Life after Death?

[electrodoc]

So prometheus is certain that life after death cannot exist. (see post “Hearing Voices”). I wish that I could be as certain one way or the other but rather like Socrates I sit on the fence on this one. Either there is nothing, death being final, or there is something. There is no in between. I do not think that we could call it life – at least not in any form that we understand but perhaps the more important question is whether we retain any sort of consciousness or sense of individuality after death. One thing is certain, the energy that comprises us cannot be destroyed, only changed in form. (Second Law of Thermodynamics – Energy can neither be created nor destroyed.) Of course, most of the energy that forms our physical body will be dissipated as heat.

However, my purpose in this post is not to enter into lengthy philosophical or religious debate (although the answer to life after death would solve the religious argument one way or the other!), but rather to relate an interesting story.

In Germany there was until just a few years ago a brilliant mathematician by the name of Burkhard Heim. Many Germans believe that Heim is on a par with Stephen Hawkins. Sadly for him but maybe good for us Heim blew himself up in a laboratory explosion during the Second World War. He lost his sight together with both arms but his brain and genius remained intact.

Although I had heard of the complex mathematics of Heim and some of his theories, that was all I knew until another reputable German physicist told me that Heim had built some kind of radio with which he was able to hold a conversation with his dead father. The German physicist claimed to have witnessed this. Needless to say, I was somewhat sceptical but the thing that troubled me was why a good physicist should wish to invent such a story or to exaggerate.

Some few years later I was invited to present a paper at a conference in Germany and to my surprise and delight Heim was the key speaker at the same conference. After the first days proceedings I went to dinner to find that it was a self-service buffet and that Heim and his wife were standing next to me so naturally we got into conversation. I was invited to join them at their table where we had some interesting discussion and I had the opportunity to ask whether this rumour of the “radio” was true. Heim’s answer was rather surprising. He said that he did not know. Yes, he had built such a radio, and yes it did apparently bring the voice of his dead father but, and I quote, “I do not know whether it is his spirit or whether I am somehow picking up my own mental images of my father.”

Either way, it seemed to be a remarkable device! He then invited me to visit him at his home where I could inspect and witness the phenomenon. Unfortunately, I was not able to accept the invitation at that time but I did promise to fix a date in the following year. Sadly, he died before I was able to visit so I never did find out any more.

For anyone interested there are several books published by Heim but they are only available in German. Perhaps the most interesting is “Postmortal Zustande? Die televariante Area integrale Weltenstrukturen.” (Published by Resch ISBN 3-85-382-013-1.   Best of luck with understanding the math – it is way beyond me.

So, as I said, I sit on the fence but perhaps I am very slightly drawn to believing that there may just be some kind of existence within other dimensions. What do you think and why?

electrodoc

[gilad]

Life after death. That is a question we will absolutely never find the answer to.
There is either something or there is nothing. Whoever last spoke to sead people might be quite helpful. John Edwards? Yeah. Who knows.

[yuc4h]

Of course there is nothing after death. However, if the time is infinite, the propability tends to 1 that the atoms will rearrange themselves forming exact replica of you in some point in the future even if may be like 3*10^5343453 years from now but still it will happen assuming time has no end.

[chopininov]

Life after death. That is a question we will absolutely never find the answer to.
There is either something or there is nothing. Whoever last spoke to sead people might be quite helpful. John Edwards? Yeah. Who knows.

John Edward is a prick. He needs to let people move on. Not provide them with temporary "relief" that only makes it worse. He is slowing down the process of grieving (and evolution), and needs to stop profiting off of people's losses.

[thalbergmad]

So prometheus is certain that life after death cannot exist. (see post “Hearing Voices”). I wish that I could be as certain one way or the other but rather like Socrates I sit on the fence on this one.

I think we all have to sit on the fence on this one as it can be neither proved nor disproved.

https://www.thescoleexperiment.com/

The above might be of interest to fence sitters. The book certainly opened my eyes to the possibility of life after death.

Thal

[leahcim]

the more important question is whether we retain any sort of consciousness or sense of individuality after death.

I can't think of anything worse.

Going from 40, to, let's say, 80, or possibly even longer, seems bad enough.

I think people that believe in eternal life or life after death and our modern trend for making everyone live longer should consider what it is we're supposed to do with this time. The first 40 years has been, frankly, pretty crap on the average. The next 40 show every sign of being worse.

Some might be a bit fickle and say "But I love playing the piano and listening to music and going round to Fred's house...I could do it forever..." - which is fair enough, I'm glad they feel that way and hope they continue to.

But I'm sure I'm like many and I fall into that category of being pretty bored of what I can do standing on my head, and pretty useless at everything else. And moreso now. Learning stuff just doesn't seem to work any more. I can't play the piano, it's already at the stage where the piano is as much responsible for making my life miserable when it was supposed to be something new to do to fill the time and make it better. Picking something else just seems likely to be the same. So I might have 40 years of just jumping from one miserable failure to another as I slowly rot away. Great. Now someone wants me to live forever?

e.g What's the purpose of programming for another 30 years? None at all. Money? What for? Just to spend on sh*t that I can't play or do? All in all, it's all a pointless waste of 80 years, let alone longer. The worst thing is I'm thinking "is this how my son will feel in 30 years time" - and, if so, what a complete @#$@ I am for creating him, and giving him that.

If we have to suffer 80 years or 150? Fine, I'll have to put up with that for the sake of the bunch of people we end up surrounded by and our responsibilities etc, but this idea that we never die and it might carry on forever, it's just obscene.

I can't think of anything worse. If, for a second, I considered there was any merit to the idea, I'd want billions researching into what it actually consists of, and, given it's anything like this, what can we do to avoid it.

Now, of course, someone is going to say 'But...it won't be like this, you'll be really happy and Monday's'll be super duper and you can play the harp or piano like a pro. But then that's not me, is it? I mean, take for example Steven Fry, he's a guy that's manic depressive, and, has stated that if there was a button he could press to make his MD go away he probably wouldn't press it, because then he wouldn't be him any more.

Which is no better really. Because if I'm not me and I'm conscious etc then who am I? OTOH, if it's like reincarnation and there's no way at all of ever knowing that you used to be someone else, then you may as well have not been.

So how do the believers cope with that...are those that are going to live forever all cheerful gits or what?

[zheer]

  Life after death is wishfull thinking. Death makes life precious,we all know we have little time on earth and we value the time we spend with others more.For instance the time i spent with my grandfather before he past away were preciuos.
However the thought that we enter some other world once our time here on earth runs out and the people we will be reunited with is truly exciting,and yet wishfull thinking.
   This i can emagin,last night went bed closed my eyes,what happend in those hours of sleep i can not remember,totally blank,i believe that death is very similar.
Who knows, has anyone returnd from death and told us how great the after-life is (no).Anyway if any of you have spent time with very old people,you will know that non of them fear death.

[gyzzzmo]

I agree with Zheer, Life after Death is wishfull thinking. I think many religions are based on this: Human kind doesnt want to accept the fact theres just nothing more. We grow like any vegetable and die.
No.. People want to believe we are special, some god made us with a special task and ofcourse, heaven is only for people :p

gyzzzmo

[leahcim]

Anyway if any of you have spent time with very old people,you will know that non of them fear death.

What about their passengers?

[thalbergmad]

Well, i topped meself last night, so the fact i am writing now appears to prove it beyond doubt.

Thal