you could use to play piano and so 

[mycrabface]

haha. that' a misconception. we don't worship her, nor the saints. we venerate Mary because she was chosen by God to be the mother, thus the repetitive recitation of the Rosary. it's great respect for her. on the other hand, the saints are our models of christian living. we have these statues and pictures of these cool guys coz it's like having pictures and monuments of our idols (say, mine is Ivan Moravec) and we'd like to be like them too, ever so faithful.

the only thing which is lacking is education from our church. we catholics aren't so well-informed of our own practices, so, you might see some of us worship wooden idols, as in touching it and stuff like that. but that is not exactly what the church wants.

actually, there are a lot of weird things which catholics do, but is not exactly what the CC wants.

If you dont mind me saying.. one of the ten commandments: dont worship idols.. right? in christianity, our focus is set more on god and jesus.. yup..

Two Abrahams and two Gods? But the same story? Do you believe that?

What about the God of the Torah? Is that God of Abraham also a different one from the CC one?

And what about those of the reformed christians? The Jehova's christians? The east orthodox christians? All different Gods? All different Abraham's, Moseses and Jesus Christ's?

Why does it exist, this faith of yours? And why does it take the shape it does and manifest it the way it does? Can you even answer the question?

Allah is arabic for 'the one' or 'the one god', just like Lord is when applied to God, just as JHWH is.

I don't really get the point. Lord means God. But 'Gott', 'Heer', 'Dios' and 'Dieu' don't? So they are different entities or false entities? What is the difference between Allah and those other words used to denote God? Only english people can worship the same God as you do? What about latin? What about Adonai, El, Elohim, Elyon, Shaddai and Shekinah. Those are some of the words in the original texts of the bible.

Confucius(K'ung Fu Tzu) is a philosopher. It means nothing. It is just a name. Well, the name may mean something since all our names mean something.
Buddha is a title meaning someone who is enlightened. It means something like 'awakened one'.
I never heard of Tian Shen.

I don't really see the point at all of this.

yes yes, confucius was a philosopher and buddha was a prince. they have followers who treat them as gods. and as far as im concerned, all these coincidences(allah, god of torah etc) are lame attempts made by the devil to confuse us, humans(aka stupid people). You know the devil gave us magazines, busied up our daily schedule, so that we would no longer have time for god? Faith. i was lucky to have been brought up a christian. therefore, it is my religion, and is what i strongly believe in. this is by the grace of god.

[crazy for ivan moravec]

you're right. and it's not true that catholics worship idols. "models" is more like it. sometimes, it seems that way but it really is not.

[gruffalo]

having studied a bit of Astrophysics last year, when you realise how vast and incredibly huge the universe is you start to think that even if there were other life forms or E.T.s the chances of finding them before our star (the Sun) stops performing Nuclear Fusion is very slim.

But i do think there could be life forms out there, and suitable conditions. What gives us the right to say "no, we are the only ones that exist"?

[lau]

The moment I saw the title, I knew it would be one of these arguments.