How many of you use rewards for students?

[mknueven]

I'm curious how most piano teachers on the forum reward their students.

[musicrebel4u]

I always use rewards for my students!
Due to the fact that I teach them with computerized system, we can monitor their success in exact numbers: how many mistakes they make and what is the time delaying. If they improve their score, I give them 'music money' ( I bought them in music store). If they lose, I 'charge' them fees.
After the end of lessons students can buy with the money candies or toys (party's favorites)
Here is the video of the lesson with 3 year old student, where I reward her with 'music money'.

[mike_lang]

In general, I think it is a bad idea.  The reward should become inherent, and this is impossible if stickers (or other forms of "bribery") are awarded from the beginning.  I assure you that it is not naïveté to presume, or rather to acknowledge that a child is capable of experiencing joy in music making without a material reward.  Stickers are nice and I had them when I begun taking piano, but there is a danger that they can begin to take on more importance than beautiful music making itself.

Best,

ML

[gyzzzmo]

I use stickers, mainly because i loved getting them when i was young.
I really dont think that stickers have any negative impact on the young student, since they usually OR have to play because of their parent, OR because they like it alot. In the first case you might stimulate the student to start liking playing, in the second case its just a bonus.
Praise the sticker

gyzzzmo

[m19834]

My primary responsibilities as a teacher are to pass on knowledge and to help each individual to develop their skill and understanding on the subject-matter we are covering, as well as a confidence in their ability to accomplish and demonstrate these things.  Some individuals see the value in these things right away, others grow into it over time, and still others never truly value music at all.  Each individual is unique and exactly how they value music will be as unique as they are. 

Since each individual is an entire person, it must be taken into consideration the entire environment/system within which they are being/have been raised.  I will sometimes use a system that the individual is familiar with, can relate to and/or responds to, to establish my primary responsibilites --as first mentioned-- within their life.  I will sometimes use what they currently value as a means of helping them to grow into deeper values.  I believe that doing this is "taking each individual where they are at" as an individual and, I believe that taking each individual where they are at is ultimately most effective in helping them to "voluntarily" grow and progress as individuals/musicians in what they value.

I have no qualms about stock-piling a student with skill and knowledge that they don't fully appreciate for what it is in the moment (how often do we *fully* appreciate particular aspects of our lives ?), when I can see that the knowledge and skill that they are gaining will open the doors to opportunity and experience as they mature, and that as they gain experience, they will grow in appreciation for the skills and knowledge that they have been given.  I have no qualms about being sneaky in this matter either.

[mknueven]

karli,
are you saying you do use your own system for rewards
or are you saying your teaching ability is their reward?

[gerry]

I always use rewards for my students!
Due to the fact that I teach them with computerized system, we can monitor their success in exact numbers: how many mistakes they make and what is the time delaying. If they improve their score, I give them 'music money' ( I bought them in music store). If they lose, I 'charge' them fees.
After the end of lessons students can buy with the money candies or toys (party's favorites)
Here is the video of the lesson with 3 year old student, where I reward her with 'music money'.

As a "senior citizen" of the old school, I find the above quite frightening. Do children EVER look at anything but a computer screen anymore? A far as I'm concerned, your obsession for (and apparent pride in) "exact" numbers of mistakes coupled with the mock monetary reward system puts all the wrong values on the learning process (especially at such an early, formative age) and sidesteps the establishment of any sense of pride for pride's sake. I guess time will tell, but at what price. It doesn't matter what you say or think, the computer and monetary income will let her know if she has "worth". As attentive as you seem as a teacher, it still appears as a somewhat heartless abdication of responsibility--something's missing here. It's just a further step along our descent into quantification of a noble interaction that once had "soul". Hopefully this "method" is time-limited?

[nyonyo]

I always use rewards for my students!
Due to the fact that I teach them with computerized system, we can monitor their success in exact numbers: how many mistakes they make and what is the time delaying. If they improve their score, I give them 'music money' ( I bought them in music store). If they lose, I 'charge' them fees.
After the end of lessons students can buy with the money candies or toys (party's favorites)
Here is the video of the lesson with 3 year old student, where I reward her with 'music money'.

This is girl has long spend of concentration. She must be about 3 years old.
I just wonder why the notes are shown vertically....Won't it confuse the kids?
You have tons of patience! Don't you think it is kind of too much for little kids with normal ability to be taught that long? Generally, normal kids can concentrate for about 6 to 7 min...and they have to do different activities.

[m19834]

karli,
are you saying you do use your own system for rewards
or are you saying your teaching ability is their reward?

mknueven, I am saying that the music, the skill and knowledge, and the individual's ability/confidence to demonstrate those things are the reward.  It's just a tricky path getting there sometimes.

[hyrst]

I use a multi-tiered award system. 

I teach mostly students from 3 to 9 years of age.  They need to know when they have done well - either practicing prooperly, finishing a piece, making definite progress, learning an important new skill or theory concept.  I always use praise - I believe a balance of praise and criticism are necessary to learn with motivation.

I give stars of various colours when students have achieved a reasonable level on their piece - these stars give clues about if the tempo is consistent, if the dynamics are observed, if the fingering works, etc.  I use gold when the student has played the piece at an acceptable level for what I know they are currently capable of.

