Liebestraum help!

[reesabp]

Hi guys,

I am playing Liebestraum, but I cannot play the section in bars 41-49 with the leaps to save my life.  Can anyone give me some tips to learn this.  Also, is there any way to play the arpeggios in the Left hand or the cadenzas any easier?  Lastly, what edition do you all think has the best fingering for this piece?

Thanks,
reesabp

[j_menz]

I assume you mean number 3.  You should specify.

From the questions you are asking, it appears yo may well not be ready to play this. So the answer to your "how do I...." question is to learn some other pieces that give you the proper foundations to tackle those elements here.

Perhaps you could give some examples of what else you have played.

Also, I'm assuming you don't currently have a teacher. Clarification of this would be appreciated.

[reesabp]

I do have a private teacher.  I have played Fantasie-Impromptu, Mozart K 284, Arabesque, an etude, etc.  I am ready for the piece.  I can play the leaps at a lower tempo, I was just wondering if anyone had some tips on how to practice the leaps so I don't miss notes during performance

[reesabp]

...and yes, I do mean liebestraum 3

[j_menz]

It's probably best to discuss fingering, the arps and the cadenzas with your teacher. You really should be able to adapt any fingering to suit your own hands or come up with your own by this stage.


The leaps are something your teacgher can help with as well, but what I said elsewhere would equally be my suggestion in this context:

The leaps themselves are much easier if you don't think of them as leaps at all, just chords in different places. That may sound odd, but in my experience it can make a world of difference.  As an interim stage, make the leap from the top of the  bottom chord to the bottom of the top one.  Practice slowly so that you can 100% nail them every time - every inaccurate one is a set back, so don't be afraid to rweally slow it down.  Only once you are completely sure of them at that speed, then step it up a notch (JUST a notch). Repeat until you are at about 120% of the speed you ultimately want to play it all the while keeping that level of accuracy. After that they're easy. 

[pianist1976]

Lastly, what edition do you all think has the best fingering for this piece?

The classic Emil Von Sauer edition by Peters has nice fingerings and a redistribution of the second cadence for both hands. It can be found on the original Peters, Dover (Mephisto and other works...) and maybe on imslp.org.

[birba]

I'm just curious.  What does that little red vertical bar next to the post mean?

[pts1]

OK... here's the trick to that section as I see it.

First, what's important and what's not?

What is important is the melody, i.e. the octaves in the RH, and then the bass, the low octaves in the LH

The middle voices played in the middle of the keyboard are just harmonic filler.

So the the treble and bass octaves are forte and play the middle harmonic filler piano.

Just this change in thinking makes it much easier if you've been trying to play everything with equal import.

Then the "jumps" themselves.

For practice, slow down the pace and play the outer octaves... and then, very quickly position your hands over the arpeggiated inner notes... its a very quick slightly curved movement.

You can practice it without playing the notes, actually.

Then on the return trip to the outer voices, another very quick move.

The idea is that you eliminate the jump by arriving on the keys BEFORE you play with time to spare.

You don't want to play the keys just as you arrive since you'll in essence be "crash landing"

You want to get there BEFORE you have to play.

What I'm basically saying is move FASTER than you would to play it as a jump, and instead arrive at the key first THEN play it with assured accuracy since you're ALREADY ON THE KEY!

Its quite possible to do this and its much easier than jumping and landing on the note to play it as part of the jump. Its not: Jump ... Hit the key.... its Jump, prepare, play

Mostly this is a change in THINKING first

Don't think of jumps as jumps... but just a greater interval between keys.

Hope this helps.

[danhuyle]

Bar 41-43 - the chords fit perfectly under the fingertips regardless of hand size so play them as blocked chords. The melody notes are mainly G# and you only play A once.

Bar 47-49 - The melody notes are all the same G#. Same practice technique like bar 41-43.

Bar 44-46 - Self explanatory and nothing you can't do here. Memorize the left hand and have it at the back of your hand.

This particular passage is easy to play fast because everything falls into place. I've played this myself.


 

[lonelagranger]

What pts1 said.  Then practice, practice, practice.  It will come.

[brendan765]

Play around with octave jumps at the piano. For example think notes in your head and progressively keep making farther faster jumps... Your hands should bounceoff the keyboard like a trampoline, not lifted. If you can do eight notes at allegro tempo over 2 or three octaves you should be fine.

[yadeehoo]

From the questions you are asking, it appears yo may well not be ready to play this. So the answer to your "how do I...." question is to learn some other pieces that give you the proper foundations to tackle those elements here.

That's utterly mean and appropriate to say that. If one wants to learn this piece, may someone having tips give them, or get lost

[yadeehoo]

Hi and congrats for tackling that piece.

I'm learning that piece too, and these bars you mention have been an issue for me too. What made me overcoming hitting the wrong notes was intentionaly not looking at my right hand ( could work as well with the left, idk ) even if I had the time to, it builds inner confidence and touch. Of course practice practice is important, but only if you practice the way that's right for you.

Like some here say, this piece flows effortlessly with practice. So my tip would be :

Don't look at the hand that hit the wrong notes, close your eyes until you feel it, and your ratio of hitting right will improve

[liszt1022]

You're responding to a question asked a year and a half ago by someone who hasn't signed in to the forum in a year.