Are we witnessing the beginning of World War III?

[Bob]

Problems in the Middle East.  What's the future hold?

Could it be that things go horribly wrong and this is the beginning of a third world war?

I heard WWI and WWII were connected.  Israel was established after WWII right?  Connected straight into WWIII maybe?

[lisztisforkids]

Problems in the Middle East. What's the future hold?

Could it be that things go horribly wrong and this is the beginning of a third world war?

I heard WWI and WWII were connected. Israel was established after WWII right? Connected straight into WWIII maybe?

The next world war (if there is one) is not going to be over the Middle East... Its going to be between the U.S. and China, probaly within the next 15-25 years by my guess.

[pianistimo]

never underestimate your enemies - yet, we can't go around hiding under a bomb shelter (as no one believes they work anyway).  at least we know that if times get tough - americans and many other peoples of other nations are tougher than they look.  and, if you believe the bible - it looks like it will get worse before it gets better so you have to brace yourself for maybe being a bit uncomfortable.  you know, like people got through the depression by eating potatoes.  (*advises bob to start this right away to get used to it).

one thing that has dramatically affected me is the price of gas.  whew!  my last gas bill was astronomical.  i think we're going to limit how much we go out.  and my son was saying he definately wants a car that doesn't waste gas.  and, the heating bill.  i think the prices of things are going to keep going up and you have to start being less and less wasteful so you don't get into financial trouble.

do you ever wonder what would happen in the middle of the day - when your family is split up.  they say here in case of emergency the kids go someplace (have to find the paper again) farther away.  getting everyone back together is important.  having a meeting spot (or maybe several -seems like it would save alot of hassles).  look at katrina - that was really wild.  being resourceful, quick thinking, and possibly looking into first aid training wouldn't be a bad idea for most folk now.  do you think?

someone advised to have a backpack for everyone in your family filled with a couple water bottles, blanket, extra clothes, shoes, somekind of snack, money, etc.  probably not a terrible idea.  if one had to leave an area really fast.  of course, back in calif. we were always waiting for an earthquake - so we always 'stocked up' only to find that it would never be enough - because we'd use it up.  God is really the best one to ask about preparation.  seems that in the bible - during the famine of joseph's time - he stocked up int he seven years of plenty for the seven years of not so good times.  maybe we should do this with extra cash - just to survive a month or so.

[prometheus]

If WWIII would be about Israel that would be ironic because the seeds of WWII were sown after WWI.

Why would the US and China fight a WWIII? And why would everyone else get involved?

Same with Israel. Why would the rest of the world get involved? And who would fight who? The Palestinians don't have an army.

[pianistimo]

if the bible is any indication of what will happen in our generation - we'll have people fighting (probably for oil) near meggido( armageddon).  yet, if the war changes focus -as all wars seem to do - everyone will end up fighting whomever looks dangerous.  ten nations are mentioned in daniel - but also 'rumors from the east' and 'north' - all these different countries may enter the picture and possibly in the end be 'all nations' that will be at war.  i get things mixed up when i read daniel and revelation - but one thing is certain - it will end.  maybe not the way we expect?  i hope God 'cuts short' the times.  even if you don't totally believe now, the bible says that 'all who call on God's name will be saved.'  so even if we die - it's not the end.  but, if he means a literal saving - there will be a rescue of people who believe and trust in God.  it makes me think of the place in matthew 'pray that your flight not be on the sabbath'.. and 'woe to those that are pregnant or nursing in those days.'  sounds like, because of the jewish tone and nature that Christ was referring to those in jerusalem - to leave the city when starts to be surrounded by armies.  luke21:21 "then those in judea must flee to the mountains.  let those within the city escape from it, and let those in the countryside not enter the city, for these days are the time of punishment when all the scriptures are fulfilled."

several friends of mine and also my brother's kids are taking boy scouts survival skills stuff.  guess that it never hurts to be prepared to know how to survive in different situations.  i wouldn't know what to put in the backpack.  probably marshmallow hearts and good book.  can't imagine living without all the stuff we are used to.  i prepare myself by watching the navy seals and eating popcorn.  somehow i like watching that rigorous training - but could never imagine the soreness from days on the go and very little food or sleep.  almost all my husband's novels are about submarines getting too close and sending a missle.  guess it's like pandora's box -once opened.  it does feel like it's opening.

