Racist threads

[ahmedito]

I have been very deeply offended by comments like:

Black people, due to their cultural heritage cant play the German classics.

Mexican people, due to their cultural heritage cant play the German classics.

Jews are real good at playing the piano.

You will find them in various places and they offend me deeply and completely. I suggest someone does something about them, since I consider them much much worse than using inapropiate languaje.

[BajoranD]

Ahmedito, this is one person being ridiculous, and probably trying to get a rise out of all of us again, because the fireworks seemed to have died down at his/er original post. What better way to get a rise out of people than to start bringing not just nationality but ethnic and cultural heritage into the mix? Sure worked on me, last time.    It's impossible to effectively debate these kinds of opinions, because I think these kinds of opinions are based on feelings instead of facts, and how do you argue against feelings? It seems to be rarely successful, or we would have a considerably smaller percentage of ridiculous people in this world. You and I, and I daresay most of the people in this forum, know that, for all the cheesiness of the saying, Music is, in fact, a universal language. S/he can wave the "I'm superior because I've got Western European training/upbringing/friends/whatever" all day long, but it won't change the fact that we, the vast majority of us, know it's a load of schnitzle. It's easier said than done, I know, but try not to let some absurd comments pull you into a fight; YOU CAN'T WIN! Willful ignorance cannot be defeated by reason.  

[ahmedito]

True, but shouldnt they be deleted, or at least given a warning? After allm one thing is to ignore these people, but I dont need to look at these kinds of posts all day.

[BajoranD]

You have a point.

[donjuan]

strange, I havent noticed any racist threads for te time I have been here....  We have talked about differences in cultures and genders, in music, but i havent really seen anything really offensive.

[Tash]

yeah neither have i. and i don't believe culture/race/blah has anything to do with your ability to play. if that were the case then we might as well just restrict ourselves to playing compositions from our own country (and wouldn't that be fun, i'd be playing crazy 20th century australian compositions which is fun but not all the time please!) if you want to play music from europe then do so cos you'll probably be able to play it incredibly well. in the end, people all derive from the same country (supposedly africa according to prehistorians)

[Fastzuernst]

Yes,
Without naming names (you know who you are) I have found that some are making racist claims based on broad generalizations such as (and I quote). "asians play a certain way"
I am asian, in fact most of us are all asians if you believe that our civilizations came from the tigris and euphrates river. (gee isn't that Iraq!)
O yea , Iraqis are ASIAN too!

[willcowskitz]

Political correctness implies that the surface is more important than the content, that words define people and that superstitions can be removed by rewriting the dictionary. That, if anything, is alarming - Not the "inaccurate" vocabulary used when speaking of certain race or their abilities. There ARE differences between physics of different races of humans, why would anyone get offended from that kind of statement, there is nothing negative in itself but yet if I named one certain race the PC people would call me a racist. If I call my friend (yes I have a Somalian friend) a nîgger and he gets offended, it is because he was taught to get offended. On the other hand, if that person had lived during the period of slavery, he might have learnt the negative effect from association from the word to the inferiour position. And that has got nothing to do with my possible use of the word "nîgger". People who actively fight against political incorrectness really need some real purpose for their lives so they could stop looking for substitutes such as this particular mission to suppress verbal self-expression to fit within some universal norms.

"If you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use the words."
--Philip K. Dick

Who's to decide what they mean? Who's to decide their intent? Violence takes two: The offender and the victim. Do you want to be victims?

[donjuan]

yes! now THAT makes sense!!  Great ideas and excellent support to back it up.

