Could someone explain metronome markings for me?

[buonarroti_the_golden]

Hey there. Quick question. I turn to you guys since this seems kind of insane and I can't quite figure it out.

I'm currently learning Scarlatti's sonata in D minor, L. 366 (k. 1). And I'm in a bit of a problem here.

See, I'm trying to get the piece up to tempo. The tempo marking's Allegro (I do get that, of course), BUT the metronome marking specifies that 1 quarter note : 112 bpm.

Now, I just did the calculations. 112 beats per minute is roughly 1.8 beats per second, which, when you consider most of the piece is written in sixteenth notes, is roughly around 4 notes per half a second.

How do you even play that? And even assuming you have the technique to play 4 notes per half-second, how is that remotely "Allegro"?

I must be doing something wrong, or misunderstanding what this is about. Care to enlighten me?

[johnmar78]

Hey there, relax man, not the end of the wrold.
At 112bpm, means every beat you play 4 X1/16 notes, is not that bad really. Think about when you do grade 8 scale exams, you need to do at 120, 4X1/16 notes per beat just a slight faster.  I hope this clears up your confusion.


ps. at 60bpm = 1 sec per beat since its 60sec in a minute. so at 112 is almost double the speed(think about 120 ) so you are actually playing approx 4 notes per 1/2 sec that is well above 112bpm.

[buonarroti_the_golden]

Wait, wait, wait.

Wait. o_O

ps. at 60bpm = 1 sec per beat since its 60sec in a minute. so at 112 is almost double the speed(think about 120 ) so you are actually playing approx 4 notes per 1/2 sec that is well above 112bpm.

So 4 notes per half a second is well above 112 bpm? See, this is where I think I'm misunderstanding something big.

As I understand it, at 4/4, m.m 60 bpm, and doing the initial motif formed by sixteenth notes, I'd be playing four notes per beat. That is to say, four notes per second.

But if we up the m.m to 112 bpm, and repeat that same motif, I'd still be playing four notes per beat, but each beat would be almost half as short. That is to say, each beat would be around half a second. So I'd be playing four sixteenth notes in .5 secs.

My question is, is this right? And if so, how do I do it? When I set the metronome to 112 bpm it ticks so fast I can barely follow it with my mind, never mind play four notes per click.

(If it helps: I am a complete ignoramus when it comes to the metronome. I'm only using it after being ripped apart by my old teacher (whose lessons I sadly can no longer afford) several times about how I tend to slow down in the hard parts and speed up in the easy ones.)

[p2u_]

When I set the metronome to 112 bpm it ticks so fast I can barely follow it with my mind, never mind play four notes per click.

The problem is in your not hearing the sounds correctly in your mind at MM. 112. The fingers cannot execute what you can't hear in your mind. You should forget the notes-per-second idea (it confuses you) and think of the heartbeat, the pulse, which is in this case always divided into 4, no matter how excited/exciting the music becomes. Solve that problem first, then start playing. Here are the instructions:

Let's say you can hear the division in your mind at MM. 60 [4 notes per second] TAK-ka-Ta-ka, TAK-ka-Ta-ka, TAK etc.

Now set the metronome to MM.75 [strictly speaking 5 notes per second, but that does not concern us]. If you hear the "melody" of the division in 4 (TAK-ka-Ta-ka TAK-ka-Ta-ka TAK etc) without stressing out, then set it to MM. 90 [6 notes per second]. If you don't, go back to MM. 60, and "refresh" the sound image until you can hear it at MM.75.

Then to MM. 105 [7 notes per second], then 120 [8 notes per second], then 135 [9], then 150 [10], then 165 [11] then 180 [12], etc. The actual speed (or better: the heart beat, the pulse) increases, but the "melody" (4 on the beat - TAK-ka-Ta-ka, TAK-ka-Ta-ka, TAK etc.) stays the same.

If you trained yourself correctly, you will realize that MM. 112 is not so fast at all, especially since it's usually divided over several fingers, so the speed per second per finger is not huge.

Paul

[nystul]

Your math is fine.  Music is just fast like that.  I know when I was a kid I played everything about half the speed it is supposed to be and it was hard to get past that.

[johnmar78]

Wait, wait, wait.

Wait. o_O

So 4 notes per half a second is well above 112 bpm? See, this is where I think I'm misunderstanding something big. if it were 120bpm, it would be exact 4 X1/16 notes per click/beat.
As I understand it, at 4/4, m.m 60 bpm, and doing the initial motif formed by sixteenth notes, I'd be playing four notes per beat. That is to say, four notes per second. correct 4X1/16 notes.

But if we up the m.m to 112 bpm, and repeat that same motif, I'd still be playing four notes per beat, but each beat would be almost half as short. That is to say, each beat would be around half a second. So I'd be playing four sixteenth notes in .5 secs. Yes, you are perfect.

My question is, is this right? And if so, how do I do it? When I set the metronome to 112 bpm it ticks so fast I can barely follow it with my mind, never mind play four notes per click.
Your brain need to think fast before playing with teh beat, if not, you NEED TO SLOW DOWN untill your brian can count 4 notes per clap-hand clapping =beat. I hope this helps.

(If it helps: I am a complete ignoramus when it comes to the metronome. I'm only using it after being ripped apart by my old teacher (whose lessons I sadly can no longer afford) several times about how I tend to slow down in the hard parts and speed up in the easy ones.)