I use merit cards (little print sheets) to keep a record of specific positive comments and achievements.  These cards make tangible, rather than replace, the personal satisfaction and the praise comments.   Nearly all my students love these cards, read them and put them in safe keeping - like a scrap book.  Some have a pile of over 100 - and these give them a record of what they have achieved since beginning their lessons with me.

I also have a prize system for those who want to earn 10 merits and mark this achievement with a small toy.  (I don't ever give lollies - too many complicaitons with diet and hygiene.)  I know there is an argument about detracting from the satisfaction and focus of music making - but I am talking about little  children here.  Do we really suppose many of them value and enjoy most of the hard work they put into learning lesson pieces?  And, if we work for personal satisfaction, isn't this a feeling - a motive apart from music itself?  I would then argue that it is as valid to motivate work through satisfaction and pleasure as to reward for effort.  This reward does not come without the work.  It is easier to mark the achievemnt with little children if they can see something resulting from thier work.

I am content because most of my students practice and try very hard in lessons.  Even if this is partly driven by an awards system, they are learning and trying.  They are developing skills that will enable them to enjoy music for itself, they are learning what they need to work on to achieve and they can see their progress over time because it is recorded.  Parents are really happy and impressed by the system.  It is working, do will keep using it.

[danny elfboy]

That's easy to figure out. It's a well-established principle that if you take somebody who's doing something for her or his own pleasure and offer some kind of outside reward for doing it-and let the person become accustomed to performing the task for that reward--then take the reward away, the individual will stop that activity. You can even train nursery school youngsters who love to draw pictures to stop drawing them, simply by giving them gold stars or some other little bonus for a couple of months . . and then removing that artificial "motivation".

In fact, I think that our society expects schools to get students to the point where they do things only for outside rewards. People who perform tasks for their internal reasons are hard to control. Now, I don't think that teachers get up in the morning and say to themselves, "I'm going to go to school today and take away all those young people's internal motivations" . . . but that's exactly what often happens. -John Holt-

Punished by Reward

[hyrst]

That's a very behaviourist view - and behaviourism is not the gospel in psychology these days.  I believe even children are more than conditioned machines.

[danny elfboy]

That's a very behaviourist view - and behaviourism is not the gospel in psychology these days.  I believe even children are more than conditioned machines.

There's no way that doing biased multi-factorial researches on a groups of subjects (population sample) will provide usefull extrapolation to "individuals" ... each of one is unique and is not representative of any kind of "mental standard" that just doesn't exist. Because of this simple fact psychology is full of contradictions, nonsense hypothesis, biased sociocultural and political implications and its premise of a standard psychological nature in humans (or people believed to belong to a certain group because of common secondary characteristics) has been attacked by a plethora of researches, philosophers, psychologists themselves and ex-psychologist and psychiatrists.

[hyrst]

That's exactly why I stick with what seems to work 

[dan101]

Constructive praise is the best reward.

[mknueven]

hyrst,
It sounds like you have a really well thought- out method.
It makes me think maybe I should do something like that.
I like the idea of different colors for different levels.

If it works - who can argue about the results?
thanks for your post -

I have noticed some transfer students coming to me with a lot of stickers- I
haven't used them - I never got any when I was little (My piano teacher never used them)- I was always happy when I learned a piece.  But not everyone is going to grow up and be a piano teacher -and have the intense drive needed without little rewards along the way.

[ptmidwest]

Hyrst, those merit cards sound intriguing.  Are they like little comment cards for specific points well done, or do you just write about whatever is appropriate for that student that day?  I guess I mean, are topics pre-printed?  This could be a great project for a pedagogy class, huh?

[hyrst]

Thanks guys :-)

I have mini certificates that I write the date and particular point of attention on - specifically naming the skill learnt, improvement, piece completion, or whatever. 

This has its plus and its down sides to pre-prepared cards.  It makes them highly personal and specific - they are more than just a token.  However, they do take time to complete - which can give a student a moment's rest or bore / frustrate them with waiting.  However, it is possible to time writing them appropriate for a student or just not give them to those who aren't interested in them.

I also encourage parents (I mention them in my newsletters) to read these notes.  It gives them something specific to ask about lessons and to be involved with the children's learning when they are younger.  It helps foster a positive, supportive interest in practice, goal setting and progress - at least in theory.

[mknueven]

There are also some parents who feel they need to be very involved in their studen'ts progress -which, in my experience, I don't meet too often.
But for these parents - this would really help them as well as motivating the student.

[danny elfboy]

There are also some parents who feel they need to be very involved in their studen'ts progress -which, in my experience, I don't meet too often.
But for these parents - this would really help them as well as motivating the student.

Not necessarily
When I was very young I consider the piano my personal life and I would hate my parents to intermeddle with it just for the sake of controlling my progresses which is none of their business. If my mother followed a cuisine course I wouldn't bother her by keeping on eye on her progress or whether she practices or whether she learned to cook better. She shouldn't bother me about my own personal things I understand way better than her.