[leahcim]

if the bible is any indication of what will happen in our generation

I'll eat my hat.

several friends of mine and also my brother's kids are taking boy scouts survival skills stuff.  guess that it never hurts to be prepared to know how to survive in different situations.

Yep, skills such as dodging paedophiles and packing old ladies shopping will be highly sought
after post-nuclear attack 

[contrapunctus]

I doubt the fact that we will ever fight another 1st world country like China because of M.A.D. (mutually assured distruction), caused by nukes. The fight in the middle east is a world war, or soon will be, because countries all over war are in it. The situation in the middle east is unfortunate. "It is what happens when people take religion too seriously" --My modern world history professor.

[BoliverAllmon]

The Middle East has been in turmoil for thousands of years. It hasn't broken into WWIII before and I don't think it will.

[ada]

if the bible is any indication of what will happen

Pianistimo I know you are a very lovely person but you are much nicer when you don't bang on about the bible.

I believe it's what Samuel Huntington called The Clash of Civilisations.

From Wikipedia: "The Clash of Civilizations is a controversial theory in international relations popularized by Samuel P. Huntington. The basis of Huntington's thesis is that people's cultural/religious identity will be the primary agent of conflict in the post-Cold War world.

Huntington's thesis was originally formulated in an article entitled "The Clash of Civilizations?" published in the academic journal Foreign Affairs in 1993."

Check it out.

ada

[pianistimo]

i beg to differ.  people who join the army, navy, marines, and national guard are from all walks of life, all religions and beliefs.  it just so happens that a percentage of our population still does believe 'under God we trust.' but, if we trust God - then he'll fight our battles for us.  jerusalem is a holy city to Him and when it's desecrated - the battle won't be religion at first -but in the end i do think it will be God and man.  all people belong to Him and owe allegiance to Him.  we are human and we can't survive nukes, fire, famine, disease, destruction without some kind of intervention.  i will depend on Him for survival or being changed at Christ's second coming.  if we are Christian - we believe that He will return and set the world right.

something that makes me think it may be our generation is that we are also seeing an increase of strange weather conditions.  luke 21:25 before the coming of Christ "there will be signs in the sun (getting hotter?), the moon, and the stars, and on earth nations will be in dismay, perplexed by the roaring of the sea and the waves.  people will die of fright in anticipation of what is coming upon the world, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken.  adn then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.  but when these signs begin to happen, stand erect and raise your heads, because your redemption is at hand."

vs 36 "be vigilant at all times and pray that you have strength to escape the tribulations that are imminent and to stand before the Son of Man."  i find the use of His name very warming.  he doesn't say 'I am God - and i will smush you'  - He makes the connection to man by saying that he was born 'son of man' but will return in glory.  his love is everlasting and even if He is angry for a moment - it is only that.

something else that will be a witness is when the wailing wall comes down.  Christ prophecied that "not one stone left upon another that shall not be thrown down." the temple will be desecrated and some kind of abomination put into the center.  also, regarding religion, we are told (luke 21:12) "before all this happens, however, they will seize and persecute you, they will hand you over to the synagogues and to prisons,  and they will have you led before kings and governors because of My Name.  it will lead to your giving testimony.  remember, you are not to prepare your defense beforehand, for I myself shall give you a wisdom in speaking, that all your adversaries will be powerless to resist or refute.  you will even be handed over by parents, brothers, relatives, and friends, and they will put some of you to death.  you will be hated by all because of My Name, but not one hair of your head will be destroyed.  by your perseverance you will secure your lives." 

[pianolearner]

The next world war (if there is one) is not going to be over the Middle East... Its going to be between the U.S. and China, probaly within the next 15-25 years by my guess.

I think I agree. Naturally it will be over a scarce resource like Oil. China has openly declared it has an ambition to be an economic and military superpower.

