Anyone ever had a student like this?

[virtuoso80]

I think I might have posted about a particular student of mine before, but he's unique enough that I want to try again and see if I can find some people with similar experiences:

I have a student that is talks constantly while he plays. Not about piano, but about whatever is on his mind (usually video games, TV shows, or youtube videos). But he's playing piano the whole time. He will often also look at you while he's talking as well, and yet his fingers are still going, like they're on automatic! He also has a VERY short attention span, and it's basically impossible to force him concentrate on something if his mind doesn't want to, and yet he seems to be able to play piano without really concentrating on it. As I've learned, you can tell him as many times as you want times to try and not do it, but he can't help it.

From the moment I come through the door, he's off asking me his latest unanswerable question about the video game Skyrim, even though I've told him several times that I've never played it. For example: "Mr. ****, in Skyrim, there this part where you meet a innkeeper, and he says, 'you'd best be getting a move on'. Why would he say that if he's an innkeeper? That doesn't make any sense!" - and although that quote makes him sound very young, he's actually 15  years old now. Questions like that will continue unabated for the whole lesson, and are the primary source of interest for him (I have to remind him to keep playing piano while he talks). His father jokes that I'm like his bartender, and that he just lays all his problems/queries on me for 30min. 

I don't know what his diagnosis is: He's very polite and friendly, loves talking to you, is reasonably smart, and an OK school student - although as I said concentrating on work is quite hard for him. Maybe some kind of Asburger's-type syndrome, but I'm not sure. Although it's frustrating, he's one of my favorite students. I've taught him for years, with honestly rather slow progress (his parents make it clear that piano practice is low priority). I've taught kids with autism, and developmental issues, but I've never met anyone quite like him. Anyone have any similar experience?

[mcdiddy1]

I never had a students like that.

Have you tried redirecting to something music related such as counting while he plays, saying notes names...etc or does he ignore you completely? Maybe you can agree to talk to him for five minutes if he stays focus for majority of the lesson. 

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Haha lol I'm just like him!  I always talk to my teacher about my English Language complaints, and I hate concentrating on works that I don't like too!  For instance, I HATE Bach, so I've been assigned this extra small, itty bitty prelude and fugue, and I've been practicing it for like three months now, and I'm getting so mad!

However, when I get to something by Scriabin or Rachmaninoff, I don't eat, sleep, take a shower, brush my teeth, or use the toilet because I'm in the zone!  Like AutoZone!  No breaks, no intermission, no time outs, no half time, no rest, until I finish learning their music!  I rape their music until it's dead!!!  

And I can't talk while playing at the same time, it's quite difficult.  We're pretty similar, and I don't have autism, so I don't think he has autism either.


But unfortunately, I can imagine my new teacher is gonna be really strict with me so I have to get my act straight.

[ajspiano]

I rape their music until it's dead!!!

..that's beautiful, and shows a clear understanding as well as tactful use of the word 'rape'.

[rachmaninoff_forever]

..that's beautiful, and shows a clear understanding as well as tactful use of the word 'rape'.

You know I was joking right?  And happy 1,000th post! 

[j_menz]

I HATE Bach, so I've been assigned this extra small, itty bitty prelude and fugue, and I've been practicing it for like three months now, and I'm getting so mad!

I think you just hate that you can't play him. I hope your new teacher gives you lots of Bach. It will do you no end of good. 

I don't eat, sleep, take a shower, brush my teeth, or use the toilet

Yikes! You must be a real joy to be near.

But unfortunately, I can imagine my new teacher is gonna be really strict with me so I have to get my act straight.

LOL, serves you right. I'm liking him more and more. 


-----------------------------------------------------------------------
How was Stephen Hough, incidentally?

[ajspiano]

You know I was joking right?  And happy 1,000th post! 

Thanks!

Yes I know you were joking..

I made a joke like that too once, turned out the person had been raped.

[rachmaninoff_forever]

How was Stephen Hough, incidentally?

There was less coughing, but there was this one person who was coughing the WHOOOOOLLLLE TIIIIIIIIMMMMMEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!  The Beethoven moonlight sonata was destroyed!  And then during Liszt's B minor sonata, someone's phone went off!  What the heck?!  Are you kidding me!  And it wasn't like it went off, and was silent after like a second.  It  kept ringing!!!  And then after he silenced it, he had the nerve to apologize while he was playing!@!@!#!$!!$!#$5#^#!~!#~!#  But as you can see from my calm typing, I kept my cool about it, and I didn't really think it was a big deal.  Just....  Be the bigger man...

The first movement of the moonlight sonata was soo weird!  Like...  It was just weird!  He played it like...  Agh!  It was just weird...