[keypeg]

My son was a lot like Danny Elfboy.  However - here is a different take on motivation.  After a few years he expressed dissatisfaction but did not feel comfortable expressing it to his teacher, so I did so for him.  What did he want?  Criticism.  Can any of the teachers here see how lots of criticism can be a motivating factor for a student who truly wants to learn?  Being a student myself now, and of similar ilk, I do understand.

[danny elfboy]

Criticism.  Can any of the teachers here see how lots of criticism can be a motivating factor for a student who truly wants to learn?  Being a student myself now, and of similar ilk, I do understand.

If it is constructive of course.
I guess the point is that a teacher might either praise you or constructively criticise you but if he/she says nothing ... he/she is not caring.

A friend of mine always says "you shouldn't worry if I criticize or get disappointed or are even angry. You should worry when I don't say anything ... because it means I don't care anymore and whatever relationship there was is over"

[a-sharp]

I *don't* use candy ... only stickers, and praise. One sticker if the piece is up to MY standards... 2 if it's memorized. And appropriately-placed - "YAY!!'s" when it's due and I feel they need encouragement (which is a lot sometimes...). I just try to keep a balance of everything ... there's usually enough criticism going around, so if something deserves a huge "YAY!", I give it where it's due. Personally, I find it effective in relating to most people (of most ages)...

[keyofc]

HI - I find stickers very distracting for me to have on hand - and then if I have them in my hand - the student keeps looking at it - wondering WHEN they will get one.  I ditched them years ago - however, I do notice from other kids how they like stickers.

I also find it hard to start back up again - since one can wonder why the new person gets them and they did not!

But I found a book that I think is great - and no, I didn't write it.  Sorry to say - the author's name is not handy - but it is called "Treasures in Technique"
This book has exercizes and little songs - with a throne room at the back of the book.
As the student goes through the book and fulfills certain requirements  he can get a gold coin sticker out of the book - and then put it in the throne room, etc.

I just started using it - and have had really good results with memorization skills.
And each sticker is a different reward.  SOme for memorization, some for sightreading,
and various other things.

[pianodan]

In the long run you must nurture intrinsic motivation in the student - they must like the music that they play and feel that the time spent learning these pieces is worthwhile! Extrinsic motivation (stickers, lollies, exams, competitions, etc) should always be secondary to this (extrinsic motivation is obviously extremely useful for short periods however). As a piano teacher I feel that one of the best things that I can do to keep my students motivated is to have the largest and most extensive music libarary possible! 

[anna_crusis]

Rewards are okay as long as you keep sight of the fact that they are only a handy short term motivational aid. The simple truth is that kids get bored with them very quickly.

Stickers and other tokens will make learning more fun, but they definately won't produce any long term motivation. The desire to make music has got to be there, the relationship has got to be there and the routine has got to be there. Then the rewards are a fun little addition to sweeten the deal.

I should clarify that swinging to the other extreme and offering no rewards, tenderness or 'childish' indulgences will earn you a reputation as a 'mean grown-up' in no time flat.

[ptmidwest]

What are some good ideas that help the students make that transition from extrinsic to intrinsic motivation?  for seven-year-olds, for fifth-grade girls, for EGAD MIDDLE SCHOOL AGE?!?!?  What works for you experienced teachers?

[keypeg]

When I taught, the extrinsic motivation had killed the instrinsic motivation that is there at the beginning.  A young child learns because he wants to learn, and he has ownership of that learning.  As soon as this is rewarded and punishment, that ownership is removed.  He is no longer doing it for himself, but as a behaviour to please others.  The activity is no longer its own purpose, but a means toward a reward which becomes the reward.  Fortunately that intrinsic motivation is seldome killed off completely and a spark or curiosity usualy still exists.  In tutoring students with difficulties, I make an effort for them to understand that their curiosity to learn is ok, it does belong in the classroom, it does not belong to the teacher, and that the curiosity they have on the street is actually the "real" learning that should fuel even their academic learning.  In a sense it has been stolen from them.  Only some students manage to make the transition.

Perhaps one way to bring back the intrinsic motivation is to catch any moment of curiosity and nurture and guide it.  Intrinsic motivation by its nature is not something a teacher creates, but something that exists in a student "intrinsically".

[pianodan]

Intrinsic = I want to play the piece because something in the music "speaks", "connects to", "inspires" me.

Extrinsic = I want to play the piece to impress someone else (examiner, teacher, parent, etc)

Obviously these two factors overlap. You can judge which one should be nurtured and developed and should be your main guide when choosing repertoire...

I believe that EVERY person has some sort of affinity with music - the main problem is to find the right style of music for the individual + for these pieces to be at the right level for the student + for these pieces to be taught in an effective manner + etc + etc + etc. The best thing you can do for your students is to be constantly updating and expanding your music library. There will always be a piece to be found that a student will find rewarding. Btw, I am currently writing an article that details a "formula" for assigning pieces and motivating students (sorry for the shameless plug  ). I will post it here if anyone is interested...

PS Rewards and stickers are still great motivators - much better for encouraging good behaviour than good musicians though... I construct Machiavellian schemes to encourage regular practice and good behaviour.