[pantonality]

My short answer is No, we are not witnessing the beginning of WW III. WE are witnessing a clash of cultures caused by the immense speedup of communications during the last 60 years. The words I type will be visible to anyone on the planet seconds after I click Post. We are seeing our fellow humans as they really are for the first time. Why does it surprise you that they look unfamiliar and are different from us. The real issue is cultures that view themselves as somehow superior and seek to convert the unconverted. When we learn to accept our fellow human beings as they are we will be on the road to peace on earth. It seems so simple, yet it would involve a significany paradigm shift because our cultures have evolved to conquer instead of cooperate. This applies as much to Christianity as to Islam as to economics.

Steve

[pianistimo]

yet this one world system is prophecied - and we are warned not to accept it's 'mark' - without which we will neither be able to buy or sell.

[musik_man]

I can't think of any scenario that starts a world war.  There's a very good chance of another war in the Middle East(I'd guess US v Iran.)  I also wouldn't be shocked if India and Pakistan ended up in war. 

As far as the US versus China, I doubt that that will happen.  For one, we have a ocean between us, which complicates how any large scale war will occur( I doubt there's gonna be Japan style island hopping.)  Additionally, China would be crushed by our military, as our equipment is way more advanced.  The only way that China could rectify this is to catch up to the US economically.  For that to happen, they'd have to liberalize their economy and therefore government to such an extent that they'd have little reason to go to war with us.

What I do think will happen in the next couple decades, is a civil war in either China or Russia.  In China I think that the growing economic prosperity will cause the people to grow increasingly intolerant of the government.  As people gain the economic freedom they need to succeed they're gonna want political freedom.  Seeing the Chinese government's(btw what is it classified as now?  It certainly is no longer communist) current behaviour, I don't think that liberty will come peacefully.  China also has to deal with the problems of the rural population.  There's a growing economically well to do urban population, and a subsistence farming population, and sooner or later the differences in these groups have to be dealt with.  Finally, as a result of its one birth policy, China has a boy/girl ratio of ~120/100.  Roughly 1/5 of Chinese males are going to never have a wife.  A large single male population makes the country ripe for upheaval.

In Russia, Putin's restrictions of freedom could very well inspire a revolution against him.  Or after his death(assuming he becomes an out and out dictator) there will be a power struggle resulting in a civil war.

I'd also like to state that I put very little trust in my own predictions.  I'd actually be surprised if any of them did happen.  History is hard to predict.

BTW, Pianonut, The Bible states that no one except God knows the hour and day of Christ's second coming, so don't try to predict it.(so far everyone who has has been wrong )

[rimv2]

My short answer is No, we are not witnessing the beginning of WW III. WE are witnessing a clash of cultures caused by the immense speedup of communications during the last 60 years. The words I type will be visible to anyone on the planet seconds after I click Post. We are seeing our fellow humans as they really are for the first time. Why does it surprise you that they look unfamiliar and are different from us. The real issue is cultures that view themselves as somehow superior and seek to convert the unconverted. When we learn to accept our fellow human beings as they are we will be on the road to peace on earth. It seems so simple, yet it would involve a significany paradigm shift because our cultures have evolved to conquer instead of cooperate. This applies as much to Christianity as to Islam as to economics.

Steve

Well said.

Its too bad certain people have literally devoted their lives to seeing that other people be removed from this world.

[pianolearner]

My short answer is No, we are not witnessing the beginning of WW III. WE are witnessing a clash of cultures caused by the immense speedup of communications during the last 60 years. The words I type will be visible to anyone on the planet seconds after I click Post. We are seeing our fellow humans as they really are for the first time. Why does it surprise you that they look unfamiliar and are different from us. The real issue is cultures that view themselves as somehow superior and seek to convert the unconverted. When we learn to accept our fellow human beings as they are we will be on the road to peace on earth. It seems so simple, yet it would involve a significany paradigm shift because our cultures have evolved to conquer instead of cooperate. This applies as much to Christianity as to Islam as to economics.

Steve

It's not a function of culture, it's a function of life. Nature revolves around killing to survive. No amount of Utopian preaching will prevent a war when resources are scarce and survival is paramount. Look at the way people behave in traffic when they are late for work. Look at the way people fight over items in a sale. Co-operation is a myth.

[pianolearner]

Roughly 1/5 of Chinese males are going to never have a wife.  A large single male population makes the country ripe for upheaval.

And ripe for invasion by an army of desperate women!

