New E-book/print book about practicing

[lostinidlewonder]

There's no evidence that "the forum moderators do not mind it."

"No evidence" implies that there is absolutely nothing to be found that shows that they have put up with these posts but this is an incorrect assumption. I wonder why then I can see a number of pages on pianostreet which exist that the original poster is advertising some product, some are quite old as well and have not been removed yet the moderators will remove what they deem inappropriate posts very quickly.

This forum does not belong to any of us who signed up to be a member so why do we think we have to moderate if someone posts advertising spam?

[perfect_pitch]

I just hit the "report" button. (And this happens very rarely!!) And then it's up to Nils and his crew to decide.

I avoided doing that for a while, because I reported pages like scp's pages and a few others and they rarely ever got taken down after being reported, but since I've seen very little of scp - maybe nils is finally getting this forum under control.

Of course we as musicians need "self promotion"!

Yes... but to sign up to a forum for the SOLE PURPOSE of blatant advertising which is what gret49 seems to have done over different areas of the forum - that's shameful. We don't need it.

And even you should be able to agree with that. If you establish a reputation as a friend, someone who people listen to, and trust - then maybe you can ask them to have a look and see what they think about a certain product before posting over the forum... but there have been an increase of people just signing up and posting their crap and then leaving.

It's not on.

[lostinidlewonder]

Yes... but to sign up to a forum for the SOLE PURPOSE of blatant advertising which is what gret49 seems to have done over different areas of the forum - that's shameful. We don't need it.

I agree it is shameful and they do it to themselves so we don't have to do much else. Most of us will realize that the poster is merely advertising their ware, most people here are not interested in that they are here just to read about music and not spend any money.

Perhaps a few members or guests who browse the website will be interested, the advertiser only need to attract one buyer for it to be profitable for them. But these type of buyers are usually those who do not have any idea what they want in the first place and have too much disposable income to play with. Spamming is a very scatter gun advertising technique which results in no sales most of the times. The spammer has to post in thousands and thousands of places so they can make a sale, that is how they survive and a reason why their product actually is quite weak. If you have a good product you do not need to spam, spamming waste your time if you are doing it yourself there are much better places to spend your time in promoting your product. I notice products which are spammed online are often weak products and merely make sales from the millions of spamming attempts that they shoot out and their only buyers are uninformed people with too much money to waste.

[avguste]

I agree it is shameful and they do it to themselves so we don't have to do much else. Most of us will realize that the poster is merely advertising their ware, most people here are not interested in that they are here just to read about music and not spend any money.

Perhaps a few members or guests who browse the website will be interested, the advertiser only need to attract one buyer for it to be profitable for them. But these type of buyers are usually those who do not have any idea what they want in the first place and have too much disposable income to play with. Spamming is a very scatter gun advertising technique which results in no sales most of the times. The spammer has to post in thousands and thousands of places so they can make a sale, that is how they survive and a reason why their product actually is quite weak. If you have a good product you do not need to spam, spamming waste your time if you are doing it yourself there are much better places to spend your time in promoting your product. I notice products which are spammed online are often weak products and merely make sales from the millions of spamming attempts that they shoot out and their only buyers are uninformed people with too much money to waste.

On this we will have to agree to disagree.
Having a good product means absolutely nothing without 24/7 promotion.
Potential clients, listeners, presenters have to know about you, about your product. And hoping on someone noticing you doesn't work.

[stevebob]

Conversely, even a good product can be tainted by "24/7 promotion" by dint of overexposure ... plus the presumption that anything that good wouldn't need to be pushed so aggressively.

I know nothing about marketing, though it must be obvious that various tactics can be expected to succeed—or not—with different people.  Everybody must have had the experience of going into retailers and having vastly differing experiences.  I loathe being subjected to a high pressure hard sell, even though the salesperson who employs those tactics might technically be the most successful.

[lostinidlewonder]

On this we will have to agree to disagree.
Having a good product means absolutely nothing without 24/7 promotion.
Potential clients, listeners, presenters have to know about you, about your product. And hoping on someone noticing you doesn't work.

Internet spamming is a low form of scatter gun advertising. There seriously is a lot better marketing tools at your disposal and spamming the internet is a highly inefficient way in exposing your product, it is also time consuming and adds to the green house waste that spam causes. Time is money and spamming the internet highlights that the person providing the product has too much time on their hands and do not understand how to use their time effectively. If you know how to market yourself properly you will not use spamming on the internet since you will not have enough time to do it because you are so busy with proper marketing methods. I have to say the bot spammers however get some success but you have to sell an amazing promise, sex or drugs for that, piano stuff just doesn't work lol

[pianowolfi]

I avoided doing that for a while, because I reported pages like scp's pages and a few others and they rarely ever got taken down after being reported, but since I've seen very little of scp - maybe nils is finally getting this forum under control.

Yes... but to sign up to a forum for the SOLE PURPOSE of blatant advertising which is what gret49 seems to have done over different areas of the forum - that's shameful. We don't need it.

