What should I do to build to a Chopin Etude?

[xxmynameisjohnxx]

Okay so today I was looking at UCLA's [the school I hope to attend] requirements for transferring music majors.  The requirements for undergrad is an audition featuring 4 pieces, one baroque [I'm thinking a Bach 3 part invention? or would there be something better?], one classical [I don't know here, advice?], one Romantic [I'm currently working on Chopin's Waltz in A minor, opus 34 #2, but may choose something else], and the last requirement is an Etude by Chopin, Liszt, Scriabin, or Rachmanninoff.  I'm a big Chopin fan, so I'd prefer to learn a piece by him.  But right now I don't feel ready to tackle an Etude.  I just finished Bach's Invention 4 in D minor....which is a heck of a lot easier than an Etude.  Also the waltz I'm working on is a lot easier.  So, what pieces and exercises would you musicians who have played these Etudes suggest I do to get to that level?

Now, I'm not planning to transfer until Fall '10 which gives me plenty of time to work on getting the skills necessary to do this.  The Waltz I'm learning is proving to not be outrageously difficult, but it's definitely pushing me a lot, which is good.  I want to learn another Bach 2 part invention before starting on a 3 part, and I'm also going through a level 4 curriculum book with my teacher to really focus on my dynamics and not as much the actually playing of notes. All around, I'd say my skill is somewhere around a mid to high 5, although I don't know for sure.  I was able to learn Bach's invention 4 in dm in a little under a month to a point where I'd feel comfortable performing it.  The waltz I've been seriously working on for two weeks and am mostly through the first page....although what took me so long with that part was the playing of the septuplet over three in there.  I feel the rest will come easier, but we'll see over the next few weeks.
So, any suggestions on what I should do to make sure I'm ready in a couple years for the Etude?  Also any suggestions on exactly which Etude to learn would be appreciated....but I won't be starting it for quite some time.

Also, if you're interested in reading it, here are the list of requirements for a music major transfer in Piano, just so you can read them yourselves to make sure I didn't misunderstand anything.
https://www.music.ucla.edu/admission/Revised%20Audition%20Requirements/Piano_2005.html
Thanks in advance for any advice!

[sharon_f]

I've read some of your previous posts and I have several questions that might help in getting you the feedback and advice you need.

You state you are in a local community college music program. What kind of program is it? Are you studying applied piano or is it a general program? Are you studying with a piano teacher currently? And have you discussed your goals with him/her?

You mentioned you wanted to compose for the film industry? If so, why are you focusing on transferring to piano performance? To be honest, most colleges I know have much higher requirements for piano performance majors than say a general music degree or music education degree. Generally, to be competitive you'll need a Bach Prelude and Fugue, a substantial classical sonata (Mozart K. 333, 310...Haydn one of the later sonatas...Beethoven Op. 10, #3, Op. 26 or Op. 28 at the very minimum), a major Romantic piece (along the lines of a Chopin Ballade or Scherzo) and a "virtuoso" etude to show off your technical abilities (Chopin Op. 10, No.12 would be on the lower end of requirments.)

To get to this level from where you currently are, based on your current rep, will take two things: a very, very good teacher and huge amounts of hard work and diligent study.

If you do what to transfer to a performance program here's what I would suggest. Do a couple more 2-part inventions, get one 3-part under your belt and go directly to one of the P&Fs. Pick out your sonata now and start working on it immediately. Try another Chopin Waltz (Op. 64, #2 perhaps), then maybe try a couple of Nocturnes and maybe look at some of the late Brahms piano works (great for voicing!). Get to the Chopin Etudes by doing some carefully chosen Czerny first and then move onto Cramer. Then pick out your etude and start working slowly and carefully. (And don't forget scales and arpeggios. Nothing better for whipping your technique into shape in a hurry.)

Best of luck.

[xxmynameisjohnxx]

I've read some of your previous posts and I have several questions that might help in getting you the feedback and advice you need.

You state you are in a local community college music program. What kind of program is it? Are you studying applied piano or is it a general program? Are you studying with a piano teacher currently? And have you discussed your goals with him/her?

You mentioned you wanted to compose for the film industry? If so, why are you focusing on transferring to piano performance? To be honest, most colleges I know have much higher requirements for piano performance majors than say a general music degree or music education degree. Generally, to be competitive you'll need a Bach Prelude and Fugue, a substantial classical sonata (Mozart K. 333, 310...Haydn one of the later sonatas...Beethoven Op. 10, #3, Op. 26 or Op. 28 at the very minimum), a major Romantic piece (along the lines of a Chopin Ballade or Scherzo) and a "virtuoso" etude to show off your technical abilities (Chopin Op. 10, No.12 would be on the lower end of requirments.)

To get to this level from where you currently are, based on your current rep, will take two things: a very, very good teacher and huge amounts of hard work and diligent study.

If you do what to transfer to a performance program here's what I would suggest. Do a couple more 2-part inventions, get one 3-part under your belt and go directly to one of the P&Fs. Pick out your sonata now and start working on it immediately. Try another Chopin Waltz (Op. 64, #2 perhaps), then maybe try a couple of Nocturnes and maybe look at some of the late Brahms piano works (great for voicing!). Get to the Chopin Etudes by doing some carefully chosen Czerny first and then move onto Cramer. Then pick out your etude and start working slowly and carefully. (And don't forget scales and arpeggios. Nothing better for whipping your technique into shape in a hurry.)