[Dazzer]

Nah i think in this day and age, the next world war will be over cyberspace.

Simple. Oil may be scarce, but steps are already being taken to overcome this dependency on oil. Efficient solar power systems, nuclear power, etc etc etc.

What's the biggest thing that everything runs on? Technology. without it, a country can be plunged into anarchy.

Imagine if your countries bank databases are hacked and corrupted, destroyed completely with no chance for backup, followed by a crash in the stock market systems. An entire nation's economy collapses. The world's richest men become paupers in mere minutes.

Next then imagine the internet being destroyed. All the nodes in the world are destroyed, physically or otherwise. Could you imagine living without internet? Maybe. But alot of economy nowadays is about internet. It is essential.

I could think of a lot more things. But basically, if you destroy a nation's IT infrastructure, its back to the dark ages. Power grids go off, water supplies are cut off, alot of sh*t that was predicted by Y2K could happen.

Of course, if this were to happen, then there'll probably be a little group out there somewhere battling on the front lines. haha

Oh well... very imaginative of me.

[Dazzer]

And ripe for invasion by an army of desperate women!

I'm one of them. - sigh -

Oh and i predict the coming of christ to be in the year 3600AD.

so give it up. you're never gonna see him. nor your children. nor your children's children, your children's children's children, your children's children's children's children, your children's children's children's children's children's children's children's children's children's children's children's children's children's children's children.

why isit that children looks ... wrong when i look at the word? did i spell it wrong? hope not...

[pantonality]

It's not a function of culture, it's a function of life. Nature revolves around killing to survive. No amount of Utopian preaching will prevent a war when resources are scarce and survival is paramount. Look at the way people behave in traffic when they are late for work. Look at the way people fight over items in a sale. Co-operation is a myth.

I don't have to kill any Chinese people to survive. There's plenty if we are careful about our resources. There's even plenty of fuel though the issue is how much more burning of fossil fuels can the planet take. There's enough methane at the bottom of the ocean to deplete the entire atmosphere of oxygen 10 times over. Our issue with resources has to do with not wanting to share and not caring to use them efficiently. Certainly that's a cultural issue, the problem is the culture that's wasting so much energy is our own. The only reason you don't want to see this as a cultural issue is because you don't want to change. Get used to it change is inevitable.

As energy prices rise we will care more about using our resources efficiently so the next technological revolution will be efficient use of fossil fuels and weaning away from them, but fossil fuels need to get more expensive in order for the economics to work. You are aware that there's more oil in the shale of Canada than there is in the middle east aren't you. If not google oil shale canada and read up on it.

I find it unfortunate that you choose to view the glass as half empty, you must be young (the sky is falling is a typical response of uncreative youth with limited experience). The world is changing for the better because try as it might (world governments) it's harder to hide the truth. Communication is too fast and the infrastructure too fragmented for anyone to take it all down. A terrorist attack might take out a regional chunk of the internet, but it's too big to take down the whole thing and there are other modes of communication (cell phones, satellite radio, cable and satellite TV). Even China couldn't take it all down (even if they wanted too, which they don't).

Steve

[gilad]

this whole west vs islam - islam vs the west is getting way scary.
it's so volitile and unpredictable.
if iran get nukes israel will be the first target on their board.
but i reckon military action will be taken soon against iran.
if non existent  WMDs  were cause enough for iraq to be attacked, well, iran are clearly able to produce nuclear weapons now.
saying that you will nuke another country like Ahmadinejad said he would israel isn't exactly very comforting, because other countries realise that they could be attacked next with all the tension right now, even egypt and other arab countries have warned of the danger of iran acquiring nukes.
but yes, about ww3. i heard 15 years ago that the 3rd war would be with china. it's speculation, an educated guess at most.
violence and war beyond  me.
why do people crave power and domination.
because they fear if they dont somebody else will.

[arensky]

this whole west vs islam - islam vs the west is getting way scary.
it's so volitile and unpredictable.
if iran get nukes israel will be the first target on their board.
but i reckon military action will be taken soon against iran.
if non existent  WMDs  were cause enough for iraq to be attacked, well, iran are clearly able to produce nuclear weapons now.
saying that you will nuke another country like Ahmadinejad said he would israel isn't exactly very comforting, because other countries realise that they could be attacked next with all the tension right now, even egypt and other arab countries have warned of the danger of iran acquiring nukes.
but yes, about ww3. i heard 15 years ago that the 3rd war would be with china. it's speculation, an educated guess at most.
violence and war beyond  me.
why do people crave power and domination.
because they fear if they dont somebody else will.