[kulahola]

Political correctness implies that the surface is more important than the content, that words define people and that superstitions can be removed by rewriting the dictionary. That, if anything, is alarming - Not the "inaccurate" vocabulary used when speaking of certain race or their abilities. There ARE differences between physics of different races of humans, why would anyone get offended from that kind of statement, there is nothing negative in itself but yet if I named one certain race the PC people would call me a racist. If I call my friend (yes I have a Somalian friend) a nîgger and he gets offended, it is because he was taught to get offended. On the other hand, if that person had lived during the period of slavery, he might have learnt the negative effect from association from the word to the inferiour position. And that has got nothing to do with my possible use of the word "nîgger". People who actively fight against political incorrectness really need some real purpose for their lives so they could stop looking for substitutes such as this particular mission to suppress verbal self-expression to fit within some universal norms.

"If you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use the words."
--Philip K. Dick

Who's to decide what they mean? Who's to decide their intent? Violence takes two: The offender and the victim. Do you want to be victims?

your statement is racist. "race" is not a scientific concept. there groups of people who have some physical similarities due to geography and politics (people having sex together in a limites space make babies looking alike after a long period of time).

[JK]

People who insist on being pc all the time annoy me. Polictical correctness has a tendancy to suggest that everyone is exactly the same when they are not. Everyone is different. Of course there are differences between different races of people, this has a lot to do with cultural difference. What should be realised is that everyone is equal, but not the same. A statement that discriminates negatively against a group of people or a particular race is racist, however an observation made about a charecteristic of a particular race or group of people that is generally true and that has a basis for being said is not. If you say that asians play a certain way, of course this is a generalisation but why is this offensive? It isn't saying anything negative and it isn't implying that Asians have any less skill at playing the piano. It is obvious that this is a generalisation that has been made from a persons' personal experience. It is kind of like saying that German composers have certain characterstics in their works such as strict counterpoint etc. This is another generalisation, it doesn't say anything negative about a Germans' ability to compose but is just a general observation. I wish that people would realise that people from different cultures ARE different and that they DO have certain characteristics due to cultural traditions. Of course there are many exceptions but general observations about these characteristics in my opinion are not racist.

[ahmedito]

so in that case...

"Mexicans can never become piano virtuosos because they do not have the same background."

or

"Asians cannot express anything when they play because it is not usual in their culture."

are both only generalizations made from a particular persons experience, and should not be taken offensively.

BUT

"Mexicans are a less intelligent than western europeans" (however you want to justify)

or

"Black people can not be as good as europeans at any activity that requires logic"

are racist.

I dont see the difference. This is not about political correctness (which is a term unheard of here in Mexico). I dont care if you say Im Mexican or if you say that Mexico is a third world country. But if you make offensive generalizations based only on race and nationality, implying that in todays globalized world we are at a disadvantage because of our genes or lack of contact with others (some people seem to think Mexico is a couple of villages stuck in a jungle somewhere), then that IS a racist ignorant comment.

I do not wish for "political correctness", but I do not wish to be insulted merely for my race or nationality. That is racism; although you can call it generalization for all I care.

[JK]

so in that case...

"Mexicans can never become piano virtuosos because they do not have the same background."

or  

"Asians cannot express anything when they play because it is not usual in their culture."  

are both only generalizations made from a particular persons experience, and should not be taken offensively.  

BUT

"Mexicans are a less intelligent than western europeans" (however you want to justify)

or  

"Black people can not be as good as europeans at any activity that requires logic"  

are racist.  

I dont see the difference. This is not about political correctness (which is a term unheard of here in Mexico). I dont care if you say Im Mexican or if you say that Mexico is a third world country. But if you make offensive generalizations based only on race and nationality, implying that in todays globalized world we are at a disadvantage because of our genes or lack of contact with others (some people seem to think Mexico is a couple of villages stuck in a jungle somewhere), then that IS a racist ignorant comment.  

I do not wish for "political correctness", but I do not wish to be insulted merely for my race or nationality. That is racism; although you can call it generalization for all I care.

I wish people would read what I wrote properly! I was not saying that generalisations aren't racist, far from it. In fact I was very clear and deliberately said the following:

A statement that discriminates negatively against a group of people or a particular race is racist,

I was trying to point out that there ARE differences between the playing styles of different races. These differences are not always there and are not always obvious but they are generalisations which if taken as such are true.

so in that case...