This was my first time hearing a Scriabin sonata in real life, and it was pretty, preetty, prettttyyy good.  People don't always listen to Scriabins 5th sonata, but when they do, they should stare at the sun.

I asked my sister how she liked his own sonata, and she said that she didn't like it because it sounded, broken, and in complete.  I was like 'WHAT?!!?!!, it's supposed to be like that, it's called broken branches!  It's about broken branches, so it's supposed to sound like that!'.  It was my first time listening to it, and it's soooooooooooooooooooooo beautiful!  You should try and find a recording of it!

AND THEN, he played Liszt's B minor sonata!  I haven't listened to it before and it's prettty, preeetttty, preeeeeettttttttttttttty cool!

Since you're a professional pianist, you probably know how difficult it is.
SO, how difficult is Liszt's B minor sonata compared to Liszt's Hungarian Rhapsody 2?

But yeah, I really enjoyed it.  This is my second concert, so I still don't know what's the normal, but I liked this better than Lang Lang.  I thought it was better playing, I had better seats, and there was no GIANT SCREEN that would distract you from the music.  my sister took me out for my birthday, and I really appreciate her.

[j_menz]

Glad you enjoyed. Sadly, the coughing/mobile/lolly unwrapping/talking is something you're gonna have to learn to live with/ignore.  I'll have a look for a recording of Broken Branches, since it comes now with your recommendation.

Don't understand what could be weird about the 1st of the moonlight, I'd have thought about everything that could (and most things that shouldn't) be done with it has been by now.

Since you're a professional pianist, you probably know how difficult it is.
SO, how difficult is Liszt's B minor sonata compared to Liszt's Hungarian Rhapsody 2?

I'm not a professional. A proud amateur, in the proper sense of the term.

HR2 is probably a little more technically difficult, but is basically just for fun and is musically relatively straightforward. The Sonata is hard on a lot of levels.  Neither should be approached lightly, though.

[lukediv]

i have one like the one you describe.

I just humour his conversations about pokemon for a minute. It's only a minute and he gets out what he wants to say and will then continue playing for another 10 mins until he brings up how awesome charizard is again haha.

So i would just chat to him about it for a minute then they might want to move on. when this doesnt work i get a bit more forceful and ask him if it can wait and he can tell me at the end of the lesson.

I find both these strategies work well and it makes it more fun because piano now also includes charizard so i think he likes it more.

Hope that helps.

[cmg]

There was less coughing, but there was this one person who was coughing the WHOOOOOLLLLE TIIIIIIIIMMMMMEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!  The Beethoven moonlight sonata was destroyed!  And then during Liszt's B minor sonata, someone's phone went off!  What the heck?!  Are you kidding me!  And it wasn't like it went off, and was silent after like a second.  It  kept ringing!!!  And then after he silenced it, he had the nerve to apologize while he was playing!@!@!#!$!!$!#$5#^#!~!#~!#  But as you can see from my calm typing, I kept my cool about it, and I didn't really think it was a big deal.  Just....  Be the bigger man...

The first movement of the moonlight sonata was soo weird!  Like...  It was just weird!  He played it like...  Agh!  It was just weird...

This was my first time hearing a Scriabin sonata in real life, and it was pretty, preetty, prettttyyy good.  People don't always listen to Scriabins 5th sonata, but when they do, they should stare at the sun.

I asked my sister how she liked his own sonata, and she said that she didn't like it because it sounded, broken, and in complete.  I was like 'WHAT?!!?!!, it's supposed to be like that, it's called broken branches!  It's about broken branches, so it's supposed to sound like that!'.  It was my first time listening to it, and it's soooooooooooooooooooooo beautiful!  You should try and find a recording of it!

AND THEN, he played Liszt's B minor sonata!  I haven't listened to it before and it's prettty, preeetttty, preeeeeettttttttttttttty cool!

Since you're a professional pianist, you probably know how difficult it is.
SO, how difficult is Liszt's B minor sonata compared to Liszt's Hungarian Rhapsody 2?

But yeah, I really enjoyed it.  This is my second concert, so I still don't know what's the normal, but I liked this better than Lang Lang.  I thought it was better playing, I had better seats, and there was no GIANT SCREEN that would distract you from the music.  my sister took me out for my birthday, and I really appreciate her.

HAHAHAHA!!!  This may be the best damned music review I've ever read!!!  Plus, it's hysterical.    Count me as one of your biggest fans, rach.

You really should send Hough a link to this review on his website.  He actually responds.  I bet he'd howl his head off over this!

[rachmaninoff_forever]

 Count me as one of your biggest fans, rach.

First step towards world domination...

What?