Yes it is scary...I have been following current events for over 30 years, and have never been scared until now. One word;  AHMADINEJAD.

He doesn't scream, rant and bluster like Hitler, Mussolini,  Kruschev, George Wallace, Hugo Chavez, Castro, Kim Jong-Il.... he is eerily measured and controlled in the footage I have seen of him, he is quite polite and thoughtful, actually friendly. He is clearly very intelligent. He reminds of one particular leader from the past; STALIN. The most frightening person of the last hundred years, maybe ever.

Is he bluffing? Is it hot air, calculated to keep his supporters happy? I hope so, but I don't think so. I believe he intends to act on his threats to destroy Israel. He is a religious fanatic (unlike Stalin) and like Hitler and unlike Stalin), will gladly see his country destroyed if they are not capable of defeating the infidels. He realizes that he can really effect the course of world events. It is my understanding that Islam and the Koran predict that the 11th or 12th Iman will return to Earth and bring paradise, but first there must be the APOCALYPSE. I'm afraid the Iranian President probably sees himself as the catalyst or bringer of this event.

Could someone please correct my version of the Islamic "second coming"? I know I am right about the Islamic Apocalypse preceeding the return of whoever, but who is that and why? I would like to know...

To answer the original question; QUITE POSSIBLY.

No, China and the USA will not fight each other. There is no need, no irreconcilable differences between them, no point to such a war. This WWIII will be a religious conflict, between Christianity and Islam. It's scary; rioters in several different Islamic countries have attacked the embassies of Norway and Denmark after newspapers there published cartoons ridiculing the Prophet, by depicting him, which is expressly forbidden in Islam. Soon aggresive mobs, malcontents etc. in Europe and the USA will retaliate, attacking Muslims and Muslim property there.

Things will go on like this for awhile, then the bomb will be launched at Israel. Then all holy ******* hell is going to break loose.  The EU will be drawn into a vast Middle East conflict with the USA (already there in great numbers as I write this) Russia could be drawn in,  Hugo Chavez (an anti-Semitic bigot and oppurtunist) will start trouble on the USA's southern flank, possibly supported by other Latin American countries, AND opposed by some. India and Pakistan, Indonesia and Australia may be sucked into the vortex as well. I think the whole world might be involved or affected, with one major exception; CHINA. They would be in a dominant position in the world if they stayed out of such a fight. Of course, I could be wrong about all this.

I hope so.

Why can't we all just get along with each other?

[pianolearner]

I don't have to kill any Chinese people to survive. There's plenty if we are careful about our resources. There's even plenty of fuel though the issue is how much more burning of fossil fuels can the planet take. There's enough methane at the bottom of the ocean to deplete the entire atmosphere of oxygen 10 times over. Our issue with resources has to do with not wanting to share and not caring to use them efficiently. Certainly that's a cultural issue, the problem is the culture that's wasting so much energy is our own. The only reason you don't want to see this as a cultural issue is because you don't want to change. Get used to it change is inevitable.

As energy prices rise we will care more about using our resources efficiently so the next technological revolution will be efficient use of fossil fuels and weaning away from them, but fossil fuels need to get more expensive in order for the economics to work. You are aware that there's more oil in the shale of Canada than there is in the middle east aren't you. If not google oil shale canada and read up on it.

I find it unfortunate that you choose to view the glass as half empty, you must be young (the sky is falling is a typical response of uncreative youth with limited experience). The world is changing for the better because try as it might (world governments) it's harder to hide the truth. Communication is too fast and the infrastructure too fragmented for anyone to take it all down. A terrorist attack might take out a regional chunk of the internet, but it's too big to take down the whole thing and there are other modes of communication (cell phones, satellite radio, cable and satellite TV). Even China couldn't take it all down (even if they wanted too, which they don't).