"Mexicans can never become piano virtuosos because they do not have the same background."

or  

"Asians cannot express anything when they play because it is not usual in their culture."  

are both only generalizations made from a particular persons experience, and should not be taken offensively.  

I'm sorry but I don't understand why you're saying this to me. Not once in my post did I say that statements like these are acceptable or true. I was very deliberate in wording my post carefully so it wouldn't be taken the wrong way. I also wasn't suggesting that the people who started this thread were being too pc, I agree that some of the generalisations made are racist, I was actually partly replying to Wilcowskitz.

I dont care if you say Im Mexican or if you say that Mexico is a third world country. But if you make offensive generalizations based only on race and nationality, implying that in todays globalized world we are at a disadvantage because of our genes or lack of contact with others (some people seem to think Mexico is a couple of villages stuck in a jungle somewhere), then that IS a racist ignorant comment.

Again I sincerely hope this isn't directed towards me, if it is then I see no reason what so ever for it. Not once did I mention Mexico and not once did I say that offensive generalisations were acceptable at any point. All I was trying to do is to point out that not all generalisations are racist and offensive, some are naturally true up to a point due to cultural difference. I personally couldn't care less where someone comes from, this has no affect what so ever on their abilities and I never questioned this.

[ahmedito]

JK, my post was not directed at you at all. I merely want to defend my position in front of people who either wont accept racism for what it is or simply want to think that I am some PC nut.

The rest of you can go on debating the true nature of racism and political correctness, the diferences that exist between cultures when playing and the social causes and implications. I dont care. My point is, if I see a post that says Mexicans cant become virtuosos because of their cultural surroundings, I will consider it offensive, because its just as insulting as saying Mexicans are not as intelligent as everyone else, or in other words: Ahmedito, you are an idiot because you are mexican. If a generalization is based solely on race and nationality (and many times on ignorance) and it is offensive, then I consider it insulting.

[willcowskitz]

My point is, if I see a post that says Mexicans cant become virtuosos because of their cultural surroundings, I will consider it offensive, because its just as insulting as saying Mexicans are not as intelligent as everyone else, or in other words: Ahmedito, you are an idiot because you are mexican. If a generalization is based solely on race and nationality (and many times on ignorance) and it is offensive, then I consider it insulting.

Maybe you should consider it stupid. Is there a reason not to? Become untouchable today! Limited offer.


kulahola

[JK]

JK, my post was not directed at you at all. I merely want to defend my position in front of people who either wont accept racism for what it is or simply want to think that I am some PC nut.

ok, sorry for the misunderstanding!

[ahmedito]

If it is a single person who posts a racist comment. I ignore completely that person, but when a post like that has 4 or 5 different followups from different people who agree, then I feel it is my responsibility to complain and stand up for what I believe. You cant complain about a problem if you are doing nothing to stop it.

[willcowskitz]

Alright, I understand.

The way to go is to ridicule the idiotic inward misconceptions quickly, "just passing by laughing my ass off", then move onto the actual subject if there is any, knowing what kind of remarks really deserve your attention. It is much more powerful than just coming out with the "I've been used" expression on face, asking pertinent questions from inpertinent people.

[ahmedito]

heh... good point.

What really gets me is that my english is not as good, and I cant post in spanish, so I usually cant write long thoughtful responses, because I have a hard time explaining myself... I usually take a long time to write even short answers like this one.

[Fastzuernst]

I am amazed that so many are defending this profiling of different races. I understand that it simply comes for ignorance and lack of world view. I believe it the comment about "asians" not playing musically is an attemped to belittle a group in order to build up this person's ego.
Most of us learn in grade school that this is how we make ourselves feel better about ourselves. Hopefully, as we get older we realize that it is us who is the fool.
I am under the impression that most of the offenders are young and are still in their grade school mentality. Please, grow up.