And even you should be able to agree with that. If you establish a reputation as a friend, someone who people listen to, and trust - then maybe you can ask them to have a look and see what they think about a certain product before posting over the forum... but there have been an increase of people just signing up and posting their crap and then leaving.

It's not on.

Yes sure I agree. I wrote the above post mainly because I have had the impression that many people are complaining but nobody reports anything. And I have reported such a spam recently and Nils reacted immediately.

[furtwaengler]

I don't know what will happen to this thread, if it will be deleted or not, but that it has broken into such an interesting conversation may give it value to stay. I guess with anything people attempt to sell here, it has to compete with the volumes of free advice already available from contributing members anyway.

[perfect_pitch]

I don't know what will happen to this thread, if it will be deleted or not, but that it has broken into such an interesting conversation may give it value to stay.

True - but now that most of us have read it - I say delete it and lets rid ourselves of the shameless promotion that gret49 tried to spew upon us.

[thalbergmad]

Never buy from spammers

Thal

[thalbergmad]

but that it has broken into such an interesting conversation may give it value to stay.

I hope it does, this needs to be aired openly.

Thal

[avguste]

Self management, self promotion is a wonderful subject to discuss. many methods to share, many ways to do business.
It is a discussion which should be done as often as possible. And as far as I am concerned, it is a subject which should be taught at all universities

[viking]

Self management, self promotion is a wonderful subject to discuss. many methods to share, many ways to do business.
It is a discussion which should be done as often as possible. And as far as I am concerned, it is a subject which should be taught at all universities

Career management classes are becoming more popular at many north american schools.

In any case, having only read about a third of the thread (which was very much entertaining!) I agree with those who think that there is definitely more to life as a professional pianist than sitting in a practice room.  What other profession is ever successful in isolation?  If our goal is to share whatever we feel is worth sharing why not get the word out to as many people as possible by any means?

[rmbarbosa]

Auguste,
 you say "my business" all time! Music is not business, even when one is a professional player. But I accept your need of self-promotion.
As I do understand Thal and his "rage". I do feel like him. Forum is to help the others, not for spam. Or for self-promotion.
Best wishes
rui

[thalbergmad]

As I do understand Thal and his "rage".

Thanks, I know I get angry easy and need to chill sometimes, but I always thought this forum was a place for help and discussion.

Now, we have yet another "rocketpiano" spam and more of some strange Russian pianist who has arms like Popeye, looks like Olive Oyl and plays like Bluto.

Thal

[avguste]

Auguste,
 you say "my business" all time! Music is not business, even when one is a professional player. But I accept your need of self-promotion.
As I do understand Thal and his "rage". I do feel like him. Forum is to help the others, not for spam. Or for self-promotion.
Best wishes
rui

Actually, contrary to what many may think, just being able to play is not enough in my opinion. One has to be able to do business, to promote one self.
And for those of us that are professionals, we make our living with it, it is our business. Maybe not in the sense of owning a front store, but it is still a.

[stevebob]

I don't presume to speak for all non-professionals, but "just being able to play" is absolutely enough for me.

[thalbergmad]

I would willingly settle for "just being able to play"

Thal

[birba]

I would willingly settle for "just being able to play"

Thal

Tell me about it...

[demimondegirl]

This in my opinion is really old and outdated.
In this day and age, there is no better way to promote one self than self-promotion.

 

I'm sorry, I completely agree with you in spirit, but what you actually wrote there seems like classic unintentional humor!!! Unless...

...you're not by any chance Yogi Berra, are you?

[furtwaengler]

I'm sorry, I completely agree with you in spirit, but what you actually wrote there seems like classic unintentional humor!!! Unless...

...you're not by any chance Yogi Berra, are you?

Hahaha! Yes!

[rmbarbosa]

I`m a medical doctor. It`s "my job". But many times I spent my money giving it to my patients when I know they dont have money to buy drugs I prescribe ou to make tests. It`s "my job" but, between medical doctors, it is not well accepted to promote ourselves. For us publicity is forbidden. And when I see some professional fellows in TV, por example, I feel like Thal.
I play piano also. I give concerts. But I dont promote myself. My only "promotion" is trying to do my best, in medicine and in Music. If I`m really good, I certainly have more concerts and more patients.
But it`s true, I dont need music to pay my home, my food, etc... so, I understand you, August.
All the best to you. And to our friend Thal, one of the best of us here in this forum, I believe.

[avguste]

I`m a medical doctor. It`s "my job". But many times I spent my money giving it to my patients when I know they dont have money to buy drugs I prescribe ou to make tests. It`s "my job" but, between medical doctors, it is not well accepted to promote ourselves. For us publicity is forbidden. And when I see some professional fellows in TV, por example, I feel like Thal.
I play piano also. I give concerts. But I dont promote myself. My only "promotion" is trying to do my best, in medicine and in Music. If I`m really good, I certainly have more concerts and more patients.
But it`s true, I dont need music to pay my home, my food, etc... so, I understand you, August.
All the best to you. And to our friend Thal, one of the best of us here in this forum, I believe.

I obviously can't respond to this very well since I am not familiar with the rules for the medical world and I don't want to get started on a health care debate here. LOL