Another reason not to do drugs...

[lung7793]

&search=Vladimir%20Horowitz%20Piano

This is painful...I love horowitz, it's a shame he was on meds at the time of this concert. There are a bunch of other clips from it on youtube if you do a search, including an interview before this concert at his hotel.

[Waldszenen]

The poor guy looks really exhausted, as well.

Thank God he bounced back for his Moscow and Vienna recitals.

But still, drugged Horowitz plays a gazillion times better than I do.

[nicco]

This makes me very sad to watch.

[franz_]

***, this is haertbreaking to watch. He was drugged by what? Alcohol, medicaments,...?
This was really a recital in front of a public?  So weird and sad.

This is even worse:

https://youtube.com/watch?v=S5M5hYS-X3s

==> Watch how the people adore him, even after this terrible concert.

Could you imagine... you are Japanese and you want to see the best pianist on earth at the moment, the great Horowitz. You go to his concert and you get all that sh*t...

[cloches_de_geneve]

Strange, somehow his fingers seem more accurate than the sound. It's difficult for me to see where he missed all the notes. I have a recording of 10/8 of him from 1930ties, and  there is no comparison (even though he hit a fair amount of wrong notes even then).

[franz_]

It's difficult for me to see where he missed all the notes.

Every bar.

[zheer]

  Sheesh Horowitz has to be the only pianist that can be recognized, simply by looking at his hands, and yeah that was possibly the worst professional concert performance ever captured on video,unless there are more such recordings.

[lung7793]

He was on some type of antidepressant I believe.  He got rid of the doctor who prescribed it after this tour was over, and was back to his old self again.

***, this is haertbreaking to watch. He was drugged by what? Alcohol, medicaments,...?

. 

[arensky]

***, this is haertbreaking to watch. He was drugged by what? Alcohol, medicaments,...?
This was really a recital in front of a public?  So weird and sad.

This is even worse:

https://youtube.com/watch?v=S5M5hYS-X3s

==> Watch how the people adore him, even after this terrible concert.

It's my understanding that he was on an antidepressant that was a precursor to Zoloft, and removed from use because it did this to people. Evidently under it's influence he beagan smoking and drinking regularly for the first time since the 1930's, and believed he could do no wrong at the keyboard. The smoking and drinking is a rumour, don't know if that's true or not.

I heard him play these pieces in 1983 in Boston. The whole program was...

Beethoven Op.101
Schumann Carnaval

***************

Chopin Etudes Op. 10 #8, Op.25 #7 and #10.

Polonaise Op.53

I think I'm leaving something out, I don't remember what it was he played by Chopin right after intermission. It was horrifying, like watching a plane crash. No one in the audience was prepared for this, during the 2nd mvt. of the Beethoven (more wrong notes than right, and horrific aimless banging) people began to turn to one another and whisper in horror. It was interesting because while most of what he played was a mess certain sections of pieces were absolutly perfect and beautiful, like his "Pantalon et Columbine" from Carnaval, the  etudes, the slow parts of the Sonata. I knew something was wrong when he first walked out (I had seen him fives times previously), he was stiff, stooped and uncomfortable, like he had a back injury.

This said his tone was intact (when he wasn't slugging the piano in desperation) and his conceptions were remakable, as always.  It was simply the false notes. The Chopin Etudes were powerful and beautiful, even with the wrong notes (they were better than these vids). Best I've ever heard the Octave Etude played. He was still Horowitz, but it was like looking at a great painting that had had mud flung on it.

"Drugs", drink (?), and an old guy trying to be the young superman that he had once been. He never attempted programs like this again, his recitals from 1985 on were much less demanding, and he began to play Mozart and Schubert again after many years. I never heard any of those concerts live, but the recordings are beautiful, particularly his very last ones.

That Boston concert was the worst and yet one of the best concerts I ever saw. If most of us made the same mistakes, we would be jeered off the stage. He was truly a great artist, to be able to keep the attention of that full hall .

[nanabush]

Wow. that's incredible

[franz_]

Thank you for the lovely story. If Horowitz was a live, I would like to give him an enormeous hug if you see this.

[sissco]

I will uplaod a vid where he totally ruins etude 8/12 

Edit:

, well...not TOTALLY ruins it but its pretty crap 

[gruffalo]

I will uplaod a vid where he totally ruins etude 8/12 

Edit:

, well...not TOTALLY ruins it but its pretty crap 

what the hell are you talking about? that was mind blowing.