[donjuan]

I am amazed that so many are defending this profiling of different races. I understand that it simply comes for ignorance and lack of world view. I believe it the comment about "asians" not playing musically is an attemped to belittle a group in order to build up this person's ego.
Most of us learn in grade school that this is how we make ourselves feel better about ourselves. Hopefully, as we get older we realize that it is us who is the fool.
I am under the impression that most of the offenders are young and are still in their grade school mentality. Please, grow up.

you grow up!  Look around you!!  We see examples of natural selection everywhere we go- people are not equal in the way they do anything.  For example, why are there so many homeless aboriginals on the street?  Please, explain your position better, as I am young and you would probably say I have grade school mentality.
donjuan

[wintervind]

You continue to prove my point

[wintervind]

I meant to say "the" point, which I agree with wholeheartedly

[willcowskitz]

For example, why are there so many homeless aboriginals on the street?  Please, explain your position better, as I am young and you would probably say I have grade school mentality.

I reckon you're talking about people who have lived lives very different from ours, closer to nature. Well, the most obvious explanation would be, that they haven't adapted to the modern society system. Not that they couldn't, they just didn't have time and whatever they were good at before became obsolote for the new machinery, which is sad.

However, I don't know who Fastzuernst was talking to in the above post. I didn't see anyone defending "profiling of races", it could be that she had problems understanding written text or it was just another "I've always wanted to say 'Grow up!' to someone" case. What comes to world view, I was being politically correct last when I was 10-13, then I grew out of superficial communication and started to judge for myself what I can say, and HOW to say it. No matter what words will be forced off people's vocabulary, superstitions and generalization will not cease to exist, they will just be wiped under the carpet instead of cleaning them. And on the surface - everything looks good and the PC people are happy.

[Rob47]

"Its our differences that make the world worth living in.."
- Stan from South Park

[Spatula]

strange, I havent noticed any racist threads for te time I have been here....  We have talked about differences in cultures and genders, in music, but i havent really seen anything really offensive.

We aren't aiming to be Nazis or anything (well for an asian like myself any ways)

Students like Don Juan may have experienced in his perspective for example why GENERALLY Asians somehow preform "better" at competitions etc (There is a topic regarding this about 3 months ago).

As a matter of fact, He doesn't want to start fighting or whatever but is curious and wants to see what others may have witnessed.  

Personally, it doesn't really matter what gender or race a person is.  It just matters if they perhaps grew up with a musical background or are a prodigy child etc.

[donjuan]

We aren't aiming to be Nazis or anything (well for an asian like myself any ways)

Students like Don Juan may have experienced in his perspective for example why GENERALLY Asians somehow preform "better" at competitions etc (There is a topic regarding this about 3 months ago).

As a matter of fact, He doesn't want to start fighting or whatever but is curious and wants to see what others may have witnessed.  

Personally, it doesn't really matter what gender or race a person is.  It just matters if they perhaps grew up with a musical background or are a prodigy child etc.

Yes Spatula, Exactly! But, I dont think they perform better-- At times I have experienced students who IN GENERAL are asian who play like they dont know what the music means, they tend to sit down and type it out like their parents apparently force them to do at home.  I think IN GENERAL what asians do well is efficiently learn how to mechanically be able to produce the right sounds from the piano, but IN GENERAL I would say they have difficulty making music.

Is anyone going to slap me now?

[wintervind]

I would say it has less to do with race and more to do with how someone is taught. I would be careful to say that just because someone is of Asian decent that they are automaticly predisposed to playing a certain way. Now that generalization, in my mind, is nothing but racist. It is simply not true that Asian peoples cannot play musically. It is the education that one recieves which contributes to a lack of musicality, in my opinion.

[csharpminor]

Agreed.  

