New here....

[thepianoking]

Let me start off by giving you guys some background, I have had lessons before when I was younger.  Did not stick with the piano though, I have no idea why, my sister has been trying to teach me some but she's away at college so I can't get the real learning experience.  I don't want to take lessons, and Im 16 so still relatively young to learn an instrument.  Reason for learning is my favorite artist, Ben Folds.  Everytime I hear him play I just want to stop what I'm doing and start learning the piano.  I want it as a skill in life.  Can anyone give me advice on where I can start to learn?  Also, anyone here a ben folds fan?  New album finally coming out this year...

[zezhyrule]

I don't want to take lessons

Well. There's your problem.

On the other hand I've never heard of this Ben Folds fellow so...

[thepianoking]

No efficient way of learning online or something?  I have plenty of time, got my whole highschool years ahead of me. 

And if you have never heard of ben folds, you have not listened to the best yet.

[ajspiano]

No efficient way of learning online or something?  I have plenty of time, got my whole highschool years ahead of me. 

And if you have never heard of ben folds, you have not listened to the best yet.

No offence intended (though I'm sure it will cause some, ha.) - Your 16, you likely have no idea what the best of anything is.

Ben folds is good in his genre though, I've had a DVD of him with orchestra since I was about your age which I still listen to occasionally.

...

No, there is no truly effective way to learn piano online - piano is complex, your challenges will be unique to you, and the most effective way to get past them is to discuss them with someone in person who can give you advice tailored directly to your own issues. This is a field where people who have good teachers still take decades to master the skills required.

Further, you will learn physical flaws if you do not have someone observing you, that will go unchecked for a REALLY long time and you will ultimately have to relearn things that have become extremely well engrained into you. Imagine trying to re-learn how to walk from scratch without reverting to the way you currently walk.

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That said, there are some great references if you are going to go it alone. Search the forum, browse for posts by experienced members on topics like "how to practice" for example. Look for  Chang - fundamentals of piano practice (this one is free online).

[thepianoking]

Of course Folds isn't the greatest artist ever, and I do take offense to that.  haha

I have been learning from a youtube channel for the past couple of weeks, seems fine and all.  But I do not want a teacher. 

[ajspiano]

It's ok, I now detest adults who think they know everything just as much as I did as a 16 yr old. I didn't mean to suggest that I know better than you do in regard to the "best artist ever"

In regard to the piano lessons idea I probably do though, I'm some one whos learnt piano with a teacher (as a kid) and without (now) - and teaches piano - consistently over more years that you've been alive..

Having not seen you personally I'm also unaware of what you are cabaple of learning by yourself - and there are some people that can go a really long way without a teacher. But, those people would learn faster and learn more with a good teacher. Not wanting lessons is a dumb approach to efficient learning. Aside from that, most people don't fall into the "fine on their own category" - rather the majority fall into the "will get frustrated and give up" category when you eventually try to do something difficult. You will likely be able to play, but if you get to be able to play well without any lessons you will have been exceptionally lucky.

There are of course valid reasons for not wanting one, maybe you can't afford it or there isn't a suitable teacher near by (real issue for you since your going to need good ear skills and a focus on popular music) - but if these are not your reasons then you are overlooking something that will accelerate your progress like your in a drag racer.

[thepianoking]

Well it's not that I can't afford a teacher, I can't think of the right word for why I don't want one though.  I have asked a relative before, and she said that once you learn sheet music you can really teach yourself to play.  All it takes is practice, how true is that though?  My sister comes home every once in awhile from college on break ect...  When she does I get some help from her, which I think is really all I need.  I could be too lazy to go find a teacher I don't know, but I do want to learn piano and I have the dedication to practice.  No hard feelings on the other thing I knew you were joking, haha.

[thepianoking]

Also, how much will this site help me?  Reason I joined was to get advice from people who actually play.  (Not the best username I could have chosen) 

[ajspiano]

It just depends on how far you intend to go..

If you just want to be able to play Ben Folds covers and that's all for you're entire pianistic life - though you'd still do better with a teacher it won't be problematic if you go it alone..

If on the other hand you'd like to one day be able to do this..

(pick it up around 0:28 and you'll understand)

...having a teacher is not optional, and the sooner the better.

Also, how much will this site help me?  Reason I joined was to get advice from people who actually play.  (Not the best username I could have chosen)

Plenty, you'll have to dig around though.

[thepianoking]

I don't need to be that good, like you said though.  I mostly intend to play Ben Folds covers, as much as you stressed it is important to have a teacher.  I think I will start off with just learning from videos, if it gives me a hard time, and I'm really not progressing with anything I will be forced to get a teacher.  Thanks for the info, looking forward to learning some things from you guys.

Also, as I said before.  Is it true that if you learn to site read, you can really teach yourself most things.  As long as you practice?  What would be the first step in learning without a teacher? 

[j_menz]

Is it true that if you learn to site read, you can really teach yourself most things.  As long as you practice? 

It is possible, though there are a range of issues you will struggle with, and you may spend a lot of time up blind alleyways. It will take a lot longer (particularly early on).

I also doubt that you will be satisfied playing Ben Folds covers forever.  It's a worthwhile goal, but many of us started off with a certain level in mind only to become much more ambitious as we neared it.

[ajspiano]

My concern for you is that while right now, you are very keen to play songs from your favourite artist (which is a great thing) you will likely find that to be insufficient long term. I did the same thing, I learnt one of jamie cullum's albums by ear note for note as a teenager, didnt play anything else for months - but it gets old - suddenly I realised that I wanted to play really tough classical music instead of the pop/rock/punk/jazz I spend most of my teen years playing.

And ofcourse, you'll be better at ben folds if you have a good grounding than if you half do it.

The piano score (what you can read) just tells you the notes, and in some cases good fingering and interperative ideas (loud/soft etc.)..

It does not tell you how to physically and mentally execute it (there are very subtle variations that make significant differences), that part, if you practice enough, you can 'stumble' onto over a long time. Thats what talent is, the people who figure that stuff our on their own quickly. A teacher is needed to shorten that process and push you in the directions that will lead to you continuing to improve in those areas rather than stagnating. When you have weaknesses in these areas, you do not know about them, you're essentially blind folded - A person that can observe these things in person and point them out to you saves you the months it takes to figure out what it is exactly that is wrong to begin with.

[thepianoking]

Honestly, my goal is to learn something by ben folds before or on Senior Year.  (Grades in school are great, so have as much time as I need)  I have 3-4 years to make it, I'm positive it can be done, easily...  I think of this as a project, I'll start by learning the notes and moving that onto the piano ect...  Pianostreet is just when I have questions about anything really.  Again, thanks for the info and wish me luck.

Also, would going into a piano lab type class next year help at all?

[ajspiano]

Also, would going into a piano lab type class next year help at all?

I have no idea what that class would involve so cant really answer.

as far as ben folds, maybe try 'gracie' first - you'll have to take it slowly to begin with, but it has a pretty straight forward pattern that is repeated over and over and the rhythm is relatively simple. It will also teach you some basic chords, A D and E..  and F i think..  its been a long time.

Probably beyond you right now, but in time..  you'll probably end up with an aproximation of what he plays, but it will still sound pretty decent.

Gracie -

EDIT:
As a disclaimer - I'm not THAT familiar with his discography, there may be many better starting points.