[infectedmushroom]

what the hell are you talking about? that was mind blowing.

Mind blowing, indeed.... I can't understand how someone can call that "pretty crap".

[sissco]

Well the beginning is pretty good yeah, but you can't say he is playing the right notes after 1.30 

[nicco]

Well the beginning is pretty good yeah, but you can't say he is playing the right notes after 1.30 

Right notes isnt everything.

[pianowolfi]

I will uplaod a vid where he totally ruins etude 8/12 

Edit:

, well...not TOTALLY ruins it but its pretty crap 

That's from the legendary Moscow concert. Of course there are wrong notes, but... Isaac Stern said that he has cried during the whole concert (which he saw on TV). And I don't think he cried because of the wrong notes.

[nortti]

I will uplaod a vid where he totally ruins etude 8/12 

Edit:

, well...not TOTALLY ruins it but its pretty crap 

That's the best interpretation of this etude I've ever heard, dude!

[sissco]

Right notes isnt everything.

Nah...if he plays the right notes it will be better uh? I mean...what the hell is he doing at 1.45 etc. bit messy 

[gruffalo]

i like all the missing notes. i think it adds to the fury. but that video does not show a lack of musicality, that is simply stunning.

Gruff

[minor9th]

I will uplaod a vid where he totally ruins etude 8/12 

Edit:

, well...not TOTALLY ruins it but its pretty crap 

I think you all have denegrated him enough...how about posting a performance where he isn't medicated?

[nicco]

I think you all have denegrated him enough...how about posting a performance where he isn't medicated?

lol, he aint medicated in that video. Although one could believe he was high on something (His own playing preferably)

[infectedmushroom]

i like all the missing notes. i think it adds to the fury. but that video does not show a lack of musicality, that is simply stunning.

Gruff

I agree with that.


So much anger and fury in this performance. I think Horowitz builds up the tense perfectly. I also like the way he slams that low B note (around 1:57 in the video). When I listen to Kissin's videoperformance of this Etude, I notice that Kissin plays that "low B note" two octaves higher (see:

)... It's just a little thing to mention though, and I really like Kissin's performance of this Etude a lot too.

[gruffalo]

i dont think anyone can beat horowitz' interpretation and performance of this piece. when it comes to hearing other people's performances of 8/12, im simply not interested.

Gruff

[dnephi]

Indescribable passion.

Horowitz claimed he played wrong notes on purpose to add dissonance and fury.

[BoliverAllmon]

still better than me.

[steveie986]

Very interesting. I'd still give up my firstborn to watch that live.

[steveie986]

But I don't understand why they still had him play when he was so messed up? With the Chopin you could still feel the Horowitzian passion, but I was speechless with the Beethoven:

[lostinidlewonder]

Have to give Horowitz some credit though. It takes a lot of balls to go on stage in the first place let alone doing it when you are not well! Most of us probably would have sat staring at middle C, drool slowly dripping from our mouths if we where medicated like poor Horowitz was that day. He still sounds amazing, wrong notes are not everything:)

[leahcim]

Have to give Horowitz some credit though. It takes a lot of balls to go on stage in the first place

Well, no, not really.

Take a look at the audition tapes for the reality shows - there's no end to the number of talented and talentless people who have zero compunction to demonstrate that by going on "stage" to perform.

So we don't give Horowitz [or anyone else] credit for walking onto a stage, but for what s/he does when they are there.

Considering that he was AIUI a wealthy man because of his playing and if someone is selling themselves as a talented muscian, indeed a concert pianist, I'd argue he deserves a bigger criticism for playing badly than someone who isn't.

Because we can find plenty of people who are ill and / or plenty of people who can't play the piano very well. There's no need for Horowitz to do that and us to say "Well he's ill, that takes balls...my Gran was never ill however hard she tried..you try being ill, it's not as easy as it looks, especially on a stage. You call that a cough? Pah! You should listen to Chopin he once gobbed a piece of phlegm the size of an orange during a concert...you call that lead poisoning...it's amateur, practise by not listening to your playing and thump at the piano until the audience is shifting in their seats with embarrassment...Beethoven was a genius the day he did that! Try to give your audience the flu! Or die by eating 'watermelon' like Liberace!'

Otherwise why bother learning the piano, just sell tickets to "man who can walk on stage...amazing! He has balls!" Sure, compared to some who can't walk on, but even though some find it difficult, it's not really a great talent.