And also, traditional Asian music is very different from Western Classical, so if one grows up listening to ethnic music, etc., then s/he might have a hard time adapting.  But if not (if anyone were only exposed to Classical), they'd play just as "musically" under the right instruction as everyone else.  And this applies to most people...(so even if you weren't of a certain ethnicity, etc., and you listened to that style of music, you would still be used to that style)...I may or may not make sense, but...oh well.

[wintervind]

You do make sense!

[donjuan]

yeah, that makes sense to me now as well.  I guess I should at the reasons behind my experiences first.

[cysoto]

in the end, people all derive from the same country (supposedly africa according to prehistorians)

Tash,

I believe that you are referring to the continent of Pangaea; the Mother Continent that broke into pieces and gave “life” to all other Continents, as we know them today.  Not Africa.  But since we don’t know exactly where or when modern mankind (Homo Sapiens) originated, I guess Africa is a good guess.

I also think that you meant to write “Anthropologists” not pre-historians, which would be people that lived in a time period before recorded history. 

[cysoto]

Hey Tash,

Don't get angry, I'm just being a Wise-A$$

[Daniel_piano]

I don't think there is any different in how two difference races play the piano
If the piano is made with your arms, your tendons and your neuro connections then there's no different between an Asian, African, European or New Zelander tendons, neuro connections or arms
Better yet, it's the thread about the difference between men and women
There no group difference and people are individuals and individuals are all different
So, an Asian can be full of musicality or play like a robot, he can be dedicated or lazy, he can be passionate or dry
The same for an Italian, French, African, Spanish, Mexicans
They are individual people with individual esperiences and individual personality
It's not their nationality or race that make them different
I've know a lot of people also because I've relatives all over the world, I've met people in France, Sweden, Poland, Slovachia, Guinea Bissau, Nigery, Marocho, Canada and I know lot of Japanese, Chinese and Austrialians, Bulgarians, Spanish and Argentinian
And I have notived a thing, there's no a stereotypated way in which they react, think or beahave they are all different one from the others liek the difference between all the England people, France people or USA people
I've found all the possible different personalities of this world in a lot of people from the same country as just because they has the same nationality and the same race it didn't mean they were similar, it didn't mean they had similar ideas or political theories, it didn't mean they has similar wasy to espress their emotions and it surely didn't mean they played or singed in the same way
We're all different and unique not as etnich group but as individuals
Never seen a strict difference from a Mexican and a French as each Mexican adn each French is already different from the other people of the same nationality
So, we're all equal as populations in the way we're each different from the other member of the same group we're supposed to belong to: etnich group or race group
In fact my cousin is my same race, we've the same blood, we've same physical features, we live in the same country, we live in the same region, we live in the same city yet we're completely different, he has a completely different personality and we're alike only in our nationality but for all the rest we're the opposite
So generalization is just generalization, always, it is just the result from stereotypes one sees on movies but never experience on his/her own

Daniel

[Cecin_Koot]

This is enough.  If everyone played the piano the same the world would be a boring place.  But many people play the piano differently, this is becuase they were teached this way or heard this way threout their childhood.  But this does not meant that an entire group cannot play the same as another group, personaly, I love all kinds of music exept for rap.  And I like to play all music, whether they are sonatas, jazz solos, or blues chord progressions.  And I think anyone can play music differently if they really want to.  But most people are happy with their culture style, and don't want to play differntly.  In Australia, we play all kinds of music, whether it is classical baroque, romantical, traditional, national, popular: jazz, blues, ballads, pop, 60s, 70s, 80s, rock...    The list goes on and on, so that is what I believe

[Op. 1 No. 2]

Jews are real good at playing the piano.

Well, actually, a lot of good pianists and composers are jewish.