Oh, nothing!

[gearmenta]

Definitely had a student like that. Although I talk to her about what she wants. She seems to be interested in the music when it gets to a point close to the time to perform.

[asuhayda]

Hey!

Haha.. that's funny.  I've never had a student that's quite like that, but I've heard of other people who have.  They've usually told me that they just let them do their thing.  It's almost as if they need to have multiple things to concentrate on at the same time.  If you give them a singular focus, they fall apart.  Maybe the student will grow out of it eventually.. sounds like he is still pretty young.

I applaud your patience with this student.  That's gotta be a struggle (albeit an amusing one!)

[lostinidlewonder]

He will often also look at you while he's talking as well..... Maybe some kind of Asburger's-type syndrome, but I'm not sure.

It is difficult for us to say what it is just by reading your story but I have had experience teaching students with Aspergers. If he is looking at you while talking he is probably not Autistic, since they usually have great difficulty looking at a persons face because they do not understand how to interpret it.

You should direct his attention by asking questions that focus his attention and talk on topics relevant to the lesson. Always talk in terms of the students interest, for example if he likes Skyrim then ask him is there any parts in the game which he couldn't get past or a part where he had to train very hard to set himself up for success, also encourage him to elaborate on how wonderful it  felt to finally win etc. Then offer this same challenge in the music, try to connect the two.

It is most important to maintain a friendly relationship with your student, it seems he freely talk to you about anything but I would wonder if it is insecurity or a real passion to want to talk with you. Some people talk a lot because they are insecure, they might feel if they say nothing the other person might think negatively upon them. Everyone has their own personality but everyone also needs to improve upon themselves, so I would actively seek out how to improve his attention and an ability to listen and how to have internal conversations within his own minds eye without having to verbalize everything.

If he is enjoying the lessons that is most important, as a teacher we want them to progress fast but often we cannot change the rate of their learning if they themselves do not make changes. Let students do things differently, not everyone has to do things the same way, but always encourage change and improvement, no one should feel satisfied that how they do it is the best way and never has to change. Good luck!

[sclive]

I have had a student like this before. Few ideas: segment the lesson time with part dedicated to "sharing", and the rest to piano; another idea - have a jar of suckers or jawbreakers and let him enjoy while he plays and keep his mouth busy too; talk the parents into a longer lesson so you can let him share but also do some music - heck it's cheaper than a therapist; change around the lighting in your studio and see if that soothes him - some kinds of kids get stimulated and amped up when the lights are too bright. 
My particular student just had a hard time slowing down his mind because he was very bright, and he played like you described your student - just finger aerobics. I suggested doing a few minutes of Meditation every day, to help him learn to relax and control his thoughts and slow down a little. 

[mistresstogould]

I don't know what his diagnosis is: He's very polite and friendly, loves talking to you, is reasonably smart, and an OK school student - although as I said concentrating on work is quite hard for him. Maybe some kind of Asburger's-type syndrome, but I'm not sure. Although it's frustrating, he's one of my favorite students. I've taught him for years, with honestly rather slow progress (his parents make it clear that piano practice is low priority). I've taught kids with autism, and developmental issues, but I've never met anyone quite like him. Anyone have any similar experience?

I am teaching a student today who is like this. He is a 9-year-old boy and he drives me nuts. He does not play while he is talking, but he will try playing with his feet or play forte so loud he could break the piano strings -- he just goofs off the whole time and does a goofy version of all my requests. I am not sure how he gets away with this type of behavior and why the parents cannot control them enough to make them behave during their lessons. I am always a relatively young teacher: I am 28 and I look even younger. I also dress stylish and youthful, so I believe that may interfere, as most young students might see more as a cool friend than a teacher. On the contrary, though, I am a serious teacher who takes music seriously. I joke around with the students, occasionally, to appease them; but then I snap back to being serious. I attempt to make them listen by spouting some philosophy about music and life and they do hear this, though it takes a few times repeating it for it to digest. I know another teacher who is even younger then me who simply boots the child out of the studio until they are ready to pay attention. I wish I could this, but I am a travelling teacher, so I cannot boot them out of their own piano room.

Stephaine

[talby]

Might the student have what´s called Attention deficit-hyperactivity disorder (ADHD)?
I heard that they can be brilliant in doing one thing (i.e playing piano), while not being able to concentrate well on other things and often are easily distracted and quickly care also for everything else around. I have seen kids with ADHD, and at least would take it as a possibility into account, after reading what you described.
ADHD also exists without the hyperactivity part, but is then still called the same.
You will quickly find in the internet information on it, and after reading a little bit on it maybe see if it is relevant to speak back with his parents about it or not.