[lung7793]

At this stage in his life I don't think he cared much how he played.  He knew he was a legend and he knew people would pay a month's paycheck to see him and applaud no matter how he did.  Maybe he didn't even know how he was playing under these drugs...if I was a performing artist and played a dreadful series of concerts after coincidentally starting a new medication, I would have stopped them after the first performance!

Still, I admire him.  I think he has had a tremendous effect on the world of piano, be it good or bad.  I don't think he was as great a technician as he was made out to be...i think he was actually quite sloppy compared to others, and he was able to get by on a relatively small repertoire compared to others.  He had his good areas and bad areas, but you have to give it to him...he survived in a very tough business to survive in for 60 years, counting a 12-year retirement, and I don't think that was by luck alone.  I find his recordings fascinating and often compare others' interpretations to his.  He gave a certain life to what he performed that I don't hear from anyone else.  Sometimes I even HATE what he does to pieces but still I keep listening to them.  I think he's the howard stern of piano performance...you may hate him, but you want to hear what he'll do next. 

[steveie986]

Howard Stern... Interesting analogy.

[lung7793]

Hehe..I just imagine him with his wife on the howard stern show giving an interview..."So, Vlad, what do you do with your wife after a big concert at Carnegie?  Do you start with talk or do you go right for the panties?"

[nicco]

he was able to get by on a relatively small repertoire compared to others. 

riiiight....

https://web.telia.com/~u85420275/repertoire.htm

[lung7793]

riiiight   well consider this is over 60+ years.  he played what he liked and i admire that about him.  it doesnt seem like you can do this anymore...you have to be able to play all of liszt's and chopin's etudes today.  my post was not out of disrespect for horowitz if you read it carefully.   

[pianowolfi]

riiiight....

https://web.telia.com/~u85420275/repertoire.htm

Gosh I wish I had that repertoire!!!I like Horowitz' playing most when he plays slow and cantabile. His cantabile and phrasing is inimitable. In fast and loud sections his tendency was often to lose control over the tone and missing up, even when he was not on medication. For instance here. Wonderful and poetic playing in the slower and softer sections, harsh sounding in some of the virtuoso parts. Nevertheless a great performance.

[letters]

this is an interesting video...

&mode=related&search=Vladimir%20Horowitz%20Piano

outtakes from a film (?)

[leahcim]

I don't think he was as great a technician as he was made out to be...i think he was actually quite sloppy compared to others

Yeah, I note Zheer's comments earlier about his hands, his own comments that he taught himself technique, and the fact that he had to have a special, extremely light action on his piano to be able to play it.

He's a bit of a Gould in that sense, perhaps.

That said, since we're talking about Horowitz did the medication prevent him being jewish or gay? [and is that the conspiracy around why the drugs were created? ]

[brewtality]

I don't think he was as great a technician as he was made out to be...i think he was actually quite sloppy compared to others

Have you heard his earliest recordings? how about the Barbirolli rach 3 and tchaik 1? In these his technique is stunning.

[donjuan]

this is an interesting video...

&mode=related&search=Vladimir%20Horowitz%20Piano

outtakes from a film (?)

gotta love that Horowitz smile!

[lung7793]

this is an interesting video...

&mode=related&search=Vladimir%20Horowitz%20Piano

outtakes from a film (?)

This is outtakes from "the last romantic"...I believe you can get it with the new unedited issue of his 1965 carnegie return.  Maybe i was being a little arbitrary w/ my comments earlier (his technique)...they were based more on the older horowitz I guess.  I haven't really heard many of his recordings pre-1940, but I love his stuff from the 40s and 50s.

[franz_]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvY-fE0fLSk

Watch this, an interview with horowitz in Japan 1983.

[nicco]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvY-fE0fLSk

Watch this, an interview with horowitz in Japan 1983.

lol! love it when the lady asks to get an autograph for the japanese audience and he just goes:

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm???

 

[ronde_des_sylphes]

Someone.. please flag the video(s) as inappropriate! What a travesty of his playing. Very sad.

[Waldszenen]

lol! love it when the lady asks to get an autograph for the japanese audience and he just goes:

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm???

 

LOL he reminds me of a nice old grandpa

[blu217]

Horowitz just wanted us to know what Beethoven and Chopin would have sounded like had they been born in the 20th century...