[Daniel_piano]

This is enough.  If everyone played the piano the same the world would be a boring place.  But many people play the piano differently, this is becuase they were teached this way or heard this way threout their childhood.  But this does not meant that an entire group cannot play the same as another group, personaly, I love all kinds of music exept for rap.  And I like to play all music, whether they are sonatas, jazz solos, or blues chord progressions.  And I think anyone can play music differently if they really want to.  But most people are happy with their culture style, and don't want to play differntly.  In Australia, we play all kinds of music, whether it is classical baroque, romantical, traditional, national, popular: jazz, blues, ballads, pop, 60s, 70s, 80s, rock...    The list goes on and on, so that is what I believe

Well said
Groups don't exist
I've never seen a cultural and national group where each person belonging to the group is the same like the others
All French people are different from ech other, all Swedish people are different from each other, all Spanish people are different from each other, all Asian people are different from each other .... and all male are different from each others and all female are different from each others
And in the case you didn't know:
all children are different from each others, all kids are different from each others, all adults are different from each others, all seniors are different from each others

Age, nationality, race, language, gender are all arbitrary characteristics
And you can't predict anything from the personality and abilities of a person just by looking and arbitrary characteristics

Daniel

[anda]

I have been very deeply offended by comments like:

Black people, due to their cultural heritage cant play the German classics.

Mexican people, due to their cultural heritage cant play the German classics.

Jews are real good at playing the piano.

You will find them in various places and they offend me deeply and completely. I suggest someone does something about them, since I consider them much much worse than using inapropiate languaje.

i have just seen this thread - so (late...).
We have a joke over here:
Q: you know why are jews good at playing the piano?
A: cause they practice

[dinosaurtales]

Seems to me if somebody wants to make a broad generalization about the way people of a certain "race" play the piano, the statement speaks for itself.  If I see a post like that I just click on by and ignore it.

[Siberian Husky]

im mexican...i didnt get the memo about not obtaining the essential element in order for me to play german classics...thats probably because my english is bad due to my established inefriority to the europeans...or maybe i did get the memo..but accidentally mistaken it for a tortilla to wrap my burrito.....lol....humans make me laugh

[Altazor]

Hi Fernandito just to let you know that immediately after I saw this post I remembered another post from you, the title is:


Im scared stupid

and this is a fragment from one of your replies:

The audience was really quiet, which is rare here in Mexico... I also didn't start till everyone got settled down, which was strange to many that got there late.
Bach and Mozart were OK... no too bad..

So you are saying Mexicans are not quiet during performances... you are not judging people in general, you are judging Mexicans.

I'm also a Mexican living in México and yes, we use the term "politically correct" very often... "politicamente correcto".

I do think that certain groups have certain natural abilities different of other groups of people, or maybe they like to do things in a different way, for example, just watch any sports and you will immediately and inevitably will start categorizing and grouping them according to their biological or geographical origin. Of course if I am going to make a comment about it I only do it if it is a positive one - I try to be politically correct-.

[ahmedito]

Audiences in Mexico are rarely quiet is a racist statement according to you?!!

sheesh....

Its not an ignorant, broad generalization. It just comes from the fact that after living here for 20 years, and having been to a great many concerts, audiences here are rarely quiet. Now that Im living in Madrid, Ive noticed that the audiences here are also quite noisy, because most of the audience is made up of elderly people, and they cough a lot and very loudly....

ummm.... I really dont see why that is racist though. Considering this kind of thing racist is just stupid, and makes us people who point out real racism look like complete exagerating freaks.

Compare:

Mexicans cant play the piano, because they do not have the same cultural background as europeans.

and

The audience was quiet, which is rare here in Mexico.

..... I think that eventually people will always get to a point where saying something is racist is very very stupid. The first statement insults me. The second one does not, and I cant imagine someone being insulted by it.

[hodi]

Jews are real good at playing the piano.

i would say this about the russians.. they are all great pianists,compoers,mathematicians,physicists...

[Altazor]

quote author=Fernandito link=topic=3781.msg66305#msg66305 date=1107420629]
Audiences in Mexico are rarely quiet is a racist statement according to you?!!

sheesh....

Dear Fernandito, with all due respect, you didnīt get the point, or maybe I failed to explain with all clarity my point of view.