Steve

Steve,

You raise good points and yes, I know about the Oil in Canada and the Peak Oil Myth. I am not young (depending on how old you are), I am in my 30's and have become more cynical about the world as I have aged. In my 20's I really believed the world could live in harmony but realise that is a naive view.

The US makes up less than 5% of the world’s population but consumes 25% of the world’s resources. China makes up about 20% of the world population. What will happen when/if their thirst for resources grows to that of the US? Also there is Taiwan and her struggle for independence? Will the US intervene?

I agree with what you say in principle but unfortunately war is much easier than diplomacy.

[prometheus]

If the west is going to fight islam then I will leave the planet.

Come on, I cannot bear the idea of WWIII being a stupid religious war. I won't kill a single muslim loony for a christian loony or the other way around.

[zheer]

Is he bluffing? Is it hot air, calculated to keep his supporters happy? I hope so, but I don't think so. I believe he intends to act on his threats to destroy Israel. He is a religious fanatic (unlike Stalin) and like Hitler and unlike Stalin), will gladly see his country destroyed if they are not capable of defeating the infidels. He realizes that he can really effect the course of world events. It is my understanding that Islam and the Koran predict that the 11th or 12th Iman will return to Earth and bring paradise, but first there must be the APOCALYPSE. I'm afraid the Iranian President probably sees himself as the catalyst or bringer of this event.

    Hmmmmmmmm, i think am the only muslim on this forum , so i guess i should answer  that question,well as far as i know and i have read the KORAN like one who reads the news paper, and as far as am aware god does not forgive those who kill, unless it is to defend islam and its people against wrongfull agressoes. So i guess it is a matter of interpretation.
Do you want to know something very scary, well in the koran it says that god does sanction jhad.

[arensky]

    Hmmmmmmmm, i think am the only muslim on this forum , so i guess i should answer  that question,well as far as i know and i have read the KORAN like one who reads the news paper, and as far as am aware god does not forgive those who kill, unless it is to defend islam and its people against wrongfull agressoes. So i guess it is a matter of interpretation.
Do you want to know something very scary, well in the koran it says that god does sanction jhad.

Ok, so all this "return of the Iman " stuff is religious fanatics' interpretation of something in the Koran... I suspected as much. We have our own whack jobs here too, in fact the history of Christianity is full of them, Torquemada, the Puritans, Rasputin, and now Pat Robertson I've been rereading "The Autobiography of Malcom X ", he was a Black American Muslim leader in the 1950's and 1960's, and he brings up the defense of Islam ( and Black Americans) along the lines you just mentioned. Hey Christians and Jews have jihad too; I don't know where it's written, in the Old Testament I think, but written or not it sure happens ! Hey thank you for the clarification, Zheer... 

[leahcim]

Yeah, but I think with present events I've found got a solution to the problem in 2 threads

Getting rid of these guys wandering around with pictures of a bloke with a beard and keeping a few so-called fanatics busy.

All we need is someone to translate "Che who? Nah, think about it..." for us.

[Siberian Husky]

As much as I hate to admit it, i too believe world war III will be centered upon, if not heavily influenced by religion.

I fear the fact that, peaceful persuasiveness is nearly impossible in the matter of religious beliefs and ideas.

What we will have, are two ( or more) collective entities of religion that will collide with a force that will have the greatest negative impact on the earth and humanity. The magnitude of a war, in the terms of religious dispute, is really immeasurable, as it seems to just keep escalading. It is, in its most basic form, an argument over WHO is right. People die, murder, and hurt for their beliefs simply because it is their highest form of understanding. Religion is the ONE thing that justifies anything and everything in the eyes of the beholder. When your religious blood flows very passionately throughout your veins, you are never EVER wrong......in turn...WWIII if based on religion, will be a byproduct of this human attribute..

[gruffalo]

If WWIII would be about Israel that would be ironic because the seeds of WWII were sown after WWI.

Why would the US and China fight a WWIII? And why would everyone else get involved?

The US has a pact with Japan or one of the Asian countries that if China were to invade them, then the US has to step in. And good old Tony will probably follow Georgie boy into war.

[thalbergmad]

The US has a pact with Japan or one of the Asian countries that if China were to invade them, then the US has to step in. And good old Tony will probably follow Georgie boy into war.