Best of luck.

The local community college program is basically the first two years of a university music program.  It includes four semesters of Music theory, four semesters of performance study, four semesters of keyboard, and a few other key classes along with basic recording.  And I just found out about these requirements last night and my next lesson is on Monday, I'll discuss with my teacher on Monday. 
And I want to do music for film and video games, yes, but I'm going to apply to both the piano major and the composition major.  I'll accept either.  The requirements for the composition major are submitting three fully scored works for different instruments.  I'll probably start working on those after my current semester of Music theory is over.  I figure that even if I major in piano, it'll give ma a lot of experience in various works and styles and should make me able to compose.  But I'm applying to both majors hoping that I can get into composition.  Thanks for the advice on which pieces to choose...I didn't know if a bach 3 part would be enough, so I'll start working on more inventions  and hopefully within 6 after learning another 2 part and a 3 part I'll be able to start on a prelude and fugue. 

I think my current teacher is pretty good, but also I'm going to talk to the head of the piano department at my current school to see what he thinks I should do.  I'm fully willing to devote myself....I've proven that I can do pretty much anything if I really put my mind to it.  And I've got two years to work on it.  I currently practice all my scales four octaves and am starting to do modes as well.  With arpeggios, I can do all major and minor arpeggios and am working on dominate seventh and diminished seventh arpeggios, of course all four octaves.  Thanks for the advice! I'll talk all this over with the head of piano at my school and my private teacher and see what they think.

[thierry13]

I currently practice all my scales four octaves and am starting to do modes as well.  With arpeggios, I can do all major and minor arpeggios and am working on dominate seventh and diminished seventh arpeggios, of course all four octaves.

Great, now you have a good 1% down of what it takes to get in in performance major... that's true but I'm kinda kidding ... I think if you really get to it you've got some chances of getting in if you work hard for 2 years, and that UCLA hasn't a big piano department. I don't know if he's in LA, but I saw videos of a professor of the university of california who played the liszt sonata among other things in a recital, and it was, TRULY, ... HORRENDOUS! I understood the source of this catastrophe when he played some jazz as an encore... and he actually was "better" at that. My point is, if you're going to study piano under him, do NOT even apply, you're better off with your current teacher for sure!

[xxmynameisjohnxx]

Great, now you have a good 1% down of what it takes to get in in performance major... that's true but I'm kinda kidding ... I think if you really get to it you've got some chances of getting in if you work hard for 2 years, and that UCLA hasn't a big piano department. I don't know if he's in LA, but I saw videos of a professor of the university of california who played the liszt sonata among other things in a recital, and it was, TRULY, ... HORRENDOUS! I understood the source of this catastrophe when he played some jazz as an encore... and he actually was "better" at that. My point is, if you're going to study piano under him, do NOT even apply, you're better off with your current teacher for sure!

haha, what else should I do with scales and arpeggios?  I also make sure I play them in rhythm as in one octave quarter notes, two 8ths, threetriplets, and four 'sixteenths.  but really, once I get that down in all major and minor keys, what's next?
And I'll have to look up that teacher...he was at UCLA? That's sad.
Like I said, I'm applying to be both in composition and a piano major....I'd prefer to be in composition but I'd gladly take either.  UCLA actually has a film scoring focus so that'd be my preferred field.  No matter what though I want to build to playing Chopin Etudes and Ballades. :].

[quasimodo]

Just learn some Chopin's Etudes. Just don't start with the hardest ones. Find the scores (a lot of free legal downloads out there), listen to the whole sets and spot which ones focus on technical aspects that you're comfortable with, then just do it.

[shinerl]

Just learn some Chopin's Etudes. Just don't start with the hardest ones. Find the scores (a lot of free legal downloads out there), listen to the whole sets and spot which ones focus on technical aspects that you're comfortable with, then just do it.

for starters try. Chopin Etude Op.10 no.9

[xxmynameisjohnxx]

I haven't been on this board for awhile, but I just decide to start an Etude today.  I chose 10/12 since it's one of the easier ones, I love it musically, and it'll really work my left hand into better shape. :].
Although, depending on how this week of trying to learn it goes, I may switch to 10/6 or 10/9. Not 100% sure yet.

[etcetra]

I am not sure if its practical to do a double major with comp and performance.. like sharon said, its very demanding to be a performance major for piano.  Most schools will require 3 hrs as absolute very minimum for practice, and they usually recommend 5hrs+.  I just don't know how you will be able to manage your composition projects along with 5 hrs of practicing a day.  I guess if you are motivated enough, then by all means go for it, but its important to focus on what you want to do and not spread yourself too thin. 

You can always study piano on a side, or study with a university teacher without being a performance major.  That way you won't have to deal with the stress of having to master a chopin etude in 2 years.. I know this may be harsh but it's going to take tremendous amount of effort in order to go from bach invention to chopin etudes in 2 yrs.. maybe if you practice 10hrs a day.. you might be able to do it, but is it really worth it?

[communist]

well first of all you wont get very fall if your doing a Bach invention for the audition

[xxmynameisjohnxx]

Hahaha. The audition is in a year and a few months....I'll definitely NOT be doing a Bach invention.  I'll at the very least be doing a difficult sinfonia....but I want to be doing a P&F.