Now to ensure that will not happen again, lets start analyzing your comment on racist threads:

I have been very deeply offended by comments like:

Black people, due to their cultural heritage cant play the German classics.

Mexican people, due to their cultural heritage cant play the German classics.

Jews are real good at playing the piano.

The first two are negative and the 3rd one is positive, so according to your examples it doesnīt matter if the comment is negative or positive, if it is judging someone according to his race, then it is a racist comment, am I correct?

Well if you follow that rule, the one you set with your own examples, then your comment about Mexicans not being quiet -when they should, I must add- is racist, either if you intended it to be a positive or negative comment. Its not my opinion, it is actually yours, but only if you try to be consistent with your previously posted words.

Compare:

Mexicans cant play the piano, because they do not have the same cultural background as europeans.

and

The audience was quiet, which is rare here in Mexico.

..... I think that eventually people will always get to a point where saying something is racist is very very stupid. The first statement insults me. The second one does not, and I cant imagine someone being insulted by it.

mmmm.... do you really think Jews feel insulted when someone says "Jews are real good at playing the piano"? I think not, nevertheless you used it as an example of a racist comment.

Its not an ignorant, broad generalization. It just comes from the fact that after living here for 20 years, and having been to a great many concerts, audiences here are rarely quiet.

The only point you are making with that statement is that you have 20 years of experience to support your racist -under your own definition- comment. Or are you trying to say that if a person has a certain knowledge to support what he is saying, then the comment is no longer to be considered racist?

If you are trying to say that then every sports coach that says that black people are better than white in sports is not being racist.

If thatīs true, then you should also consider the opinions of the piano experts, who have listened to hundreds of recordings, have had lessons with many teachers and students of different origins and after lets say "20 years of experience : ) " have been able to distinguish the different styles and capabilities of pianist according to their origins, and not tag them as racist. But then again, this is only if you want to honor your own words, or you may as most people do, just forget your own words and make up some new ones just to try to prove your point. 

ummm.... I really dont see why that is racist though. Considering this kind of thing racist is just stupid, and makes us people who point out real racism look like complete exagerating freaks.

Now donīt get me wrong, I donīt really care about racist posts, I mean, why should my eyes burn when I see someone saying that Mexicans cant play German music?, come on... I have heard the same silly comment coming from Mexicans saying that Europeans cant play Latin music cause they donīt have Latin blood running through their veins... so what? if i donīt like the comment, I can reply to it, and share my opinion about it. Thatīs what a forum is about, isnīt it?

True, but shouldnt they be deleted, or at least given a warning? After allm one thing is to ignore these people, but I dont need to look at these kinds of posts all day.

Now, if you really want to continue your crusade against racism then I advise you move from the path of removing freedom of expression -which always leads to something worse- and to take the more fruitful road of basing your statements with carefully thought arguments, donīt just yell for censorship, if you donīt like some oneīs opinion tell them why, and if this time you donīt contradict your self so much, you might actually accomplish something.

Oh, and by the way, iīve found a great site for you:

https://www.intrepidsoftware.com/fallacy/toc.php

Itīs stephenīs guide to fallacies... i think the best way to improve your logic skills is to learn to identify fallacies -its also helps you to not make a fool of your self when you say some one elses opinion is "stupid" without even knowing what he is talking about-

Saludos 

[Motrax]

I do find the statement that Jews are good at piano to be rather distateful (I'm Jewish, by the way).  It attributes the success of many successful Jewish pianists solely to their race, ignoring all the hard work and discipline these people put into their trade. It's a stereotype no matter what light it portrays people in.

[iwy42]

Motrax wrote:

I do find the statement that Jews are good at piano to be rather distateful (I'm Jewish, by the way).  It attributes the success of many successful Jewish pianists solely to their race, ignoring all the hard work and discipline these people put into their trade. It's a stereotype no matter what light it portrays people in.

I completely agree.