Puppet Bliar will follow.

[arensky]

The US has a pact with Japan or one of the Asian countries that if China were to invade them, then the US has to step in. And good old Tony will probably follow Georgie boy into war.

There is no profit motive on either side for such a conflict. I cannot imagine that the current Chinese leadership would provoke such a fight, they would lose their biggest trading partner, and vice versa. If they did the USA involvement would primarily be Naval, the Japanese/South Koreans/Taiwanese are very well armed and trained. Imagine D-Day, with missiles directed at the Chinese invasion armada; a mess for them. In the event of a protracted missile exchange across the Taiwan Strait or the Sea of Japan, evantually Taiwan South Korea and Japan would buckle under the pressure, they are much smaller geographically than China and cannot sustain the amount of damage they would receive, whereas the Chinese will always have more people to expend, and are such a large country that they can take the physical damage to their infrastructure as well as the appaling casualties. And of course, it could escalate into a Trans-Pacific missile match, possibly with nuclear or chemical warheads. If the smaller nations surrendered, would the USA continue the shooting, or back off? I'm not sure, but such a war would benefit neither China or the USA at this point in time. If the leadership and policies of China suddenly changed drastically, it could happen. But why would they? It wouldn't make sense....

[pianolearner]

There is no profit motive on either side for such a conflict. I cannot imagine that the current Chinese leadership would provoke such a fight, they would lose their biggest trading partner, and vice versa. If they did the USA involvement would primarily be Naval, the Japanese/South Koreans/Taiwanese are very well armed and trained. Imagine D-Day, with missiles directed at the Chinese invasion armada; a mess for them. In the event of a protracted missile exchange across the Taiwan Strait or the Sea of Japan, evantually Taiwan South Korea and Japan would buckle under the pressure, they are much smaller geographically than China and cannot sustain the amount of damage they would receive, whereas the Chinese will always have more people to expend, and are such a large country that they can take the physical damage to their infrastructure as well as the appaling casualties. And of course, it could escalate into a Trans-Pacific missile match, possibly with nuclear or chemical warheads. If the smaller nations surrendered, would the USA continue the shooting, or back off? I'm not sure, but such a war would benefit neither China or the USA at this point in time. If the leadership and policies of China suddenly changed drastically, it could happen. But why would they? It wouldn't make sense....

Was there any sense in the Cold War?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_War

"The Cold War was the strategic, economic and ideological struggle between the global superpowers of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and the United States of America, supported by their respective and emerging alliance partners."

You could say that it lead to nothing but it came close.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuban_missile_crisis

You only need look at how violent the 20th Century was (And all of history) to see that Midnight Oil is right - "If you read the history books you'll see the same things happen again and again, short memory they've all got it"

[jas]

World war is such a terrifying prospect (to state the obvious). It just seems like the kind of thing that shouldn't happen anymore. Why aren't we beyond using violence to try to solve problems? The idea of killing someone -- taking that definitive, irreversible step on another person's life -- just because of their beliefs and way of life, or just for gain, is utterly mindboggling. I can't even comprehend that kind of mindless fanaticism.

I don't know anything about the America-China thing so I won't comment on that, but religion I do have views on. I have major problems with religion anyway (but I'll spare you that rant!), and this kind of thing just reaffirms my long-held belief that we as a planet would be far better off without it. People can and do lead perfectly fulfilling lives without the influence of any religious beliefs. It isn't necessary as an incentive to be a good person. Our own conscious (or lack thereof) tells us how to behave.
The millions of worshippers who lead good, honest lives are counterbalanced with a much smaller (but much more demonstrative) group of mindless intolerants who have no scruples whatsoever when it comes to what they will do in the name of their god. Sadly, you can't have one without the other. And if it's a choice between both and neither, I for one would without a doubt opt for the latter, because there's no reasoning with a religious fanatic, they can't see how drastic and pointless their views are and, moreover, they don't care. For them, being right is all.

I would be very saddened if religion was to cause a world war. Obviously, any war is terrible, regardless of the reasons behind it, but I think it takes a special kind of twisted evil to do it in the name of a religion.

Jas

[gruffalo]

There is no profit motive on either side for such a conflict. I cannot imagine that the current Chinese leadership would provoke such a fight, they would lose their biggest trading partner, and vice versa. If they did the USA involvement would primarily be Naval, the Japanese/South Koreans/Taiwanese are very well armed and trained. Imagine D-Day, with missiles directed at the Chinese invasion armada; a mess for them. In the event of a protracted missile exchange across the Taiwan Strait or the Sea of Japan, evantually Taiwan South Korea and Japan would buckle under the pressure, they are much smaller geographically than China and cannot sustain the amount of damage they would receive, whereas the Chinese will always have more people to expend, and are such a large country that they can take the physical damage to their infrastructure as well as the appaling casualties. And of course, it could escalate into a Trans-Pacific missile match, possibly with nuclear or chemical warheads. If the smaller nations surrendered, would the USA continue the shooting, or back off? I'm not sure, but such a war would benefit neither China or the USA at this point in time. If the leadership and policies of China suddenly changed drastically, it could happen. But why would they? It wouldn't make sense....

there might not be much profit to earn from it, but the Chinese are sure as hell not interested in profit.

My history teacher agreed with me on this aswell, that the chinese army could easily take over Japan. Obviously the chinese are still no match for the Western powers, but it would still turn quite nasty.

[pantonality]

Steve,

You raise good points and yes, I know about the Oil in Canada and the Peak Oil Myth. I am not young (depending on how old you are), I am in my 30's and have become more cynical about the world as I have aged. In my 20's I really believed the world could live in harmony but realise that is a naive view.

The US makes up less than 5% of the world’s population but consumes 25% of the world’s resources. China makes up about 20% of the world population. What will happen when/if their thirst for resources grows to that of the US? Also there is Taiwan and her struggle for independence? Will the US intervene?

I agree with what you say in principle but unfortunately war is much easier than diplomacy.

I was also cynical in my 30s, it might have something to do with the age. Your comments about the voraciousness of the USA's appetite for resources is on target and perhaps some of the turmoil in the world has to do with that imbalance. There are many issues that face us and it is our mission as human beings to find solutions to them. Such solutions can be found if we're willing to think "outside the box." Think "stone soup" and not keep the other guy down and there's hope for humanity. If we're completely honest with each other as opposed to keeping secrets and there's hope for humanity. If we all just realize that at our core we're very much alike and have practically the same interest (to live productive happy lives) and seek ways to enable that for everyone then there's hope for humanity.

Now I won't kid you, our species is not capable of this type of thinking at this time, but 100 years ago in the USA women couldn't vote. 50 years ago African Americans were regularly lynched in parts of this country. Things are changing more rapidly now because the speed at which information travels has increased by several orders of magnitude. We're far from perfect, but as we become more cognizant of the interests of others we'll be more likely to seek solutions that benefit all parties. This is the very problem facing Iraq now. The Shia, Sunnis and Kurds don't want to cooperate, but will have to figure out how to if they are to avoid a bloodbath. In a sense the US presence is enabling poor behavior because we've taken responsibility for keeping them apart. They don't have to make the choice to be cooperative or face a horrific civil war. Thus the situation in Iraq will serve as a microcosm for the greater cultural conflict to come between Islam and Christianity.

Similarly look at the Palestinian situation. Hamas will not get aid from the west and will have to figure out how to bring prosperity to the Palestinians without outside help unless they change their outlook. So far that hasn't happened, but things could change if the economy goes sour on the West Bank and Gaza Strip because of their lack of cooperation.

Finally look at Saudi Arabia and Kuwait, they are selling off history's greatest natural resources and doing little to build the infrastructure for a post petroleum economy. They'll keep things comfortable as long as possible, but the time will come when they will have to do something to prepare their society for life in a post petroleum era. That will certainly yield significant cultural changes.

Yet all that's required to avoid conflict is an honest attempt to seek mutually beneficial solutions that serve the greater good. If we as a species cannot do that then we do not deserve survival. The bottomline is without the belief that humanity can do it we won't seek to even try. If we don't try then you all have very good reason to be scared.

So rather than think doom and gloom I'll simply state the obvious we all have to change, not suddenly or even all at once, but change will be necessary from everyone. Rather than fear it, fear the alternative and embrace change, because it's your only hope.